Hijacking faith: How an extremist Deobandi ideology rules the Barelvi major

[shuntmaster]

Okay lets move forward, is there anything else i can help you understand about the use of suffixes in Islam?

Thanks.. I'm still not clear why those terms are used in reference to only certain people.. Isn't it a form of idolatory?

 

[RescueRanger]

Thanks.. I'm still not clear why those terms are used in reference to only certain people.. Isn't it a form of idolatory?

No, i just explained what they mean and why we use them. Idolatry is worshiping an idol, or some physical entity like say a statue or portrait. This is nothing of the sort, it is a mark of respect, simple as that.

 

[shuntmaster]

No, i just explained what they mean and why we use them. Idolatry is worshiping an idol, or some physical entity like say a statue or portrait. This is nothing of the sort, it is a mark of respect, simple as that.

Idolatry is a pejorative term for the worship of an idol, a physical object such as a cult image, as a god, or practices believed to verge on worship, such as giving undue honour and regard to created forms other than God.

 

[RescueRanger]

Idolatry is a pejorative term for the worship of an idol, a physical object such as a cult image, as a god, or practices believed to verge on worship, such as giving undue honour and regard to created forms other than God.

Yes and these are forms of respect and do not share or aim to elevate the status of mortals or supernatural beings to that of God:

Two forms of Shirk in Islam are:
To associate anyone with Allah Taala as His part (to believe in more than one god).
To associate Allah's attributes with someone else. (Attributing, considering, or portraying God's knowledge or might to being those of anyone else)

None of the suffixes do anything of the sort and since in Islam portraits of the Prophets and Arc Angels are not permitted, you cannot "worship" anything, apart from the divine lord of the heavens and earth.

 

[Last Hope]

For me, Islam is the following:

Quran (Allah's words)
Prophet SAWS's sayings (hadiths) and his actions (Sunnah)

The five pillars of Islam, Quran and Hadith is everything.


I do not believe in man-made sects or labels, there is only a Muslim and Allah. Nothing comes between them. There is no third party and there shouldn't be any. I label all of this sects as complete BULLSHIT.

 

[shuntmaster]

Yes and these are forms of respect and do not share or aim to elevate the status of mortals or supernatural beings to that of God:

Two forms of Shirk in Islam are:
To associate anyone with Allah Taala as His part (to believe in more than one god).
To associate Allah's attributes with someone else. (Attributing, considering, or portraying God's knowledge or might to being those of anyone else)

None of the suffixes do anything of the sort and since in Islam portraits of the Prophets and Arc Angels are not permitted, you cannot "worship" anything, apart from the divine lord of the heavens and earth.

Aren't the names of people created forms too? Isn't putting the suffixes after the names honouring the names, which by definition is idolatory?
Is it allowed to affix the suffix RA after any departed persons name?

 

[KingMamba]

Aren't the names of people created forms too? Isn't putting the suffixes after the names honouring the names, which by definition is idolatory?
Is it allowed to affix the suffix RA after any departed persons name?

Yes it is allowed, now scurry along you troll.

@RescueRanger The problem is you were trying to answer the questions of somebody who thinks he already has all the answers. So what you tell him will never be sufficient.

In other words he is a troll.

 

[RescueRanger]

Aren't the names of people created forms too? Isn't putting the suffixes after the names honouring the names, which by definition is idolatory?
Is it allowed to affix the suffix RA after any departed persons name?

No, some cults/sects do add a suffix or prefix such as Hazrat to their spiritual leaders however that is a common malpractice and not condoned by mainstream Islam.

Only the prophets recorded in the Torah, Injeel (Testament) and Quran are allowed to be remembered with those particular words of praise. And how is it idolatry when you are not elevating their status to god, since the 1st Qalma of Islam is "There is only one GOD, and Muhammad is the messenger of God". There is no room to squeeze anyone else in there.

None!

Yes it is allowed, now scurry along you troll.

@RescueRanger The problem is you were trying to answer the questions of somebody who thinks he already has all the answers. So what you tell him will never be sufficient.

In other words he is a troll.

Thank you sir.

 

[Bratva]

For me, Islam is the following:

Quran (Allah's words)
Prophet SAWS's sayings (hadiths) and his actions (Sunnah)

The five pillars of Islam, Quran and Hadith is everything.


I do not believe in man-made sects or labels, there is only a Muslim and Allah. Nothing comes between them. There is no third party and there shouldn't be any. I label all of this sects as complete BULLSHIT.

And sect support their firqaah from Quran and Sunnah, so how you gonna beat that?

 

[Last Hope]

And sect support their firqaah from Quran and Sunnah, so how you gonna beat that?

Clearly there is nothing as 'Shia' or 'Sunni' written in Quran or any Sunnah. Every sect has different opinion, but if we focus on the pure basics, all of this can be wiped out. There were disputes in the Caliphates and Companions, this should be left to them. If they couldn't solve it, how can we do it after centuries?

The local imam at my mosque was openly calling for suicide attacks against Pakistan Army in Waziristan. He quoted a verse from Quran with a false translation, where he proved that Quran supports suicide attacks. The same guy says that he will give his mother, wife and sister to anyone rather than listen to something against the guy from Data Darbar. I don't see anything written of this sort in Quran.

This happened during Jummah khutbah. Lucky for him, or probably me, that my relatives sitting next to me held me down when I was going to stand and prove counter-argument. Is this Islam? Every mullah in Pakistan has their version of Islam. Is it really Islam?

I'd like to conclude this with this picture:

 

[muse]

Alternately, if we can have 4 scchools of law, why not 5?

 

[Leader]

Alternately, if we can have 4 scchools of law, why not 5?

reforming or reconstruction requires to rethink these 4 schools, discard them maybe, how come their "thoughts" became part of the faith or a permanent and absolute interpretation of the Rules/principles.

 

[Leader]

Alternately, if we can have 4 scchools of law, why not 5?

reforming or reconstruction requires to rethink these 4 schools, discard them maybe, how come their "thoughts" became part of the faith or a permanent and absolute interpretation of the Rules/principles.

 

[Zarvan]

reforming or reconstruction requires to rethink these 4 schools, discard them maybe, how come their "thoughts" became part of the faith or a permanent and absolute interpretation of the Rules/principles.

because no body has been able to reject them on the bases off Quran and sunnah

 

[Leader]

because no body has been able to reject them on the bases off Quran and sunnah

those who question are labelled Kafirs and fitnah gar and what not, threatened and killed as the institution of taqleed snubs reforms, the certain Islam ki thekedar class holds monopoly over interpretation and what to be made public, solely depend on the mullahs-in-command..