Hate Speech in a Secular State

[Agnostic_Indian]

^^^what ever

 

[jbond197]

Why are we discussing cows in a thread about an idiot MIM MLA ranting and abusing others? Are you folks providing this as a justification for the lose talks by Owaisis?

 

[Agnostic_Indian]

Why are we discussing cows in a thread about an idiot MIM MLA ranting and abusing others? Are you folks providing this as a justification for the lose talks by Owaisis?

sorry about that, please continue.

 

[SamantK]

Agree with you that the videos I posted may not seem dangerous but the effects have been quite dangerous. The question over here is not abt which speech is more dangerous. It is the hate speech which is dangerous and should be condemned at all cost who ever makes it. Justifying it is entirely wrong.

Who said we should not condemn hate speech on the whole, but then again who is making those hate speeches does matter.. If our PM says that Sikhs are being oppressed by hindus is it just another hate speech?

Also, no one is justifying anything here, with many in favour of justifying those video's ill show you more who will condemn the justification and I'm speaking of Hindus... If this kind of speech even remotely were given by some popular Hindu personality do you think a simple case would have been registered?

You started the comparison of Owaisi and others... If all of us were good enough to condemn, take legal action and go our way things would have been much better but as usual bs and comparisons are made only by the ones who want to make it a majority /minority issue..

Obviously he should have been more careful but he did it only to increase his popularity. His party works full time to show that they are the protectors of muslims and after the recent controversy of Bhagyalakshmi temple, they thought its the right time to expand their fangs.

Yes, still does not make it right and should serve as no justification for this hate speech...

 

[jbond197]

sorry about that, please continue.

There is no need for you to be sorry about anything!

But tell me what is the difference between him or others who made communal speeches? Why are we at pain because he is a Muslim? Why should we see it as an attack on Muslims? As we all know, there are bad apples in every community and exposing them should not be seen as targeting every one.

You are a good person, do you think anyone will come and say things to you for no reason? Only such people who have nothing but hatred in their hearts/minds are hated..

 

[rubyjackass]

I dont get your point. So is condemning just islamic terrorism and turning a blind eye to the alleged saffron fundamentalism a good thing, as those people are also attacking one half of bigotry..warewah logic if you ask me.

What a strawman argument!!

When did you go and ask Barkha Dutt's opinion on Akbaruddin's comment? If someone asks her, she will surely condemn his statements. Do you disagree?

Because a newswoman pursued one bigot, you cannot accuse her of not pursuing another. Just like you cannot accuse a journalist covering a crime of not covering others.

And as I said, you chose a bad example.
Barkha Dutt is a known Congress poodle. But that does not make what she says as automatically false. At least she is not going to become India's PM.

 

[KS]

When did you go and ask Barkha Dutt's opinion on Akbaruddin's comment? If someone asks her, she will surely condemn his statements. Do you disagree?

Because a newswoman pursued one bigot, you cannot accuse her of not pursuing another. Just like you cannot accuse a journalist covering a crime of not covering others.

And as I said, you chose a bad example.
Barkha Dutt is a known Congress poodle. But that does not make what she says as automatically false. At least she is not going to become India's PM.

As if all her other opinions were given after people asked for it..I dont even know what you are arguing for. That NDTV or IBNLive is not a main stream media channel ? That its hypocrisy on many issues like this one arent real..what's the issue bro ?

 

[jbond197]

As if all her other opinions were given after people asked for it..I dont even know what you are arguing for.

Dude, media is highly politicized everywhere. There are some congress only media channels who will not do a thing that can impact congress's vote bank just like you will never find a fox guy saying/doing anything that can impact republicans.. It's your mistake if you considered Barkha dutt and many like her to be fair/secular and expected her to be doing the job as a real journalist!!

 

[rubyjackass]

As if all her other opinions were given after people asked for it..I dont even know what you are arguing for.

I was saying:
Barkha Dutt is not responsible for you or your feelings. Still if you ask her about her opinion, I made a guess on what her response would be.

In any case, what do you want to achieve by making a list of all people who attacked RSS but did not attack Akbaruddin? I would simply say it is their choice. You can crucify them for their own faults but not for what they did not condemn on twitter.

 

[KS]

Dude, media is highly politicized everywhere. There are some congress only media channels who will not do a thing that can impact Congress's vote bank just like you will never find a Fox guy saying/doing anything that can impact republicans.. It's your mistake if you considered Barkha dutt and many like her as secular!!

Hardly..I dont consider her "secular" or "honest". But there are plenty out there who consider her as such..and also these are the vanguards of "secularism" in our media who would go on an outrage trip whenever some loony rightwinger utter something or even when Modi is winning in Gujarat about how the "idea of India" is threatened and how secularism is in danger.....I'm just pointing out the hypocrisy here.

In any case, what do you want to achieve by making a list of all people who attacked RSS but did not attack Akbaruddin? I would simply say it is their choice. You can crucify them for their own faults but not for what they did not condemn on twitter.

True, its perfectly her choice...in that case they should not pretend to be the door-keepers for secularism and liberalism in India and accept they are hindu-phobic (in the same vein as Islamophobia that they decry) hypocrites who will only look at one side of the coin while turning a blind to the other and stop being journalists as that profession itself required impartiality.. And stop taking the thread topic on a tangent with irrelevant arguments.

 

[tvsram1992]

Your government say you are 16 crore.

That retard has no idea of what he was speaking . He just tried to ensure that muslim vote back will be with him .

 

[indushek]

Firstly let me tell you I am not a supporter of Owaisi and stop indulging into name-calling. What he said was obviously demeaning and in bad taste? But matter of fact is Bhagyalakshmi temple never existed before 1950's. It only came into existence after and even then there were communal disturbances. And the rhetoric of Owaisi started after the Temple authorities tried illegal expansion of temple.

The Hindu : Cities / Hyderabad : Extension of temple illegal - ASI

And look how Togadia explicitly challenges the police and threatens to make this issue like Ayodhya where lakhs of people were mobilized to create communal disturbances and yet no criticism of him.

MIM Objects Bhagyalakshmi Temple Decoration - YouTube

And the rest of what he said abt other politicians, police and government is quite commonly said by others. Look what your fellow ideologue has to say abt father of the nation. He says that Mahatma Gandhi was a traitor to Hindus. Shouldn't he be put behind bars for insulting father of the nation.

maharaj dharmender ji ki speech at begum bazar hyd - YouTube

If you think Cow beef is not being exported then read the below article again.

Holy cow! India to be largest beef exporter - Mumbai - DNA

I very well understand Hindi but you seem to not understand Urdu which is very different than Hindi. If Togadiya or Muthalik never addressed my Prophet using any of the colorful terms then even Owaisi also did not mention the colourful attributes of Krishna which could very well be true.

"it took a while for the Hindus to get organized."

Oh yes they got organised from other states while initial good work was done by army.

"kill one hindu, then we will retaliate" --- Even the context where Owaisi spoke of violence was also in retaliation. So as said earlier instead of criticizing just one side and be lopsided criticize every instance of such hate speech instead of being choosy....

What do you mean by the bolded part?? are u trying to saying something about Krishna and what of his "colourful" attributes u speak of here?? Your subtle remarks are not that subtle Mister, if u think that what Owaisi said is not derogatory to the level of what u are trying to say about Krishna and so he is justified the i think you are even worst than him.

 

[indushek]

I was saying:
Barkha Dutt is not responsible for you or your feelings. Still if you ask her about her opinion, I made a guess on what her response would be.

In any case, what do you want to achieve by making a list of all people who attacked RSS but did not attack Akbaruddin? I would simply say it is their choice. You can crucify them for their own faults but not for what they did not condemn on twitter.

The question here is not just Barkha Dutt mate, how much hype do u see in the media on this particular news?? as for me i condemn whoever the moron is inciting hatred a hindu or a muslim. However the decibel of the "Hindu Extremist" or "Internet Hindu" rabble always seems Higher to the present one. Also it took those commenting some time to react while the reactions on above rabble was instantaneous, these are differences and argues why this difference both are equally condemnable by a Hindu or a Muslim or for that any religion.

 

[rubyjackass]

True, its perfectly her choice...in that case they should not pretend to be the door-keepers for secularism and liberalism in India and accept they are hindu-phobic (in the same vein as Islamophobia that they decry) hypocrites who will only look at one side of the coin while turning a blind to the other and stop being journalists as that profession itself required impartiality.. And stop taking the thread topic on a tangent with irrelevant arguments.

Do you realize what you are doing? You are making me defend Barkha Dutt.
I already gave you an example about journalism not needing your idea of 'partiality'. Many journalists have activist causes. Where is your evidence that Barkha Dutt is hinduphobic? Why is Barkha Dutt a hypocrite? Did she say Akbaruddin is a saint? How did you infer that she supports him? She is just not that audible on this matter, which she has every right to be. And yes, she can still claim she is fighting for secularism without contradicting herself.

We are still on topic. We are discussing about how media sees hate speech. Specifically you are crying foul on India media saying they are against Hindus(hinduphobic?!!). I am making a counter.

 

[Sashan]

The main stream media wants this issue to be buried as soon as possible..I dont know if you watch indian news channels..but considering the "outrage" there was on display on that Varun Gandhi speech, there has not been 1/100th of the same outrage on this matter..If not for Twitter, this matter would have been buried..but only the outrage on Twitter has forced them to even acknowledge that it was a hate speech..Barkha dutt who normally tweets on any issue of RSS ten times in a minute has not tweeted on Owaisi "sahab" for the last 10 days..Madam macaulayputri of Internet Hindus fame has not tweeted once on this issue.. So your expectation of them congratulating Hindu orgs is naive bro.

I don't watch Indian news channels but read the news in different sites and I am not naive - I know these are run by Burkha Dutts, Macaulayputris and other JNU types and I could see the hypocrisy when I had to search the site for this news and the Hindu was taking a potshot at both hindu organizations and Owaisi in their opinion section. And I see the similar trait expressed by members like Showstopper who can't discuss the issue at hand and want to bring in other organizations as well into the discussions(the same he did when the Mumbai riots and UP riots happened) . So my post was more of a rhetoric to show these how dignified the hindus and the orgs are with this incident.