Has KSA chosen a side?

[Jungibaaz]

Brother, all I will say before I exit this thread, is that Pindi is seriously upset with SMQ on the statement, and Raheel Shareef is on his way back. On the rest, could not agree with you more!

That is very understandable, and I fully agree with you. Kashmir isn’t something that the OIC will materially impact at all. Instead we’ve managed to publicly berate one of our closest allies. And that too we have no leverage on the Saudis, they back us every chance with loans, support even during sanctions, diplomatic support. They employ our expats and send remittances home etc.

 

[Dalit]

India is probably rejoicing with this news dont you think?

You think Pakistan gives a hoot? India was also rejoicing when Pakistan didn't join the Yemen war. Temples were going to be built irrespective of Pakistani view point. Medals were going to be handed out irrespective of Pakistani feelings. Kashmir was going to be thrown under the bus irrespective of Pakistani emotions. The Arabs didn't approach Pakistan before resorting to Indian appeasment. Good for them.

I am glad this is happening. It provides clarity.

 

[Dalit]

In the real world, the Economy matters, whether you go red, blue, or yellow in the face.

I'm out of your childish nonsensical thread. Enjoy your 0.02 seconds of fame on the internet

Your economy is worth zilch in comparison to Kashmir cause. I know that you would be willing to trade Kashmir for economy in a heartbeat. You have shown zero compassion for Kashmir. I am ashamed of you.

You think India has issues on the economy side of things? You can please India in a moment. Sit down and compromise on Kashmir like Nawaz Sharif was ready to do. India will spend billions in Pakistan in an overnight.

Don't be so naive. You don't trade your territorial integrity for economy. Economy comes and goes. Territory doesn't.

 

[PAKISTANFOREVER]

Apart from China and Turkey, ALL OTHER nations should be seen as nothing more than business partners as far as Pakistan is concerned.

The biggest problems facing Pakistan are corruption, weak institutions and the failure to peruse excellence in all fields. If and when we solve these problems, then there is no stopping what Pakistan can achieve.
This Saudi thing is just a sideshow.

With the Saudi defeat at the hands of the Yemenese militia imminent, it is somewhat good that Pakistan has distanced itself from them.

 

[PAKISTANFOREVER]

For those of you who are arguing that Pakistan should maintain good relations with the Saudis because of foreign remittances, you need to realise that those remittances will soon dry up as the Saudis are looking to get rid of foreigners and employ their own people:

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www....ls-employment-opportunities-a8187531.html?amp

 

[Dalit]

Apart from China and Turkey, ALL OTHER nations should be seen as nothing more than business partners as far as Pakistan is concerned.

The biggest problems facing Pakistan are corruption, weak institutions and the failure to peruse excellence in all fields. If and when we solve these problems, then there is no stopping what Pakistan can achieve.
This Saudi thing is just a sideshow.

With the Saudi defeat at the hands of the Yemenese militia imminent, it is somewhat good that Pakistan has distanced itself from them.

Let the Saudis play with fire. They will burn.

Pakistan has made its intentions crystal clear. The FM made it very clear that Saudi stance on Kashmir is treachery. We didn't mince any words. We gave them a befitting reply. I don't care what anyone here says. The state has spoken loudly. That is all that matters.

Now we are going to concentrate on the real deal i.e. CPEC and rapprochement with Iran. There will be zero compromise on Kashmir. Period.

 

[masterchief_mirza]

Brother, I've heard both that they called in the loan and that we returned it ourselves, not sure at this point which is the case. Given some time, I'll learn what the actual story was soon enough. Apologies if this is not of use to anyone at this time. It came much to the surprise of analysts and even the folks at the IMF.

But I think it's important to note that it is we who were not satisfied with the status quo and decided to shake things up a bit. This might be indicative of some rethinking and signalling in policy. In 2018, the Saudis gave us these deposits when were in dire need, financially they had nothing to gain, it was our need. And any talk about getting better deals or refinancing is incorrect. This was likely a political decision by us, but it's also possible that they may have requested. In 2018, IK went straight to Riyadh after becoming PM, there we arranged Saudi financial assistance. Since then, we have asked the Saudis to assist in talking with Trump, I believe IK even took MBS' private jet to NY, as well as arranging talks with Trump and direct contact through Jared Kushner. Saudis not too long ago also offered USD20bn in investments including oil refineries.

Since then relations have soured, our leadership unilaterally took on the mantle of bridging Iran-Saudi relations. I know IK meant well in this, but it wasn't well received in Riyadh. Most notably our closeness to Turkey and Malaysia, and the whole Kuala Lumpur conference debacle was another major indicator. And since then it's clear that our government has become very frustrated with the OIC (and by extension with the Saudi government). Their refusal to side with us on Kashmir doesn't bode well for our effort to raise int'l awareness of this cause.

So I think this statement from SMQ was calculated and likely backed by our PM. The return of Saudi deposits, are a little unclearer. But neither did SMQ slip up, and neither did we return the funds because we had better options, we don't plainly. One thing I can say categorically is that there is no financial benefit, or restructuring. Saudis used their deposits to prop up ours forex reserves when it looked like we were on the brink of sinking. It wasn't out of their financial interests, but ours. In order to make up the 1bn difference in reserves, whatever funds we get will have to be sovereign debt as per IMF conditions as opposed to SBP reserves that Saudis gave us.

This latest outburst/comments by SMQ I do not believe were off the cuff. Certainly at the very least some signalling comes from further up. Whatever else he is, he is a smart man, and FO neither redacted the claim nor even refused to comment, they said something else entirely.

Also, I briefly gave my humble thoughts on SMQ's earlier statements:

This is a balanced viewpoint certainly. However, the fact remains, it is in Pakistani interests to be rid of this "dependent" status towards GCC, whether Arabs support our position on Kashmir or not.

There are other less apparent stumbling blocks to this relationship anyway.

We're building a rival trade network to Dubai. We simply can't have one foot in the GCC (as their preferred non-GCC partner) and continue with CPEC at full steam - that would be rather naive.

Pay off the debts. Then revoke the "suzerainty" of the GCC properly, and become their economic rivals in the Persian Gulf. At the same time, support Turkey's peacekeeping endeavours wholeheartedly, improve cooperation with Qatar, and recognise Israel and trade wih them. This will strengthen Pakistan's independence, and the Arabs will have ZERO grounds to whine or complain - ZERO, since they merrily worked with Pakistan's existential enemy to further their ambitions.

It is naive bordering on immature to try and sustain this blind and eternal friendship with GCC when there's nothing more to be gained from each other for either of us.

The problem is every political party bar PTI won't even dream of such machinations.

 

[PAKISTANFOREVER]

Let the Saudis play with fire. They will burn.

Pakistan has made its intentions crystal clear. The FM made it very clear that Saudi stance on Kashmir is treachery. We didn't mince any words. We gave them a befitting reply. I don't care what anyone here says. The state has spoken loudly. That is all that matters.

Now we are going to concentrate on the real deal i.e. CPEC and rapprochement with Iran. There will be zero compromise on Kashmir. Period.

A nuclear weapons state that can neutralize a 7× bigger enemy nation that has the full backing of the West and Russia should not be concerned with a nation that is being battered and beaten black and blue by a few Yemenese militia men. That too despite having advanced American and Western weapons systems..............

 

[Super Falcon]

Time to leave ksa slavery

 

[waz]

A few things;

- Just be amicable, don't expect things from anyone, yes that includes the Saudis.
- Build yourself, so you can never be held to ransom by anyone.
- Act in cool but calculated way.

 

[Dalit]

A few things;

- Just be amicable, don't expect things from anyone, yes that includes the Saudis.
- Build yourself, so you can never be held to ransom by anyone.
- Act in cool but calculated way.

I will add one more:

- Don't compromise on Kashmir. Even if KSA tells you to.

 

[waz]

I will add one more:

- Don't compromise on Kashmir. Even if KSA tells you to.

There never should have been a compromise there, but how many past leaders have? It started in the late 50's....
At the end of the day the boat has not been missed, but don't sink at the same time. Call it social distancing between nations.

 

[Qmjd]

We often blame Iran for siding with India. Yet, Iran was the country which ditched Hindustan without a second thought. Be it for their own interests.

The Saudis which we often claim as our dearest ally backstabbed us on Kashmir as hard as it could. No two ways about it. Iran loudly and unapologetically supports Pakistan's Kashmir stance. You have to be blind to not see the difference.

Let's be unapologetic about another very important thing. Iran, Turkey, Pakistan, China, CAS and all other friendly nations around the world need to join hands and declare a union. A military and trade union that is unapologetic in its goals and objectives. Announce the union and its agenda on a megaphone.

man if every country choose his interest first then who will protect the innocent from evil.(understand it please: Kashmir is suffered due to this pandemic)

 

[Dalit]

man if every country choose his interest first then who will protect the innocent from evil.(understand it please: Kashmir is suffered due to this pandemic)

That doesn't absolve Iran or Pakistan from their own shortcomingsand mistakes, but at least we are finding good common ground.

 

[Dalit]

There never should have been a compromise there, but how many past leaders have? It started in the late 50's....
At the end of the day the boat has not been missed, but don't sink at the same time. Call it social distancing between nations.

It is not compromised. Imran Khan roasts India at every given opportunity. In front of the media, internationally and on every platform available. Our previous leaders were hardly examples of good principled leaders. They are not worth mentioning.

India is not used to so much onslaught from Pakistan. Pakistan has confronted India on Kashmir on almost every avenue. The Indians are going bananas for a reason. They want Nawaz Sharif back in power.