For Indian war planners, is the PAF their worst fear?

[MaXimMaRz]

1) Checked and rechecked. It is nick named as BARS.

2) They were deployed in Jodhpur.

3) Bars radar - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

1. NATO NAME

2. Jodhpur can be diversion runway, But Adampur night ADA was from Su-30, Go through your war time deployment or ORBAT or wat ever you call it

3. The Bars was originally an X-band Pulse-Doppler radar developed for the Su-27. In its original N011 form the radar used an electronically scanned slotted planar antenna but with the experience gained from the development of the N007 Zaslon and in an effort to improve performance the antenna design was changed to a multi-channel Passive electronically scanned array (PESA) resulting in the N011M Bars (Snow Leopard). The design of the N011M bars antenna like the earlier N007 antenna is comprised of two separate electronically controlled arrays, an X-band radar and a L-band transponder with a total weight of 100 kg and a diameter of 960 mm [1]. The radar has a peak power output of 7 kW [2] and is capable of positioning beams in 400 microseconds [1], a huge advantage over mechanically scanned radar. The Bars radar can be fixed in position to give a scanning sector of +/-70 degrees in azimuth and +/-45 degrees in elevation [3], the radar can also be mounted on electromechanical drives to improve scan coverage. The N011M supports digital signal processing using 3 processors with 16 MB of both static and flash memory [1].

In the air to air mode the N011M Bars offers a true look down, shoot down capability with a detection range of 140 km against a target with a Radar cross section (RCS) of 2 m2. Up to 15 air targets can be tracked at once in track-while-scan mode with 4 of these engaged at once [1]. The N011M can use a number of short range and speed search modes and is capable of identifying the type and number of multiple targets. The Bars radar is compatible with R-77 and R-27 radar guided missiles providing both illumination and data-link guidance as well as the R-73 IR guided missile [3].

In the air to surface mode the radar is capable of detecting ground and naval based moving targets, determining their location and maintaining a track on two surface targets at once [1]. The N011 is capable of detecting a tank sized target to a range maximum range of 50 km and a destroyer sized target to a range of 150 km [1]. Bars also features a mapping mode using either real beam, dopplar beam sharpening or Synthetic aperture radar with a maximum resolution of 10 meters [1]. The Kh-31 anti-radiation missile is also compatible with the radar ( MESA IS A what they call in plain words Active phased array radar)

Any Doppler radar in air has a Doppler notch
Read about it some times....dont just copy links

 

[MaXimMaRz]

And yeah never follow these rangs written on these sort of sites, it will get you killed. Follow practical ranges , Doctor recommend that these days

 

[satishkumarcsc]

1. NATO NAME

2. Jodhpur can be diversion runway, But Adampur night ADA was from Su-30, Go through your war time deployment or ORBAT or wat ever you call it

3. The Bars was originally an X-band Pulse-Doppler radar developed for the Su-27. In its original N011 form the radar used an electronically scanned slotted planar antenna but with the experience gained from the development of the N007 Zaslon and in an effort to improve performance the antenna design was changed to a multi-channel Passive electronically scanned array (PESA) resulting in the N011M Bars (Snow Leopard). The design of the N011M bars antenna like the earlier N007 antenna is comprised of two separate electronically controlled arrays, an X-band radar and a L-band transponder with a total weight of 100 kg and a diameter of 960 mm [1]. The radar has a peak power output of 7 kW [2] and is capable of positioning beams in 400 microseconds [1], a huge advantage over mechanically scanned radar. The Bars radar can be fixed in position to give a scanning sector of +/-70 degrees in azimuth and +/-45 degrees in elevation [3], the radar can also be mounted on electromechanical drives to improve scan coverage. The N011M supports digital signal processing using 3 processors with 16 MB of both static and flash memory [1].

In the air to air mode the N011M Bars offers a true look down, shoot down capability with a detection range of 140 km against a target with a Radar cross section (RCS) of 2 m2. Up to 15 air targets can be tracked at once in track-while-scan mode with 4 of these engaged at once [1]. The N011M can use a number of short range and speed search modes and is capable of identifying the type and number of multiple targets. The Bars radar is compatible with R-77 and R-27 radar guided missiles providing both illumination and data-link guidance as well as the R-73 IR guided missile [3].

In the air to surface mode the radar is capable of detecting ground and naval based moving targets, determining their location and maintaining a track on two surface targets at once [1]. The N011 is capable of detecting a tank sized target to a range maximum range of 50 km and a destroyer sized target to a range of 150 km [1]. Bars also features a mapping mode using either real beam, dopplar beam sharpening or Synthetic aperture radar with a maximum resolution of 10 meters [1]. The Kh-31 anti-radiation missile is also compatible with the radar ( MESA IS A what they call in plain words Active phased array radar)

Any Doppler radar in air has a Doppler notch
Read about it some times....dont just copy links

You have to read rest of the lines. The radar used in Su 30 MKI is N011M radar. It has an electronically steered planar array radar.

 

[satishkumarcsc]

And yeah never follow these rangs written on these sort of sites, it will get you killed. Follow practical ranges , Doctor recommend that these days

And I am a qualified Dentist......

 

[MaXimMaRz]

You have to read rest of the lines. The radar used in Su 30 MKI is N011M radar. It has an electronically steered planar array radar.


And I am a qualified Dentist......

Well Normally dentist are not concidered doctors in the among the circles

Thats why LET ME TELL YOu AN ACTIVE PHASED RADAR IS ONE THAT ELECTRONICALLY STEERS ITS ANTENNA, THIS ONE IS A DAME PuLSE DOPPLER TOOOOO OKKKKKKKKKAYYYYYYYYY !!!!!!!!!!

thats why its better to read before you copy paste anythings

Doctors advise, bite what you can chew, next time go through wikipida or google.....there are better sources call up some one there and ask him

 

[MaXimMaRz]

Dont you guys go through some basic EW course, I mean if not in the academy, at least as an officer

Doctors Advise " this time ask your CO to send you on a EW course "

 

[MaXimMaRz]

anyways its late, work hard , try reading about ECM , EM , ECCM ...ill sleep

dont get upset man, atleast you learned that it is a active phased array pulse doppler radar.....more tutions for you tomorrow
bye

 

[satishkumarcsc]

Ever heard of Passive electronically steered array radars?......The Zaslon and the Bars belong to this family.

 

[MaXimMaRz]

Ever heard of Passive electronically steered array radars?......The Zaslon and the Bars belong to this family.

yeah sure man...... thats a part of Tx , centralized controlling in the Tx module
thats why it can make so many beam forms...... tough luck i knew that , hahah dont take to heart bro

now if yo excuse me , ill sleep bye , have fun

Dont go for PESA or company names.....see whats the basics behind it , that way yo wont have to google around serching for names

 

[nitesh]

Let's step back. My question to Mr Malay was why is Brahmos II developed with the intention of using it against China. To which you gave the following arguement
"He is right in his saying. BrahMos II is basically a hypersonic version of the BrahMos the engine is already tested at mach 5.26 in labs. And as it is developed in India there is no restriction of MTCR. Hence it can have long range. Hope this clarifies."

Since there is no increase in range of Brahmos II, how does that answer the question on China?

How do you know there is no increase in range?

Well leaving the English part of it aside, and withdrawing my usage of the words "not yet successful", who brought Brahmos II into picture? Not me. But if someone has brought it, considering the Army version has just failed a test, and AF is no where near simulated testing, at least no where mentioned in the media, either as part of rumours or factual reporting, all I am asking is why are we speculating the future?

The recent reports for Army version is usccessful until unless you have some other sources to say contrary. Whlation for IAF version? domain-b.com : IAF Sukhoi-30MKI jets in Russia for BrahMos aerial version retrofit programme.

You started the speculation by calling successful/ unsuccessful. So onus is on you

But I did not mean it to be as simple as that. Any projected force that wages a war against a country in it's backyard always faces a grave yard situation. US with all it's might is having nightmares in Afganistan and Iraq. With thousands of soldiers lost, by, arguably, the most powerful country in the world and a victory no where in sight, I doubt I could use any lesser word.

Don't mix up the things, China and India war is not going to be like US and Afganistan comparing apple to oranges. Futile attempt

Then why do IAF and IN maintain a fleet of strategic bombers presently? In my opinion, against a war with China (which in current circumstances looks highly unlikely, it will boil down to a nuclear war. Besides a war with China, in my opinion, will involve aerial warfare much more than a war with any other neighbouring country because of the terrain involved.


Regards,
Anoop.

Stretgic bombers? IN has TU 142 which is ASW plane. In Vikramaditya there was mention of TU 22M3 bomber but no confirmation whether it exists or not (at least for me if you have some sources please help me). Apart from that which is "strategic bomber". Please enlighten.

 

[anoopsaxena76]

How do you know there is no increase in range?

You mentioned
"He is right in his saying. BrahMos II is basically a hypersonic version of the BrahMos the engine is already tested at mach 5.26 in labs. And as it is developed in India there is no restriction of MTCR. Hence it can have long range. Hope this clarifies."

You had mentioned there is a range increase. I humbly request you to provide the source for this news.

You started the speculation by calling successful/ unsuccessful. So onus is on you

1.) I had never used the word unsuccessful.
2.) I had withdrawn the usage of the word successful. So can we end this part of the discussion please?

Don't mix up the things, China and India war is not going to be like US and Afganistan comparing apple to oranges. Futile attempt

Whoever said it is going to be like the US and the Afganistan. That is infact the best case scenario. Indian Navy versus Chinese navy is going to be far worse for any navy that projects itself out of it's base. But obviously we disagree here, so let's end the discussion here on this without trying to get condescending about each other.

Stretgic bombers? IN has TU 142 which is ASW plane. In Vikramaditya there was mention of TU 22M3 bomber but no confirmation whether it exists or not (at least for me if you have some sources please help me). Apart from that which is "strategic bomber". Please enlighten.

Ummm Tu 95

 

[nitesh]

You mentioned
"He is right in his saying. BrahMos II is basically a hypersonic version of the BrahMos the engine is already tested at mach 5.26 in labs. And as it is developed in India there is no restriction of MTCR. Hence it can have long range. Hope this clarifies."

You had mentioned there is a range increase. I humbly request you to provide the source for this news.

I have provided the source which mentiones the engine is tested in India. So this time the engine will also be from India unlike last time when the engine is from Russia and seeker and source code is from india so it comes under MTCR. but once engine gets developed in India as India is not signatory of MTCR there is no restriction of range.

1.) I had never used the word unsuccessful.
2.) I had withdrawn the usage of the word successful. So can we end this part of the discussion please?

Ok leave it

Whoever said it is going to be like the US and the Afganistan. That is infact the best case scenario. Indian Navy versus Chinese navy is going to be far worse for any navy that projects itself out of it's base. But obviously we disagree here, so let's end the discussion here on this without trying to get condescending about each other.

There is no point disucssing this, let's leave it

Ummm Tu 95

?. No yaar I don't think so. Please help me with some link

 

[anoopsaxena76]

Didnt realize you wanted the answer from me! Nitesh posted the right answer so i didnt reply.

He is correct in his answer mate, what did you not understand?

Oh I did not understand many things. I did not understand why he brought MTCR into picture when it was never in the picture.
He talked about increase in range, and then went on to say it is a hypersonic cruise missile (which I agree is a fact) but the question was on the range. I haven't heard anywhere that Brahmos II has more range. Now he said it can have more range. So I request him or you now since you also mention in your post that it can have more range, to provide a source which supports this claim of increase in range.

There is an increase in range, which is what he wanted to imply when he said that since it is being developed in India, MTCR regulations dont come to play and the range can exceed the 300kms limit.

Requesting the source to support the claim that there is an increase in range.

Thus if the range of 300kms is exceeded then it automatically becomes a suitable weapon system to be employed against China. 300kms ranged BrahMos is only suitable for Pakistan, that is because Pakistan doesnt have depth.

I may agree with this hypothesis but again the source for range increase first.

It would be obvious that if the Su-30's have been sent to Russia to modify the plane and validate whether it can be used to fire the BrahMos, then simulation must have been conducted before sending the plane.

I beg to differ. I do not see it as an obvious thing. I do understand that there are reports that Army version has had simulations done with the new software. But I read none of the kind for the AF version. If it is obvious then it must have been reported that that simulations are done.

Regards,
Anoop

 

[Hasnain2009]

@ MaXimMaRz, plz dont use red color in your posts!!!

 

[anoopsaxena76]

I have provided the source which mentiones the engine is tested in India. So this time the engine will also be from India unlike last time when the engine is from Russia and seeker and source code is from india so it comes under MTCR. but once engine gets developed in India as India is not signatory of MTCR there is no restriction of range.

But where is the fact about increasing the range in "Brahmos II"? That is all I ask? Because the entire supposition that Brahmos II is for China was argued based on the fact that it will have an increased range. So just one question,

Are you saying Brahmos II in future (by whatever name it will be called, hopefully Brahmos III) will have more range?
or
Are you saying that Brahmos II has more range?

In either case, either the supposition to develop Brahmos II for China is wrong or you will have to provide the source for Brahmos II' increased range. (and not Brahmos III or any other Brahmos future version)

Regards,
Anoop.