F-7P and F-7PG

[Reichmarshal]

they will claim it was abhinandan's jet , went way off course.
Mig-21/F-7 are best used as point defence interceptors. No point in trying to upgrade them if they are nearing the end of their service life.
IAF thought it could keep 21s relevant by adding BVR capability , R-73,77 etc. Too many limitations in terms of fuel it can carry , small nose cone (small radar) the list goes on . why do they deploy Mig-21s in front line if they have 270+ Su-30s ?

iaf did not employ the mig 21 alone but was part of a high low package, where it formed the low part and the mki was high part and was to provide top cover to this package, But due to effective PAF jamming the mkis turned back while abhinadan didn't, guess being a senior officer.

This in theory is a very effective strategy if employed in unison.

 

[GriffinsRule]

I think

So if I understand you right, PAF can only provide post-launch guidance by the launching aircraft. What is the use of cooperative targeting then? Initial targeting data given my 3rd party but then launching fighter needs to light up the target until AAM goes active (pit-bull).

PAF is limited by what its missiles are capable of. Even if Saab Erieye could provide such targeting data, the missiles are not capable of receiving it.

AIM-120D (along with Meteor) is special because they actually have an effective range longer than that of fighter jets so in order to utilize it max potential, it can be launched by the aircraft from the targeting information provided by either other jets or an AWACS...and given the longer range of large radar, it can provide the missile with updates on targets at much greater ranges. Its effective range is somewhere between 75-100 miles, while most fighter aircraft with traditional radars can lock and target other jets shorter ranges than that (usually around 30-45 miles). To take full advantage of its range also, you would need fighters equipped with larger more powerful AESA radars as well then say what is on the B52 F-16s. The range is classified, but its said to have 50% more range than C7, which itself has longer range then C5 that PAF and many other countries fly.

There are more technologies in the AIM-120D not found in C7 or earlier versions outside of sheer range. It has better navigation using GPS-enhanced Inertial Measurement Unit (IMU) and most likely dual imaging infra-red and active radar seeker to find target in the terminal phase thus making it less prone to ECM/jamming and offering higher off-bore targeting capability and better countermeasures. It also has a two-way datalink (similar to Meteor) which also allows say an AWACS or another jet to retarget the missile towards a different enemy while it is already on its way. So basically, in a tactical scenario, you can shoot two missiles towards 4 jets formation and then the missiles get closer to their targets, the AWACS can assign which jet to go after but it would put all 4 enemy fighters on the defensive when the missiles go pitbull.

Finally, there is a System Improvement Program (SIP) initiated last year to improve all areas of the existing AIM-120D, including adding 50% more range to the missile!! So imagine that. It will roundabout have 3 times the range of the C5s PAF has in its inventory.

For fun... https://www.janes.com/defence-news/news-detail/usaf-claims-longest-air-to-air-kill-with-amraam

 

[Basel]

Lol yea. Proof paf didn't shoot down abhinandan. He crashed in czech rep.

F7s will be a good interceptor against say iaf jaguars and other CAS aircraft I guess.

Also iaf mig 21 are canon fodder. That's all they are now.

If PAF want to use F-7s to intercept IAF CAS or Strike package the 5th gen HOBS IR AAM with HMS is must have, as old Jaguars are upgraded and now have ASRAAM 50km range 5th gen IR AAM.

 

[Sinnerman108]

If PAF want to use F-7s to intercept IAF CAS or Strike package the 5th gen HOBS IR AAM with HMS is must have, as old Jaguars are upgraded and now have ASRAAM 50km range 5th gen IR AAM.

Jags are in service ?

 

[Basel]

Jags are in service ?

IAF Jags got DARIN upgrade package.

 

[Bossman]

IAF Jags got DARIN upgrade package.

The biggest issue with Jags is that they are grossly underpowered and IAF decided not to upgrade the engine.

 

[Basel]

The biggest issue with Jags is that they are grossly underpowered and IAF decided not to upgrade the engine.

Underpowered or not, but they have potent air to air capability due to AESA radar & ASRAAM with HMDS against our F-7s point defence fighters.

https://www.financialexpress.com/defence/with-upgraded-avionics-jaguar-still-lacks-the-thrust/1721036/

 

[Tornado23]

If PAF want to use F-7s to intercept IAF CAS or Strike package the 5th gen HOBS IR AAM with HMS is must have, as old Jaguars are upgraded and now have ASRAAM 50km range 5th gen IR AAM.

Good point. But the F7s will not be operating on their own.

 

[Basel]

Good point. But the F7s will not be operating on their own.

And you think Jags will not have cover of MKI, Mig-29 or Rafaels??

 

[Tornado23]

And you think Jags will not have cover of MKI, Mig-29 or Rafaels??

And if they have such cover then what would an upgraded f7pg do against such a package? Not even with the pl10 would they do much.

Same thing happened with the iaf and their miggy boi

 

[Basel]

And if they have such cover then what would an upgraded f7pg do against such a package? Not even with the pl10 would they do much.

Same thing happened with the iaf and their miggy boi

Dear, your post shows you dont have clue how air wars are fought, F-7s are point defense fighters which means they came into play when elements of enemy strike package manage to get through our front line fighter tier.

 

[Tornado23]

Dear, your post shows you dont have clue how air wars are fought, F-7s are point defense fighters which means they came into play when elements of enemy strike package manage to get through our front line fighter tier.

Perhaps, perhaps not.

I never said I was an expert on this matter.

What I did say was, wouldn't it be better to invest money in a newer aircraft rather than upgrading an old one which would have limited capabilities?

 

[Basel]

Perhaps, perhaps not.

I never said I was an expert on this matter.

What I did say was, wouldn't it be better to invest money in a newer aircraft rather than upgrading an old one which would have limited capabilities?

The problem is we dont have enough money which is why Mirages are still part of front line strike package of PAF and that is why they are very capable electronically.

 

[ghazi52]

F-7 PG

 

[syed_yusuf]

Pretty soon these fighters will be history in PAF