F-16 Block 15MLU/50/52 Fighter

[Skywalker]

Jesus christ is some one getting married what was that

hahahahah...Murad sb very rightly said, but there is one confusion only as Who is marrying who???

 

[BATMAN]

Jesus christ is some one getting married what was that

Yes, exactly, considering that those F-16's are dully paid for....
I think ceremony should have been internal and US air staff should have been invited to PAf's internal ceremony/dinner.
It seemed all was staged for the fat cheif guesst
I wonder if it is done in similar fashion in other states ?

 

[EagleEyes]

They are putting some makkhan(butter) on the fat cheif. So he keeps eating, and keep supplying us the F-16s. The PAF definitely has alot of makkhan in its kitchen.

 

[ejaz007]

Potential sale of AIDEWS pods to Pakistan

June 26, 2008 (by Asif Shamim) - The Defense Security Cooperation Agency (DSCA) notified Congress of a possible Foreign Military Sale to Pakistan of AN/ALQ-211(V)9 AIDEWS Pods as well as associated equipment and services on June 26th.

The principal contractor involved will be ITT Corporation of Clifton, New Jersey. The total value, if all options are exercised, could be as high as $75 million.

The Government of Pakistan has requested a possible sale of 21 AN/ALQ-211(V)9 Advanced Integrated Defensive Electronic Warfare Suite (AIDEWS) Pods, software and hardware support with repair and return, support equipment, technical assistance, and relevant technical documentation.

Pakistan intends to purchase the AIDEWS pods to enhance its existing F-16 fighter aircraft. This proposed sale will ensure Pakistan’s existing fleet is compatible with the new F-16 Block 50/52 aircraft and will allow the Pakistani Air Force (PAF) to modernize its fighter inventory, thereby enabling Pakistan to support both its own air defence needs and coalition operations.

Release of the AIDEWS equipment will neither affect the regional balance of power nor introduce better equipment which may be deemed superior to existing technology in the region.

Implementation of this proposed sale will require multiple trips to Pakistan involving U.S. Government employees and contractors for technical support, and program management over a period of up to 15 years.

Potential sale of AIDEWS pods to Pakistan

 

[fatman17]

Defense Security Cooperation Agency

On the web: DSCA Home Media/Public Contact: (703) 601-3859
Transmittal No. 08-54
Pakistan - AN/ALQ-211(V)9 AIDEWS Pods

WASHINGTON, June 26, 2008 – The Defense Security Cooperation Agency notified Congress of a possible Foreign Military Sale to Pakistan of AN/ALQ-211(V)9 AIDEWS Pods as well as associated equipment and services. The total value, if all options are exercised, could be as high as $75 million.
The Government of Pakistan has requested a possible sale of 21 AN/ALQ-211(V)9 Advanced Integrated Defensive Electronic Warfare Suite (AIDEWS) Pods, software support, repair and return, spare and repair parts, support equipment, technical assistance, publications and technical documentation, U.S. Government and contractor technical and logistics personnel services, and other related elements of program support. The estimated cost is $75 million.
Given its geo-strategic location and partnership in the Global War on Terrorism (GWOT), Pakistan is a vital ally of the United States, as reflected in the June 2004 designation of Pakistan as a Major Non-North Atlantic Treaty Organization Ally. This proposed sale will contribute to the foreign policy and national security of the United States by helping an ally meet its legitimate defense requirements.
Pakistan intends to purchase the AIDEWS pods to enhance its existing F-16 fighter aircraft. This proposed sale will ensure Pakistan’s existing fleet is compatible with the new F-16 Block 50/52 aircraft.
Consistent with U.S. conventional arms transfer policy and arms control initiatives, this potential sale will allow the Pakistani Air Force to modernize its fighter inventory, thereby enabling Pakistan to support both its own air defense needs and coalition operations.
Release of the AIDEWS equipment to Pakistan will neither affect the regional balance of power nor introduce a new technology as this level of capability or higher already exists in other countries in the region.
The principal contractor will be ITT Corporation of Clifton, New Jersey. There are no known offset agreements in connection with this proposed sale.
Implementation of this proposed sale will require multiple trips to Pakistan involving U.S. Government and contractor representatives for technical reviews, support, and program management over a period of up to 15 years.
There will be no adverse impact on U.S. defense readiness as a result of this proposed sale.
Implementation of this proposed sale will not require the assignment of any additional U.S. Government representatives or contractor representatives to Turkey.

There will be no adverse impact on U.S. defense readiness as a result of this proposed sale.
This notice of a potential sale is required by law; it does not mean that the sale has been concluded.

does this mean that MLU will also take place in turkey?

 

[JK!]

does this mean that MLU will also take place in turkey?

Due to Turkish experience with F16s such as licence manufacture I believe that some contracts for the Pakistani MLU were given to them though I can't recall which ones or where I saw this I'll have a check for you.

 

[Myth_buster_1]

someone please try to get hold of Asif Shamim from f-16.net he can be helpful in pakdef.

here is a ACM remarks regarding PAF F-16 MLU.
On the renovation and overhaul of the existing fleet of F-16 aircraft, the PAF chief said under the Mid-Life Upgrade (MLU) Program six aircraft of PAF would be overhauled in the US while PAF’s technicians would also be given training. "We will make every effort to acquire technical know how ultimately enabling us to undertake overhauls and upgrades of the aircraft indigenously," he said.

 

[shehbazi2001]

The Source codes are computer programs used to operate and control the automatic systems. Whenever a system is controlled by computer or microprocessor, there will be a set of instructions or a computer code or program that makes the functioning possible.

Almost a decade ago, majority of US aircraft and missile codes were re-written in the C-language. I read it in an issue of "Aviation Week and Space Technology".

The ECCM features and guidance of the MICA ( even earlier Super 530D) and AMRAAM are through computer programs stored in chips....mostly in onboard computer.......

Now its important that you get these "codes" so that you can modify the ECCM or Guidance algorithms (logics) according to the evolving threat.

Russia is more strict in these downgrading of equipment and it does it openly. Every export version of russian aircraft is downgraded in avionics, radar and weapons codes as compared to own Russian aircraft.

I think thats the reason that India turned to Israel for radars, avioncs and ECM gear.

A few more words on the flight control software of the aircrafts from Greg Goebel / In The Public Domain

"The processing power of the F-35 has presented the electronics system developers with a formidable software challenge. The F-22 Raptor uses about 2.5 million lines of software, but the F-35 will use 5.6 million lines of code. The F-35 not only has a more advanced electronics system, but it operates in both air-to-air and air-to-ground modes, and is being built in three different versions. The software design strategy is focusing on modularizing the code so that the portions that are unique to each F-35 variant can be isolated, and the remaining code used as-is on all three variants. The portions that are unique to each variant are a minority, about 1.1 million lines.

In addition, the code is largely executed by an interpretive software layer known as "middleware" that isolates the code from the specific details of the processor used. In principle, this will allow software to be ported to new processors as they become available, requiring only new middleware and maybe a few software tweaks. Interestingly, the code is written in C/C++, strongly suggesting that the military's effort to create Ada as a standardized programming language for defense projects was a dead end."


So as the F-16 is too multi-role like JSF, the main program will be of at least a few million lines long. And this software makes the aircrafts systems run. All weapons are most likely fired through this software too.

So it seems that with hardware (F-16), we need to get the software too, so that we can integrate other weapons too ourselves by changing and testing the software.

Here I must add that sometimes the manufacturers upgrade the weapons system simply by installing the new software. And this new program is sold for millions.

 

[araz]

someone please try to get hold of Asif Shamim from f-16.net he can be helpful in pakdef.

here is a ACM remarks regarding PAF F-16 MLU.
On the renovation and overhaul of the existing fleet of F-16 aircraft, the PAF chief said under the Mid-Life Upgrade (MLU) Program six aircraft of PAF would be overhauled in the US while PAF’s technicians would also be given training. "We will make every effort to acquire technical know how ultimately enabling us to undertake overhauls and upgrades of the aircraft indigenously," he said.

Ihave seen this statement. As far as I remember, there was talk of Turkey doing MLU on our F16s but nothing was ever announced which has contributed to the confusion.
With Thunder and J10 coming on , PAF will really have their hands full if they decide to MLU their F16s as well. Having sauid that it will give them the opportunity of familiarizing themselves with the newer version and will give them greater insight into the plane, which will be invaluable.
Araz

 

[Always Neutral]

A few more words on the flight control software of the aircrafts from Greg Goebel / In The Public Domain

"The processing power of the F-35 has presented the electronics system developers with a formidable software challenge. The F-22 Raptor uses about 2.5 million lines of software, but the F-35 will use 5.6 million lines of code. The F-35 not only has a more advanced electronics system, but it operates in both air-to-air and air-to-ground modes, and is being built in three different versions. The software design strategy is focusing on modularizing the code so that the portions that are unique to each F-35 variant can be isolated, and the remaining code used as-is on all three variants. The portions that are unique to each variant are a minority, about 1.1 million lines.

In addition, the code is largely executed by an interpretive software layer known as "middleware" that isolates the code from the specific details of the processor used. In principle, this will allow software to be ported to new processors as they become available, requiring only new middleware and maybe a few software tweaks. Interestingly, the code is written in C/C++, strongly suggesting that the military's effort to create Ada as a standardized programming language for defense projects was a dead end."


So as the F-16 is too multi-role like JSF, the main program will be of at least a few million lines long. And this software makes the aircrafts systems run. All weapons are most likely fired through this software too.

So it seems that with hardware (F-16), we need to get the software too, so that we can integrate other weapons too ourselves by changing and testing the software.

Here I must add that sometimes the manufacturers upgrade the weapons system simply by installing the new software. And this new program is sold for millions.

Dear Shebazi,

I must compliment you on your posts. They are always educative.

Are your from the PAF ?

Regards

 

[shehbazi2001]

Dear Shebazi,

I must compliment you on your posts. They are always educative.

Are your from the PAF ?

Regards

Thanks buddy. Its just because I have been studying literature on the military aviation from my childhood and its just passion that I continue to study it even though its not my job.

No I am not in PAF although my father did serve in PAF. He was a technician in PAF and he was my first teacher. 10 years ago, I did try to join PAF but could not pass through ISSB. I mentioned it in a thread. I am an engineer and am doing Phd in Engineering.

 

[fatman17]

Thanks buddy. Its just because I have been studying literature on the military aviation from my childhood and its just passion that I continue to study it even though its not my job.

No I am not in PAF although my father did serve in PAF. He was a technician in PAF and he was my first teacher. 10 years ago, I did try to join PAF but could not pass through ISSB. I mentioned it in a thread. I am an engineer and am doing Phd in Engineering.

good for you! keep it up!

 

[BATMAN]

They are putting some makkhan(butter) on the fat cheif. So he keeps eating, and keep supplying us the F-16s. The PAF definitely has alot of makkhan in its kitchen.

We should treat all our guests with respect but at the same time if Pakistan care less US can't dent us more.
LHM is willing to build F-16 in india plus other defence contractors are about to transfer sensitive technology to indians and we have a lolypop of F-16!
We should also demand aircraft engine factory in Pakistan. Other wise US be denied Pakistan's military assistance.

 

[blain2]

Two things gents.

a) The MLU will take place in the US. The mention of Turkey in the US Congressional notification is a typo afaik.

b) The ceremony to mark the arrival of the F-16s is not really unprecedented. It has happened in the past and happens all over the world with countries showcasing their own culture just to add a bit of flavor to the event. It may look lame to Pakistanis but most foreigners eat this stuff up (along with the top class cuisine served during such occasions).

 

[blain2]

We should treat all our guests with respect but at the same time if Pakistan care less US can't dent us more.
LHM is willing to build F-16 in india plus other defence contractors are about to transfer sensitive technology to indians and we have a lolypop of F-16!
We should also demand aircraft engine factory in Pakistan. Other wise US be denied Pakistan's military assistance.

Transferring technology and offsets really depends on how much you can absorb....Indian industry is ahead of Pakistan's but even the Indians cannot absorb all of what the west can offer (they usually hold back the good stuff and offer stuff that they can afford to let go of). Setting up manufacturing assembly capability for the F-16 in India is a losing proposition long term. It is a decade late and by the time it does happen, it would be even later. I doubt Indians would fall for it.

I stand by my point that PAF should absorb as many F-16s as she can. JF-17s, FC-20s are all in the near to mid term future. So I say get a hold of as many F-16s as possible and put them through MLU. That is a good way to go about enhancing the force. The Americans know that Pakistan is no longer desperate for the F-16s so they are relenting. Lets have some confidence in this plan. The ACM of the PAF in an interview himself said something to the effect that although we cannot guarantee against sanctions again, we wont be caught with our pants down. I.E. PAF has other decent alternates in the near future.

F-16s will be a very decent force multipliers in the sub-continental scenario. Regardless of all the claims by the IAF fans about the MKI and this or that, F-16 against the IAF will hold its own and will be a major threat for the other side to counter. A Pakistani specification MLU btw is not the same thing as the initial MLU that was performed on the European Participating Air Forces. Most of the avionics and radars are actually updated and very current for use in the sub-continental context. The AIDEW systems being talked about for use on the PAF F-16s are pretty amazing for both offensive and defensive operations. Overall the MLU package is a very nifty thing for PAF force enhancement in short term.