Export bids for JF-17 Thunder Multirole Lightweight Fighter Aircraft

[Tempest II]

Current birds belong to No27 "Tactical attack squadron" (If you know what it means) - these birds have replaced A-5 which is a "Ground attack air craft" which directly means is that the "Replacement (JFT) is also a ground attack specific".

Specifications of the air crafts are determined by keeping the role of the squadron the air craft will be used by , which means is that if Air superiority squadrons get these birds they would be in Air to Air configuration. (Common sense)

Upgrades are not quiet upgrades as Block II/III would be a "new variant" not "upgrade for the old air crafts" - so now you can have fun with your maturity theory.

With multirole aircraft, I see/suspect (could be wrong) the squadron designations remaining for traditional/historical reasons. I.e. the pride of the squadron and identify but not function. I very much doubt that because the current JF-17 went to an historically ground attack squadron and replaced A-5s that it means the JF-17s role will be dedicated ground attack. I very much doubt it. Has it not been reported that many (maybe most) pilots now flying the JF-17 came from F-16s?

While from weapons integration, they first focused on air-to-ground, which means they could not readly replace the F-7s with the Thunder.

Also maybe the A-5s were the oldest/least capable therefore needing to be replaced first.

I very much doubt the PAF will by a MULTI-ROLE FIGHTER and start forming DEDICATED SQUADRONS for air-to-air seperate from ground-to-air. That is a waste of resources and making themselves inflexible in operations.

 

[SBD-3]

To really get the Thunder into Overseas Marketing and in the minds of potential customers THE PROJECT needs JUST one MAJOR BOOST.

That boost is a Order of 250 Thunders From PLAAF the 2nd largest air force in the world.

Until CHINA trusts her own national security with FC1/Thunder deeming it a worthy future fighter I cant see a large order from any major air power.

The other big issue is the J10 or FC20 despite some claims on this forum that this is not possible their is hard evidence from CHINA they are looking to export J10 in the future to close allys and new friends. THE J10 is not and never was exxclusive to PLAAF or PAF.

aT $30M EACH it is a really bang for buck on PAR with F16/52 and Gripen and possible even Typhoon & rafael.

I cant see 100+ order for Thunder at $2 billion BUT I CAN SEE $2 BILLION order for 50 J10 VANGUARD.

Having said that i can see small oRderes for Thunder from the smaller air powers like Sri Lanks Azberbijhan and african states.

I see Eygpt Iran Syria and bigger richer asian nations going to J10 FROM 2015 ONWARDS.

CHINA can change the perception massively in favour of FC1 THUNDER in one swoop

The only threat to JFT marketing is second hand F-16s, nothing else comes close. But while a country can go for 2nd hand Falcons, the problem is that they will have to get these upgraded, which will not only increase the cost but also airframe will remain aged one, though upgraded. If I am getting an upgraded falcon in lets say 15-20 Million, JFT offers modern and capable alternative to this solution. the same is with Mig-21 and F-5s. An airforce may decide to replace them with expensive albeit lesser aircrafts like typhoon, Falcon 52+ or say Grippen but one unit of these aircrafts can purchase 3 to 4 though lesser modern but yet better than F-5, 4th gen JFTs. Not a bad deal i guess. Regarding Induction of JFT in PLAAF, if you would have looked at the history, everything PAF had out of China was no less capable. You should remember that PAF did not induct JFT for the sake of having a weak link in its inventory. For example, when PAF went with PG, its success led to BG,JG,MG and NG varients. Moreover, anything thats inducted by PAF serves as a free marketing for PLAAF as PAF is regarded as a very committed and professional airforce. Even if PLAAF does not induct JFT, as JFT matures in its service and airforces around world come to know about its capabilities, we will still see orders. (Btw sources do indicate that PLAAF will induct FC-1 but with WS-13 as PAF has decided to stay with RD-93 since WS-13 has lagged behind its schedule and its incorpation will mean significant delay in JFT induction which PAF does not want)

 

[Luftwaffe]

Tempest II, I believe Black Blood mean to say "Is also a ground attack specific".

I believe JFT already is a Multi-Role Platform which can be dedicated to both A2A and A2G and Naval specific roles.

 

[SQ8]

The F-16 block 40's in service with the US ANG's are multi-role jets..
however their training is concentrated on precision strike..
So while they know air combat..
they dont practice as much for it as they do for the strike missions.
The same could apply for the JF..
Being GD pilots doesnt mean having GD squadrons..

 

[Luftwaffe]

Storm Force a tip of info for you please take your time to read it before playing down on JFT orders.
In the late 70s when China started manufacturing F-7/J-7 variants many 3rd world nations showed interest and went with the purchase through late 70's-up till 2000s. At that time China had no experience in a show down aviation marketing yet it managed to sell J-7/F-7s to 17 Nations including China.

Up till now 1200-1250 J-7/F-7 variants have been sold.

All of these nations would want something to upgrade its Air Force to latest standards and Capabilities.
If not 17 most of them would want to go with JFT, give it a time, aircrafts are getting expensive. F-16 Block 42 upgrades and refurbished ones could only end up in Iraqi Air Force. Possibilities of upgrades of US F-16s lock 42+ to 50/52+ is also becoming reality and an added blk 50/52 purchases.
Qatari Air Force is looking towards 1 large squadron of 4.5 gen fighter and there is no possibility of F-16. Kuwait has F-18s probably it would upgrade and purchase under pressure more F-18E/Fs.
Jordanian Air Force is very interested in BVR capabilities and inventory which US is not allowing them in good numbers so JFT is a possibility.

Back to the point those 17 nations having F-7s would have only logical choice to go and upgrade to a giant leap technological capabilities that JFT is offering keeping in view over F-7/J-7 with less cash and non sanction platform because the world knows F-16 sanction saga who would want to go for that again. Russians have lost when it comes to Price Tag and easy maintenance and less strain on pockets.

You are mistaken the price tag is $40m not $30M, that is what Pakistan is negotiating or has negotiated a special perfect strategic partner of China. J-10A/B both are not for offer before Pakistan receives its batches 2014-2015..Vanguard will be transferred for new pilots training or secondary once production and induction is good in number in PLAAF. Due to tense situation in mid-east China is not in position to sell J-10s to nations that might be over taken by any external forces and ends up in their inventory for special training and tactics.

 

[bc040400065]

Current version of JF17 need time to be mature .... But dnt think any country will go for JF17 after 2013-14 time frame
And if China AirForce not induct them so i dnt think any one else buy them

If i remember correctly i read some where that india ordered MIG29's even when they were in testing stage and were not operational. i may be wrong.
but that shows that one has to see and analyze the requirements and if something fits good then you go for it.
It more or less also has to do with threat perception. e.g. pakistan ordered F16's in the early 80's so india went for MIg29 and M2K as soon as they were available.
So Even if china inducts JFT or not but many airforces around the globe are operating hundreds of Mig21,Mirages,f5, A5, J7 etc that need to be replaced so I m sure JFT will get orders even if china does not go for it.

 

[Luftwaffe]

Yes India ordered mig-29 while it was in developmental stages not even inducted in the Russian Air Force as operational until 1983, while JFT is already in the Air Force operational.

DRDO, by 2013/14 there will be even greater chances of JFT orders if AESA is introduced or offered with in say $24M, there is not a single fighter out there that is going to offer such thing in apprx price tag the base line russian inventory mig-29 is $30M by 2013/2014 the requirements/capabilities for the Air Forces will be greater even.

 

[SBD-3]

If i remember correctly i read some where that india ordered MIG29's even when they were in testing stage and were not operational. i may be wrong.
but that shows that one has to see and analyze the requirements and if something fits good then you go for it.
It more or less also has to do with threat perception. e.g. pakistan ordered F16's in the early 80's so india went for MIg29 and M2K as soon as they were available.
So Even if china inducts JFT or not but many airforces around the globe are operating hundreds of Mig21,Mirages,f5, A5, J7 etc that need to be replaced so I m sure JFT will get orders even if china does not go for it.

Even MKIs were directly funded by IAF and opertaionalized by IAF. So if Russia did not inducted Su-30 MKI varient, does that mean it is a bad platform?.... I rather feel that people like Stormforce find it hard to digest things and would keep gracing us with their "think" "feel" stuff. So dont worry about them

 

[unicorn148]

Even MKIs were directly funded by IAF and opertaionalized by IAF. So if Russia did not inducted Su-30 MKI varient, does that mean it is a bad platform?.... I rather feel that people like Stormforce find it hard to digest things and would keep gracing us with their "think" "feel" stuff. So dont worry about them

I in MKI stands for India and Russia cant keep India name in their jet and SU-30MKI is Su-30 with advance features of SU-35 and both su30 and su-35 are inducted by Russia

 

[SQ8]

Any more mention of the MKI here gets a ban.

 

[Imran Khan]

i delete it for sake of santro

 

[Beast]

Yup! JF-17 will be inducted by PLAAF as agressor plane.. F-5 freedom fighter was never inducted by USA but still sold like hotcakes to many allies..

JF-17 need not fear of second hand F-16, there are lots of countries not on friendly term with USA.

 

[isi admirer]

@MK, But dont you think most buyers will wait for Pakistan to have a substantial skin in the game (considering China is not yet equipping PLAF with this plane) before committing on a purchase. Specially with the recent noise about RD 93s

Are there any details of what the financial arrangements will be between China and Pakistan on exports considering China owns the IP and Pakistan owns the production?

i think that china is much focusing for the paf thats why the have ordered a batch of 50 to cac on urgent basis and without cost and where plaaf is concerned they are much foucsed on j10 as for there is the concern for rd 93 an aircraft had been tested with ws 13 in cac and that had even better results bt the hurdle is that ws 13 is not in a position for serial production bt it can be reddy for 2 years
ithink pakistan should focous on his own requirements up to the ws 13 and after that we should export.
as far as export are concerned it is 50 50 patnership.... decided

 

[Dazzler]

More than 10 countries standing in the cue waiting for their turn to buy JFT. Trust me this is authentic news. The delay is because PAF wants at least 2 batches then export will initiate. China have decided to take strike version which is being tested there. Last i heard, they were preparing for induction but with WS-13 not RD-93.

 

[tvsram1992]

ill buy couple of them