Exclusive: PAF Airchief Visits Rafale & M2k Units

[mingle]

May be Qatar will gifted its Mirages to PAF

Yeh it is possible PAF should take it with gratitude and replace Mirage 5s of Haider Sqd with them

Maybe Qatar will trade some Thunders for Mirages.

Just a guess. Don't take it seriously.

It is possible French won't mind they selling Rafale to Qatar also Qatar has to replace Mirages with Rafale original number of jetts will remain same just replace old one with New Same case is with UAE mirages just a guess work.

 

[nomi007]

Maybe Qatar will trade some Thunders for Mirages.

Just a guess. Don't take it seriously.

No they are buying
many advance jets beside Rafale

 

[Marker]

Qatar Air Force (QEAF) is expanding its fleet by procuring 4++ generation multi-role, air-superiority and deep strike aircraft. QEAF is also acquiring Hawk 100 as trainer aircraft.

36 F-15E Strike QA version ordered 2017
24 Typhoon Block-20 ordered 2017
36 Rafale 24 ordered 2015; 12 ordered 2017
9 Hawk-100 ordered 2018 (trainer)

Due to induction of three different 4++ Generation fighter aircraft, QEAF will require a 4++ Generation LIFT.
PAC can offer JF-17B Block 3 as a lucrative option at very competitive price with numerous advantages, like training, multiple eastern/western weapons integration and low cost logistic support etc.

 

[MastanKhan]

Qatar Air Force (QEAF) is expanding its fleet by procuring 4++ generation multi-role, air-superiority and deep strike aircraft. QEAF is also acquiring Hawk 100 as trainer aircraft.

36 F-15E Strike QA version ordered 2017
24 Typhoon Block-20 ordered 2017
36 Rafale 24 ordered 2015; 12 ordered 2017
9 Hawk-100 ordered 2018 (trainer)

Due to induction of three different 4++ Generation fighter aircraft, QEAF will require a 4++ Generation LIFT.
PAC can offer JF-17B Block 3 as a lucrative option at very competitive price with numerous advantages, like training, multiple eastern/western weapons integration and low cost logistic support etc.

Hi,

Welcome to the forum--.

Basic 101 of sales---a Ferrari Lambroghini buyer would never buy HYUNDAI or a HONDA---.

Never project your project as 'cheap'---or 2 for 1---.. People who can buy these Rafales----they can buy them twice the needed numbers if they want to---.

So---price is not the objective---. It is performance---you shatter the myth of their Rafales---they will be standing in line to buy your JF17's---.

Ever come across a high line sales person from the US or UK---they are a different breed of people---because they have a different breed of client---.

When I worked in Beverley Hills selling Lincolns---had a customer---I asked him is monthly income while filling up a credit application---he replied---1.7 million---I started dividing in by 12 I thought he made a mistake---he immediately corrected me---says that is my monthly income---that was in 1991---.

And he was just a guitarist in a rock band---not even a CEO---.

For his 2-3 months income---he could have bought the dealership---so how would you talk to that person---.

How many J-10s do you think the PAF should try to Procure?

Hi,

3 sqdrn's of JH7A's---.

 

[GriffinsRule]

Qatar Air Force (QEAF) is expanding its fleet by procuring 4++ generation multi-role, air-superiority and deep strike aircraft. QEAF is also acquiring Hawk 100 as trainer aircraft.

36 F-15E Strike QA version ordered 2017
24 Typhoon Block-20 ordered 2017
36 Rafale 24 ordered 2015; 12 ordered 2017
9 Hawk-100 ordered 2018 (trainer)

Due to induction of three different 4++ Generation fighter aircraft, QEAF will require a 4++ Generation LIFT.
PAC can offer JF-17B Block 3 as a lucrative option at very competitive price with numerous advantages, like training, multiple eastern/western weapons integration and low cost logistic support etc.

JF-17 cant be used as a LIFT for the fighters Qatar is acquiring as it can't replicate their systems etc.

I posted this not a long ago, which might help you understand what a LIFT requirements are generally.
https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/turk...cost-to-pakistan.405814/page-11#post-12099899

 

[FuturePAF]

Hi,

Welcome to the forum--.

Basic 101 of sales---a Ferrari Lambroghini buyer would never buy HYUNDAI or a HONDA---.

Never project your project as 'cheap'---or 2 for 1---.. People who can buy these Rafales----they can buy them twice the needed numbers if they want to---.

So---price is not the objective---. It is performance---you shatter the myth of their Rafales---they will be standing in line to buy your JF17's---.

Ever come across a high line sales person from the US or UK---they are a different breed of people---because they have a different breed of client---.

When I worked in Beverlys selling Lincolns---had a customer---I asked him is monthly income while filling up a credit application---he replied---1.7 million---I started dividing in by 12 I thought he made a mistake---he immediately corrected me---says that is my monthly income---that was in 1991---.

And he was just a guitarist in a rock band---not even a CEO---.

For his 2-3 months income---he could have bought the dealership---so how would you talk to that person---.



Hi,

3 sqdrn's of JH7A's---.

JH-7A would definitely be a great option, as they just require an overhaul and flight training for the former Mirage pilots and RIOs. The JH-7A would open up a lot of heavier weapons, and because of its larger nose, it could be fitted with a larger Radar.

If we think of the JH-7A as just a long range, able to carry heavy loads, Platform, then the PAF can look past its deficiencies. Its a Platform and the PGMs will do most of the work. We just need platforms.

Long range anti-air missiles can really change the dynamic against enemy AWACS and Special Mission Planes

Also as a Heavier platform, it can carry larger more power EW equipment. EW dominance will be vital from now on-wards.

The JH-7A would be a perfect platform to carry "Rampage" type Missiles
https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zo...ersonic-rampage-air-launched-stand-off-weapon

Adding stand-off weapons to fourth generation aircraft can significantly add to their utility in general, especially as long-range surface-to-air missile systems continue to proliferate around the world. Unless a country is willing to go through the time-consuming and immensely expensive process of developing a stealthy fifth-generation platform, more advanced and longer range air-launched weapons offer the only real alternative to continue holding potential enemies at threat from the air, especially when it comes to critical targets deeper within their territory. It could also present a valuable tool for attacking air defense nodes to pave the way for additional follow-on strikes.

 

[Thorough Pro]

you make logical points but then logic is not everyone's cup of tea.......that's why you see a lot of spillage on pdf

Hi,

Welcome to the forum--.

Basic 101 of sales---a Ferrari Lambroghini buyer would never buy HYUNDAI or a HONDA---.

Never project your project as 'cheap'---or 2 for 1---.. People who can buy these Rafales----they can buy them twice the needed numbers if they want to---.

So---price is not the objective---. It is performance---you shatter the myth of their Rafales---they will be standing in line to buy your JF17's---.

Ever come across a high line sales person from the US or UK---they are a different breed of people---because they have a different breed of client---.

When I worked in Beverlys selling Lincolns---had a customer---I asked him is monthly income while filling up a credit application---he replied---1.7 million---I started dividing in by 12 I thought he made a mistake---he immediately corrected me---says that is my monthly income---that was in 1991---.

And he was just a guitarist in a rock band---not even a CEO---.

For his 2-3 months income---he could have bought the dealership---so how would you talk to that person---.



Hi,

3 sqdrn's of JH7A's---.

 

[Marker]

Hi,

Welcome to the forum--.

Basic 101 of sales---a Ferrari Lambroghini buyer would never buy HYUNDAI or a HONDA---.

Never project your project as 'cheap'---or 2 for 1---.. People who can buy these Rafales----they can buy them twice the needed numbers if they want to---.

So---price is not the objective---. It is performance---you shatter the myth of their Rafales---they will be standing in line to buy your JF17's---.

Ever come across a high line sales person from the US or UK---they are a different breed of people---because they have a different breed of client---.

When I worked in Beverley Hills selling Lincolns---had a customer---I asked him is monthly income while filling up a credit application---he replied---1.7 million---I started dividing in by 12 I thought he made a mistake---he immediately corrected me---says that is my monthly income---that was in 1991---.

And he was just a guitarist in a rock band---not even a CEO---.

For his 2-3 months income---he could have bought the dealership---so how would you talk to that person---.



Hi,

3 sqdrn's of JH7A's---.

you make logical points but then logic is not everyone's cup of tea.......that's why you see a lot of spillage on pdf

Buying luxury cars, villas and even jet liners is not only for personal comfort but also a show of status in the society. These type of goods do not follow normal Price - Demand curve. Because the mind set of the buyers is different; their want is personal comfort and show of status.

But buying weapon system for a country is totally a different ball game.

Yes, affordability is not an issue for QEAF.

Till early 90s QEAF was holding an inventory of 15 Mirage F-1C/E, 6 Alpha Jets and 4 Hawk Hunters.

12 Mirage 2000-5 were procured in late 90s to replace 15 Mirage F-1C/E.

24 Rafale were ordered in 2015 and remaining 12 were ordered in 2017.

36 F-15s and 24 Typhoons were ordered in 2017.

Why QAEF went into shopping for top of the line jet fighters and that, in large quantity after 2015 (about 15 years after the last buy)?

It was not because of some “political pressure” from the west as some honorable members of PDFs were mistakenly mentioning in their post.

It was because the threat from its neighbors – UAE and Saudia Arabia.

Since QAEF already signed the contract for 96 4++ generation fighter jets costing around 25-30 billion dollars, buying JF-17 is remote possibility unless PAC pitch some very attractive package.

Due to induction of three different platforms and about 100 fighters, training of 100+ aircrew will be cumbersome task.

QEAF will need a 4++ generation LIFT trainer aircraft in their inventory.

That is why I mentioned to pitch JF-17B Block III, a tandem cockpit version with advance avionics package and customized as LIFT trainer aircraft.

A platform which can be utilized as both 4++ generation LIFT trainer and a multi-role fighter with best turnaround time, efficient and low cost logistic support.

To customize JF-17B as LIFT package, both Chinese and Leonardo help will be required.

This will be very expensive up-gradation but it will worth more than what PAC spends.

 

[MastanKhan]

Buying luxury cars, villas and even jet liners is not only for personal comfort but also a show of status in the society. These type of goods do not follow normal Price - Demand curve. Because the mind set of the buyers is different; their want is personal comfort and show of status.

But buying weapon system for a country is totally a different ball game.

Yes, affordability is not an issue for QEAF.

Till early 90s QEAF was holding an inventory of 15 Mirage F-1C/E, 6 Alpha Jets and 4 Hawk Hunters.

12 Mirage 2000-5 were procured in late 90s to replace 15 Mirage F-1C/E.

24 Rafale were ordered in 2015 and remaining 12 were ordered in 2017.

36 F-15s and 24 Typhoons were ordered in 2017.

Why QAEF went into shopping for top of the line jet fighters and that, in large quantity after 2015 (about 15 years after the last buy)?

It was not because of some “political pressure” from the west as some honorable members of PDFs were mistakenly mentioning in their post.

It was because the threat from its neighbors – UAE and Saudia Arabia.

Since QAEF already signed the contract for 96 4++ generation fighter jets costing around 25-30 billion dollars, buying JF-17 is remote possibility unless PAC pitch some very attractive package.

Due to induction of three different platforms and about 100 fighters, training of 100+ aircrew will be cumbersome task.

QEAF will need a 4++ generation LIFT trainer aircraft in their inventory.

That is why I mentioned to pitch JF-17B Block III, a tandem cockpit version with advance avionics package and customized as LIFT trainer aircraft.

A platform which can be utilized as both 4++ generation LIFT trainer and a multi-role fighter with best turnaround time, efficient and low cost logistic support.

To customize JF-17B as LIFT package, both Chinese and Leonardo help will be required.

This will be very expensive up-gradation but it will worth more than what PAC spends.

Sir,

You are talking about educated reasonable people as to how they would decide---.

The Gcc---egypt---would not decide like that---. They will go with the expensive off the shelf name as they always have---. Security is in the name---in the high price tag---in the known producer---.

 

[mingle]

First Air Cheif and Now PM is in Qatar Something going on let's see

 

[Nomad40]

First Air Cheif and Now PM is in Qatar Something going on let's see

Hello dear members, let me spit some facts

• No one is buying any Mirages m2k (Very good dog fighter and multi role, almost like the Fighting Falcon) or what ever. This does not make sense to me because we need to know a couple of basic aspects and parameters that the Mirage 2000 (that we on the forum speak of) operates.

• We aint got funds for the Rafael and Mr. croissant and Mrs. baguette will not sell us Rafael mostly because Mr and Mrs Cow piss are a much better, dependable and a high demand customer. I mean sure why not sell them to it at twice the price 2.4Mil USD meteor for the price of 4Mil a piece as long as we get our 650,000 usd amraams for cheaper prices

• The arab mind set as explained by one of our members @MastanKhan, They do not go for practically they go for luxury and prestige which gives them bragging rights. Why buy Jf-17 when you have Rafael or you can order twice as much F-16V or F-15s for 5 times the price. It would make sense to them because its HABIBI MONEY PAPA AMERKIA YALA YALA GOOD, but it makes sense to me because their systems, module and doctrine will not be compatible with JF-17 PLUS IF THEY DO WHAT DO YOU THINK AMERIKA WILL DO TO THEM? THATS RIGHT SANCTION THEM.

• So let us assume even if we were interested to buy the Jf-17 dont you think it will be a big pain in the but for a pilot to use JF-17 as LIFT because my god is it difficult to use a Proper fighter as a Fighter trainer for new pilots they will simply fail the JF-17 is a Proper proper fighter, it is complex, it requires attention, it requires care you cannot just sit in the cockpit and fly the throttle alone has like 6 switches and each one can do like 35 billion tasks. THE AMERIKANS WILL NEVER EVER LET THEM AND IF THEY DID THE JF-17 IS HARD TO EMPLOY (HARD TO EMPLOY WRITE IT DOWN 50 TIME) IT IS EASY TO FLY THE DAMN THING ALL 4TH GEN PLANES ARE EASY TO FLY BUT HOW EFFECTIVE CAN YOU BE WITH IT, CAN YOU PROPERLY EMPLOY THE THING THAT THE THING IS SUPPOSE TO DO, YOU KNOW DO THE THING TO OTHER THINGS.

The air chief is there to either convince the Qaf into some sort of study on the Rafael like an exercise or EO program and Qatar has a Seskie NG plant that makes jet fuel and produces almost 2000000 barrels oil per day WE NEED FUEL TO KEEP BIRDS IN THE AIR.

 

[Raider 21]

Hello dear members, let me spit some facts

• No one is buying any Mirages m2k (Very good dog fighter and multi role, almost like the Fighting Falcon) or what ever. This does not make sense to me because we need to know a couple of basic aspects and parameters that the Mirage 2000 (that we on the forum speak of) operates.

• We aint got funds for the Rafael and Mr. croissant and Mrs. baguette will not sell us Rafael mostly because Mr and Mrs Cow piss are a much better, dependable and a high demand customer. I mean sure why not sell them to it at twice the price 2.4Mil USD meteor for the price of 4Mil a piece as long as we get our 650,000 usd amraams for cheaper prices

• The arab mind set as explained by one of our members @MastanKhan, They do not go for practically they go for luxury and prestige which gives them bragging rights. Why buy Jf-17 when you have Rafael or you can order twice as much F-16V or F-15s for 5 times the price. It would make sense to them because its HABIBI MONEY PAPA AMERKIA YALA YALA GOOD, but it makes sense to me because their systems, module and doctrine will not be compatible with JF-17 PLUS IF THEY DO WHAT DO YOU THINK AMERIKA WILL DO TO THEM? THATS RIGHT SANCTION THEM.

• So let us assume even if we were interested to buy the Jf-17 dont you think it will be a big pain in the but for a pilot to use JF-17 as LIFT because my god is it difficult to use a Proper fighter as a Fighter trainer for new pilots they will simply fail the JF-17 is a Proper proper fighter, it is complex, it requires attention, it requires care you cannot just sit in the cockpit and fly the throttle alone has like 6 switches and each one can do like 35 billion tasks. THE AMERIKANS WILL NEVER EVER LET THEM AND IF THEY DID THE JF-17 IS HARD TO EMPLOY (HARD TO EMPLOY WRITE IT DOWN 50 TIME) IT IS EASY TO FLY THE DAMN THING ALL 4TH GEN PLANES ARE EASY TO FLY BUT HOW EFFECTIVE CAN YOU BE WITH IT, CAN YOU PROPERLY EMPLOY THE THING THAT THE THING IS SUPPOSE TO DO, YOU KNOW DO THE THING TO OTHER THINGS.

The air chief is there to either convince the Qaf into some sort of study on the Rafael like an exercise or EO program and Qatar has a Seskie NG plant that makes jet fuel and produces almost 2000000 barrels oil per day WE NEED FUEL TO KEEP BIRDS IN THE AIR.

When you have money to afford the best for your military, then you have no issue whether it is a Mirage 2000-9, F-16 Block 60s, or Rafales.....and in the case of Emiratis for example, they have always bought and provided the best for its air force. The US government has no issue for them, at one point Su-35s were being heavily considered for the UAEAF. The American sanctions are less of an issue for them.

 

[Nomad40]

When you have money to afford the best for your military, then you have no issue whether it is a Mirage 2000-9, F-16 Block 60s, or Rafales.....and in the case of Emiratis for example, they have always bought and provided the best for its air force. The US government has no issue for them, at one point Su-35s were being heavily considered for the UAEAF. The American sanctions are less of an issue for them.

UAEAF is subbranch of USAF so you know why they will like a little flanker action

 

[Raider 21]

UAEAF is subbranch of USAF so you know why they will like a little flanker action

Very much mistaken in that. Far from it, in fact a lot more independent than I thought.

 

[Flight of falcon]

Qatar is going to help finance new F16s for Pakistan .