Erdogan demands demilitarisation of East Aegean Islands, threatens operation in Syria

[dBSPL]

All depends on Erdogan’s mood. He can invade Greece today and China tomorrow. There are people that are bored and have nothing to do else.

Again: Erdogan or anyone else never said anything such things.

The subject referred to here is the peace agreement signed between Turkey and Greece, accompanied by the signatures of many guarantor countries. Sovereignty rights of the islands, which names are written one by one and which locations are specified in the agreements, have been transferred, subject to certain conditions. The most important of these conditions is related to the de-militarization of the some islands. Trying to read the unilateral violation and erosion of this agreement, by Greece, over putting forward some reasons in its own way, as a Turkish aggression is a futile effort.

In our culture, signature is honor. Those who encourage Greece to commit dishonor are building the foundations of a great psychological depression in the Greek people, just as the dreams of ENOSIS were shattered in 74.

 

[Foinikas]

First of all, it's the entire NATO, not just USN.......

Second of all, this all started when @Beast put out a hypothetical question what if Turkey join Russian camp and violate montreux convention by letting Russia transfer thru Black Sea during Wartime. I don't have anything against Turkey, but what do you want me to say? Do I believe if this happen, Turkey can get away with violating a major international treaty?? No, and honestly, you would have to be really naive to believe so. There are going to be consequence. I mean, if you believe there will be no consequence for doing that, well..........

As I said, and let me stress that again, I have nothing against Turkey or being Pro-Greece, what I said is in response to a member putting out a hypothetical question and I answer what I believe honestly. I mean if he think NATO cannot blockade Turkey if Turkey violate montreux convention, that's his opinion, I believe otherwise and as I said, I am just stating the fact.

Oh I know. I just mentioned it,because in the past some Turkish members here laughed at the possibility of the USN and Air Force destroying their Navy,bases and military complexes. They said nobody can defeat Turkey in their turf. I told them about Saddam,they don't consider Saddam's Iraq as an equal to Erdogan's Turkey. They are not very wrong in this,but just like Turk brag about being the second largest army in NATO,Iraqis used to brag they were the 4th or 5th largest army in the world back then.

 

[dBSPL]

There are certain Turkish members here who don't think the USN can take on the Turkish Navy in the Aegean or East Med.,,


As you can see from the maps,since 1973,it is Turkey that started having ambitions and illegal claims,not Greece.
It is evident who the bully is. Greece is not the one revealing expansionist maps as State policy. That's basically imperialism and irridentism.

As for making "our own ambitions and actions" the problem of the EU,well we are part of the EU. And you are threatening us. You are flying your jet fighters and UAVs over our islands or next to our cities,for example Alexandroupoli. So,that's also a violation of the EU's borders effectively.

The Greek Air Force carried out provocative flights near the coasts of our country between 26-28 April 2022, repeatedly violating our country's airspace in Didim, Datça and Dalaman. Our Air Force responded to these provocative flights and violations in accordance with the rules of engagement. While Greece is the party that started and escalated the tension, accusing our country of unfounded allegations is incompatible with the recent positive agenda and good neighborly relations between the two countries. We expect the Greek side to put an end to its provocative actions and rhetoric and to sincerely support the Confidence Building Measures process initiated both bilaterally and within NATO, so that such incidents do not happen again. There is no change in Turkiye's attitude towards the solution of all Islands Sea/Aegean problems, including the width of its airspace, within the framework of a sincere dialogue with Greece in accordance with international law.

 

[Foinikas]

The most important of these conditions is related to the de-militarization of the some islands. Trying to read the unilateral violation and erosion of this agreement, by Greece, over putting forward some reasons in its own way, as a Turkish aggression is a futile effort.

Good Lord! How many times do I have to show you?

Those who encourage Greece to commit dishonor are building the foundations

So this is about "dishonor"? That's what this is all about? Tell me something,do you feel threatened by Greece? As a country and you,as a person. Do you feel threatened by Greece? In general and specifically of the tiny garissons on the islands?

If not,then what is the problem? We are the ones afraid of you,that's why we have garissons on the islands.

If you are not afraid of us,then why do you want to start a war?

 

[Foinikas]

The Greek Air Force carried out provocative flights near the coasts of our country between 26-28 April 2022, repeatedly violating our country's airspace in Didim, Datça and Dalaman. Our Air Force responded to these provocative flights and violations in accordance with the rules of engagement. While Greece is the party that started and escalated the tension, accusing our country of unfounded allegations is incompatible with the recent positive agenda and good neighborly relations between the two countries. We expect the Greek side to put an end to its provocative actions and rhetoric and to sincerely support the Confidence Building Measures process initiated both bilaterally and within NATO, so that such incidents do not happen again. There is no change in Turkiye's attitude towards the solution of all Islands Sea/Aegean problems, including the width of its airspace, within the framework of a sincere dialogue with Greece in accordance with international law.

First of all,the bullshit Cavusoglu says about us violating Turkish Air Space is pure propaganda and fiction. And I wonder how you,a supposedly smart person,believe it.

Second,Greece escalated tension? You're talking like you came out of a Yeni Safak article. Do you know how many violations of the Greek FIR your Air Force has been doing over the last.....20-30 years? But let's not go that far:

We expect the Greek side to put an end to its provocative actions and rhetoric and to sincerely support the Confidence Building Measures process initiated both bilaterally and within NATO, so that such incidents do not happen again. There is no change in Turkiye's attitude towards the solution of all Islands Sea/Aegean problems, including the width of its airspace, within the framework of a sincere dialogue with Greece in accordance with international law.

Did Cavusoglu himself tell you to post this? You have been trying to ram Hellenic Coast Guard and Navy ships,you have been sending immigrants to our waters,escorted by your Coast Guard,you tried to organize a mass invasion of tens of thousands of immigrants on our land borders on Evros,you recently flew 4 nm from Alexandroupolis,your UAVs and F-16s almost daily violate our air space and fly over islands.

And yet,you dare say that Greece is the one with "provocative actions and rhetortic"? That we don't sincerely support the Confidence Building Measures process? Sir,you are a hypocrite.

 

[dBSPL]

If you are not afraid of us,then why do you want to start a war?

It's not about being afraid or not afraid. First of all, you need to get rid of this language of war.

When the former US president Jhonson sent an open threatening letter threatening to destroy Turkish republic, the Greek junta was also in the opinion that their dreams were unstoppable.

We are in favor of good neighborliness and the continuation of the peace agreements we have signed between us. But this not means that we will give up the legal rights that the 1923 Lausanne and 1947 Paris agreements allowed us. We are always ready to discuss Greece's unilateral claims before the UN and in the mediation of appropriate security mechanisms.

Greece has declared a NAVTEX announcement, starting from 20 kilometers away from Kemer, which is Turkiye's tourism center, in a very wide area and contrary to all practices, which will last longer than 3 months. On the other hand, social media trolls of our neighbour busy to twist some statements. These are cheap tricks. If you had spared the time you spent for this propaganda to mutual dialogue, we would have different agendas today.

First of all,the bullshit Cavusoglu says about us violating Turkish Air Space is pure propaganda and fiction. And I wonder how you,a supposedly smart person,believe it.

Second,Greece escalated tension? You're talking like you came out of a Yeni Safak article. Do you know how many violations of the Greek FIR your Air Force has been doing over the last.....20-30 years? But let's not go that far:

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Did Cavusoglu himself tell you to post this? You have been trying to ram Hellenic Coast Guard and Navy ships,you have been sending immigrants to our waters,escorted by your Coast Guard,you tried to organize a mass invasion of tens of thousands of immigrants on our land borders on Evros,you recently flew 4 nm from Alexandroupolis,your UAVs and F-16s almost daily violate our air space and fly over islands.

And yet,you dare say that Greece is the one with "provocative actions and rhetortic"? That we don't sincerely support the Confidence Building Measures process? Sir,you are a hypocrite.

Greece unilaterally declares an airspace and then argues that Turkiye violated its airspace accordingly. That's why one of the most ridiculous forms of crying in the world is these Greece's airspace violation allegations.

*

It was Greece that broke the treaty it signed in less than ten years and increased its territorial waters to 6 miles.

Then again, it is Greece that ignores Turkiye's rights and demands 12 miles.

It is Greece that claims to have +4 airspace with an aggression unmatched in the world.

In the country where you are one of the the guarantor of peace, it is Greece that is trying to carry out ENOSIS by financing terrorism and having a military coup on it.

Even today, it is Greece that clings to military motifs and lives with Byzantine dreams.

This spoiled attitude of Greece is the biggest obstacle in front of the stability and peace climate in the region.

 

[Foinikas]

It's not about being afraid or not afraid. First of all, you need to get rid of this language of war.

What language of war? The threats are coming from Erdogan,Akar and Bahceli,specifically.

When the former US president Jhonson sent an open threatening letter threatening to destroy Turkish republic, the Greek junta was also in the opinion that their dreams were unstoppable.

The Ioannides junta did nothing to prevent Cyprus from falling,they were hardcore pro-American and Americans did nothing to stop Turkey from the beginning.

We are in favor of good neighborliness and the continuation of the peace agreements we have signed between us. But this not means that we will give up the legal rights that the 1923 Lausanne and 1947 Paris agreements allowed us. We are always ready to discuss Greece's unilateral claims before the UN and in the mediation of appropriate security mechanisms.

Did you check the maps in the first post? How come we had good neighbor from 1923 to 1973(with of course some exceptions due to the Cyprus matter)and then suddenly Turkey starts claming parts here and there,declaring a SAR inside our side,sends research ships to search in our waters and the 5-6 years suddenly "remembers" old agreements? Out of nowhere?

Greece has declared a NAVTEX announcement, starting from 20 kilometers away from Kemer, which is Turkiye's tourism center, in a very wide area and contrary to all practices, which will last longer than 3 months. On the other hand, social media trolls of our neighbour busy to twist some statements. These are cheap tricks. If you had spared the time you spent for this propaganda to mutual dialogue, we would have different agendas today.

Do you think it's a cheap trick or twisting of statements,when Erdogan says "I'm not joking,I'm serious"? Or when you have island-landing exercises? Like someone said "For where are the Turks training to land on? Majorca or Sicily?"

When you have a country openly saying "do this or the islands will be up for grabs",isn't that a threat? Do you consider that "good neighborhood"?

And I ask you again,since you are the bigger country,the stronger country...what are you afraid of so much,that you keep insisting on our islands having absolutely no army? And why should we,when we are being threatened constantly,actually remove any armed presence from the islands instead of actually reinforcing them?

 

[HydraChess]

Its just bullshit bla bla from a struggeling regime. Im not worried. We have this bullshit since decades.

 

[Foinikas]

That's why one of the most ridiculous forms of crying in the world is these Greece's airspace violation allegations.

So you have nothing to say about your F-16s flying next to Alexandroupolis at a 4 nm distance from the city?

 

[dBSPL]

What language of war? The threats are coming from Erdogan,Akar and Bahceli,specifically.


The Ioannides junta did nothing to prevent Cyprus from falling,they were hardcore pro-American and Americans did nothing to stop Turkey from the beginning.


Did you check the maps in the first post? How come we had good neighbor from 1923 to 1973(with of course some exceptions due to the Cyprus matter)and then suddenly Turkey starts claming parts here and there,declaring a SAR inside our side,sends research ships to search in our waters and the 5-6 years suddenly "remembers" old agreements? Out of nowhere?


Do you think it's a cheap trick or twisting of statements,when Erdogan says "I'm not joking,I'm serious"? Or when you have island-landing exercises? Like someone said "For where are the Turks training to land on? Majorca or Sicily?"

When you have a country openly saying "do this or the islands will be up for grabs",isn't that a threat? Do you consider that "good neighborhood"?

And I ask you again,since you are the bigger country,the stronger country...what are you afraid of so much,that you keep insisting on our islands having absolutely no army? And why should we,when we are being threatened constantly,actually remove any armed presence from the islands instead of actually reinforcing them?

"Greece has deteriorated the treaty status of the islands. Therefore, Greece must disarm these islands. Otherwise, the sovereignty debate will begin."

This is what Turkiye is not bluffing about. There is not the slightest expression of a military threat or the use of military measures. On the contrary, there is an emphasis on international security mechanisms within each statement.

Here is Erdogan's statement which you re trying to twist words:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1534898850808446978

“We invite Greece to stop arming the Islands with Non-Military Status and to act in accordance with international agreements. I'm not kidding, I'm serious. In particular, this nation is determined and if they says something, they surely will follow."

*

The EFES-2022 is a military exercise under the command of the 4th Army since 1975 and included in the NATO annual exercises plan since 2016. (The reason for the establishment of the 4th Army is the ENOSIS attempt and terrorizing the region of the Greek military junta.)

As of 2022: Italy, Azerbaijan, Bosnia and Herzegovina, Macedonia, Pakistan, Albania, Kazakhstan, Kyrgyzstan, and also US Navy with LPD landing ships with helicopters, howitzers and armored vehicles took part in the actual firing part of the exercises. If you examine NATO's social media accounts, you can find a lot of praise for the exercise. You are trying to twist the issue with such baseless arguments.

The Greek army also organizes similar exercises. Some are international and some are within the Greek army. Are the military exercises of the Greek army carried out with the dream of a rematch of the Asia Minor disaster?

Please do not reduce the discussion to the level of social media trolls.

 

[SQ8]

Thread title was misleading - Turkey wants islands demilitarized, not the entire country of greece

 

[Foinikas]

Ptisi posted a nice article about it:

The Greek foreign ministry published on Thursday a series of 16 maps on its website that seek to demonstrate and explain the illegal and revisionist nature of Turkey’s assertions and actions concerning the Greek islands from 1973 until the present.

“In an effort to increase the wider public’s awareness of Turkish revisionism, the attached maps depict in a vivid and irrefutable way the Turkish illegal unilateral actions and claims,” a foreign ministry announcement said.

As the announcement explained, the maps begin chronologically with the status quo enshrined in the Lausanne (1923) and Paris (1947) Treaties.

“Turkish claims are then presented, beginning with the illegal licensing of the Turkish state oil company (TPAO) for exploration of oil fields in areas of the Greek continental shelf in the North Aegean in 1973, and continuing with the attempt to usurp Greece’s responsibility for Search and Rescue services in half of the Aegean in the 1980s, the “ grey zone” theory in the 1990s, further escalation with the granting of new licenses in the Eastern Mediterranean, the endorsement of the “ Blue Homeland” as an official doctrine, the “ Turkish-Libyan Memorandum”, reaching as far as the Turkish theory of the demilitarization status of the Aegean islands.

The above-mentioned maps document the extent of Turkish revisionism in order to upend the status quo, violating International Law and the International Law of the Sea, and threatening peace, security and stability in our region,” the ministry said.

Greek foreign ministry releases 16 maps illustrating progressive Turkish revisionism from 1973 to 2022 - Î ÏήÏη

The Greek foreign ministry published on Thursday a series of 16 maps on its website that seek to demonstrate and explain the illegal and revisionist nature of Turkey’s assertions and actions concerning the Greek islands from 1973 until the present. “In an effort to increase the wider publicâs...

www.ptisidiastima.com

 

[dBSPL]

No,they are exercises of re-taking islands,occupying by Turkey

No, the islands and islets which sovereignty has not been transferred within any international agreement (EGEAYDAK) are not Greek territory.

So you are the one burning with the dream of war. This confession will be a clear enough answer for those interested.

 

[Foinikas]

So you are the one burning with the dream of war. This confession will be a clear enough answer for those interested.

I meant occupied,not occupying

The last one who wants war,is us. Maybe Apollon wants,since he is far away in Germany.

But it's Erdogan and Akar and Bahceli who constantly talk about "giving lessons" and "throwing Yunaniler back to the sea" etc etc.

 

[Viet]

Again: Erdogan or anyone else never said anything such things.

The subject referred to here is the peace agreement signed between Turkey and Greece, accompanied by the signatures of many guarantor countries. Sovereignty rights of the islands, which names are written one by one and which locations are specified in the agreements, have been transferred, subject to certain conditions. The most important of these conditions is related to the de-militarization of the some islands. Trying to read the unilateral violation and erosion of this agreement, by Greece, over putting forward some reasons in its own way, as a Turkish aggression is a futile effort.

In our culture, signature is honor. Those who encourage Greece to commit dishonor are building the foundations of a great psychological depression in the Greek people, just as the dreams of ENOSIS were shattered in 74.

Why should Greece demilitarize the islands? What’s your intention?