Egyptian Armed Forces

[MICA]

16 billion* and around 3/4 month
reasons new policies to end/weaken the black market + 25% reduction in exports due to the power (fuel and electricity) shortage in the first half of the year which caused some factories to reduce production this was solved.
The Egyptian pound will keep devaluing as it is not at its actual value something that I hope they keep doing the pound till it reach its actual value something that is gonna help to bring more foreign investments. that makes the egyptain pound the second worst currency after the algerian in the arab world (that is according to CNBC)
(The golf aid has stopped as the egyptian economy is improving and does not need aid)

ffs stop quoting this guy already !

 

[-SINAN-]

No till now there is no evidence that saudis financed any of the army's deals all of the media channels that claimed that the deal was financed by saudis base their assumption on things like Egypt can't afford it and that the egyptain economy is suffering etc. But the saudi government did not claim that they payed a penny in them deals but they did put money in other things as aid (if they payed then they would have made it clear for everyone that they helped like they did with the aid and money they helped egypt with after the 30th of June and like the military aid they sent to Lebanon).
El sisi made it clear in his last speech that the army is financing their own deals and that the army was saving for years "the officers were being payed half of their actual salary " el sisi said. + the army haven't made any deals for years and instead relayed on the American aid money.

yes they also pay for my food , electricity , university , vacations pretty much everything

Military expenditure (% of GDP) in Egypt
Military expenditure (% of GDP) in Egypt was last measured at 1.67 in 2013,

Eygpt GDP is around 300$ Billion... which military expenditure would make around $5 Billion. This money includes payment of the military personnel, maintenance and repair costs, ....etc..you can't even buy a S-300 system with that money. So, i thought Saudis are financing Eygpt.

It is not a question of "Does Egypt getting foreign finance for it's military acquisitions ?" it is the question of "Who is financing Egypt for it's military acquisitions ?" as there is no way Egypt can finance itself.

army is financing their own deals and that the army was saving for years "the officers were being payed half of their actual salary " el sisi said.

@Legionaire

ABOUT THE MISTRALS.....
17 DEC 2014
Andrey Riznyk: Without Russian Components, a Mistral is Just a Clumsy Floating box
A member of the Executive Board of the United Instrument Manufacturing Corporation has spoken about protection of battle control systems and unique communication systems

Andrey Riznyk, Executive Board member of the United Instrument Manufacturing Corporation, spoke about protecting military control systems from hacker. He said whether it is possible to hack into the new National Defense Control Center, and talked about the unique Russian equipment in the Mistral amphibious assault ships in a TASS interview.

ANDREY RIZNYK, EXECUTIVE BOARD MEMBER, UIMC

Mistrals cannot do anything without Russian communication and control systems. They would be essentially floating boxes with poor maneuverability which are blind and deaf. The ship which is supposed to be handed over to Russia, is right now severely limited in its fighting capability as far as weapons systems and electronic and radio systems are concerned. They have several Russian-made equipment units which would help the Mistral reach our shores, but it has to be equipped with either all French-made hardware or all Russian-made, because otherwise it would have to navigate by the stars, to put it bluntly.”

What a stupid article...as if only Russians know about C4IR....

Chinese Aircrat carrier Chinese aircraft carrier Liaoning - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia has a similar story. Chinese bought it's hull and refurbished it in China.

 

[Hell NO]

Military expenditure (% of GDP) in Egypt
Military expenditure (% of GDP) in Egypt was last measured at 1.67 in 2013,

Eygpt GDP is around 300$ Billion... which military expenditure would make around $5 Billion. This money includes payment of the military personnel, maintenance and repair costs, ....etc..you can't even buy a S-300 system with that money. So, i thought Saudis are financing Eygpt.

It is not a question of "Does Egypt getting foreign finance for it's military acquisitions ?" it is the question of "Who is financing Egypt for it's military acquisitions ?" as there is no way Egypt can finance itself.



@Legionaire



What a stupid article...as if only Russians know about C4IR....

Chinese Aircrat carrier Chinese aircraft carrier Liaoning - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia has a similar story. Chinese bought it's hull and refurbished it in China.

You see over the last few years there was a huge debate about the egyptian army finances and the ability of the parliament to view them so if the egyptian parliament can't view these things, do you still think your figures are accurate??
+ as I said the egyptian army relays on self funding and it's no secret that the egyptian army owns a lot of business some estimate that the egyptian army is worth around 40% of the egyptian economy something that I highly doubt.

 

[-SINAN-]

You see over the last few years there was a huge debate about the egyptian army finances and the ability of the parliament to view them so if the egyptian parliament can't view these things, do you still think your figures are accurate??
+ as I said the egyptian army relays on self funding and it's no secret that the egyptian army owns a lot of business some estimate that the egyptian army is worth around 40% of the egyptian economy something that I highly doubt.

Mate, i'm coming to you with actual numbers and calculations, you are talking with rumors......

 

[Hell NO]

Mate, i'm coming to you with actual numbers and calculations, you are talking with rumors......

That's what iam trying to say the numbers you are relaying on are actually nothing but rumors.don't believe anyone who claims that they know the military budget because they don't nobody out there knows exactly how the egyptian army get their finances or how much is their budget not even the egyptian parliament and not even the government.


The military's "grey economy"
Khaled Fahmy, head of history at the American University in Cairo, calls this a "grey economy, in the sense that we know very little of them, they are not subject to any parliamentary scrutiny, the Egyptian government auditing office has no control or knowledge of them."
The Egyptian military empire
The Egyptian Armed Forces and the Remaking of an Economic Empire-Carnegie Middle East Center - Carnegie Endowment for International Peace
(note i haven't read the full articles)

 

[-SINAN-]

That's what iam trying to say the numbers you are relaying on are actually nothing but rumors.don't believe anyone who claims that they know the military budget because they don't nobody out there knows exactly how the egyptian army get their finances or how much is their budget not even the egyptian parliament and not even the government.


The military's "grey economy"
Khaled Fahmy, head of history at the American University in Cairo, calls this a "grey economy, in the sense that we know very little of them, they are not subject to any parliamentary scrutiny, the Egyptian government auditing office has no control or knowledge of them."
The Egyptian military empire
The Egyptian Armed Forces and the Remaking of an Economic Empire-Carnegie Middle East Center - Carnegie Endowment for International Peace
(note i haven't read the full articles)

Mate...what you are saying could be true. But considering your GDP.... i find it a bit unrealistic.

24 Rafales to be equipped with Meteors, Micas and black shaheens = 5.9 $Billion

Fremm frigate (another one under negotiations) = $1.19 Billion
4 Gowind corvettes (negotiations for 3 more) = $1.38 Billion
2 Mistrales = $1.06 billion
Sagem Patroller UAV to be locally produced in Egypt = $0.48 Billion

Germany
4 German Type 209 submarines = $2 Billion

Russia
Ka-52 helicopters for the Mistrales = $1.49 Billion
46 Mig 35 (many sources but needs further confirmation like the Mistrales) = $1.38 Billion
S300 VM (Antey-2500) = $4 Billion (my estimation)
R-32 Molniya missile boat = 0.5$ Billion (my estimation)

USA
20 F16 block 52+ with conformal fuel tanks (4200 km range) = $3.2 Billion
4 Ambassador MKlll stealth missile boats = $1.29 Billion

Spain
13 A400M Atlas tankers (Multipurpose military transport aircraft) = $1.92 Billion

Total of $20 Billion....%6.6 of the GDP...if you..... let's say, pay for them in 5 years...might be... Not very sure though.

@Neptune @LegionnairE What do you think bros ?

 

[xenon54 out]

Mate...what you are saying could be true. But considering your GDP.... i find it a bit unrealistic.

24 Rafales to be equipped with Meteors, Micas and black shaheens = 5.9 $Billion

Fremm frigate (another one under negotiations) = $1.19 Billion
4 Gowind corvettes (negotiations for 3 more) = $1.38 Billion
2 Mistrales = $1.06 billion
Sagem Patroller UAV to be locally produced in Egypt = $0.48 Billion

Germany
4 German Type 209 submarines = $2 Billion

Russia
Ka-52 helicopters for the Mistrales = $1.49 Billion
46 Mig 35 (many sources but needs further confirmation like the Mistrales) = $1.38 Billion
S300 VM (Antey-2500) = $4 Billion (my estimation)
R-32 Molniya missile boat = 0.5$ Billion (my estimation)

USA
20 F16 block 52+ with conformal fuel tanks (4200 km range) = $3.2 Billion
4 Ambassador MKlll stealth missile boats = $1.29 Billion

Spain
13 A400M Atlas tankers (Multipurpose military transport aircraft) = $1.92 Billion

Total of $20 Billion....%6.6 of the GDP...if you..... let's say, pay for them in 5 years...might be... Not very sure though.

@Neptune @LegionnairE What do you think bros ?

6.6% of GDP is quite a big number without foreign support, espacially for a big country like Egypt where the money is needed in infrastructure and state facilities.

 

[-SINAN-]

6.6% of GDP is quite a big number without foreign support, espacially for a big country like Egypt where the money is needed in infrastructure and state facilities.

Mate let's make a comparison with our defense budget.

Overall defense budget of Turkey in 2014 : $14.212 billion

Subtract Gendarmerie: $3.08 billion and the Coast Guard: $226 million

Which leaves : $10.908 Billion for the armed forces.

About half of Turkey’s defense budget goes to personnel spending (salaries, benefits and pensions), with the rest mostly going to finance new equipment and maintenance.

Subtract personnel spending and we have $5.454 and let's say 0.1 goes to maintance & repairs... $4.9 Billion left for the acquisitions .

Egypt Nominal GDP $272
Turkey Nominal GDP $806

In a similar fashion Egpts budget for new acquisitions should be around $1.6 Billion annually.

Where as they can buy $20 Billion worth of equipment.....interesting ain't it ?

 

[xenon54 out]

Mate let's make a comparison with our defense budget.

Overall defense budget of Turkey in 2014 : $14.212 billion

Subtract Gendarmerie: $3.08 billion and the Coast Guard: $226 million

Which leaves : $10.908 Billion for the armed forces.

About half of Turkey’s defense budget goes to personnel spending (salaries, benefits and pensions), with the rest mostly going to finance new equipment and maintenance.

Subtract personnel spending and we have $5.454 and let's say 0.1 goes to maintance & repairs... $4.9 Billion left for the acquisitions .

Egypt Nominal GDP $272
Turkey Nominal GDP $806

In a similar fashion Egpts budget for new acquisitions should be around $1.6 Billion annually.

Where as they can buy $20 Billion worth of equipment.....interesting ain't it ?

Bro Turkeys military spending was 19 billion in 2013, are you sure about the 14 billion in 2014?

Turkish Military Spending | 2014

 

[-SINAN-]

Bro Turkeys military spending was 19 billion in 2013, are you sure about the 14 billion in 2014?

Turkish Military Spending | 2014

SOurce from here. Turkey Increases Defense Spending in 2014 Budget | Defense News | defensenews.com

They add, subtract things like, in some sources they include police forces also.

Like according to wiki it was $22.6 in 2014.
List of countries by military expenditures - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[MICA]

Mate...what you are saying could be true. But considering your GDP.... i find it a bit unrealistic.

24 Rafales to be equipped with Meteors, Micas and black shaheens = 5.9 $Billion

Fremm frigate (another one under negotiations) = $1.19 Billion
4 Gowind corvettes (negotiations for 3 more) = $1.38 Billion
2 Mistrales = $1.06 billion
Sagem Patroller UAV to be locally produced in Egypt = $0.48 Billion

Germany
4 German Type 209 submarines = $2 Billion

Russia
Ka-52 helicopters for the Mistrales = $1.49 Billion
46 Mig 35 (many sources but needs further confirmation like the Mistrales) = $1.38 Billion
S300 VM (Antey-2500) = $4 Billion (my estimation)
R-32 Molniya missile boat = 0.5$ Billion (my estimation)

USA
20 F16 block 52+ with conformal fuel tanks (4200 km range) = $3.2 Billion
4 Ambassador MKlll stealth missile boats = $1.29 Billion

Spain
13 A400M Atlas tankers (Multipurpose military transport aircraft) = $1.92 Billion

Total of $20 Billion....%6.6 of the GDP...if you..... let's say, pay for them in 5 years...might be... Not very sure though.

@Neptune @LegionnairE What do you think bros ?

• Rafale Deal = $5.6 billion 50% cash and the rest is loans from french banks
• Gowind Deal = €1 billion
• Mistral Deal = €950 Million
• Sagem Deal = numbers was never revealed neither number of units or the deal costs.
• Type 209 can you provide the link with cost please ?
• all the F-16 fleet is paid from the US aid which was signed after peace treaty with israel first delivery was in 1982 and last one was yesterday.
• 4 Ambassador MKIII Ordered in 2008 and built specifically for egypt and paid by US aid.
• Mig Deal Link with Price details please ?
• Ka-52 Link with Price please ?
• S300 Deal most sources stated the deal between 3 and $3.5 B so again i need link with details ?
• Molniya Class = it was a gift from russia

13 A400M where did you find these numbers

 

[-SINAN-]

• Rafale Deal = $5.6 billion 50% cash and the rest is loans from french banks
• Gowind Deal = €1 billion
• Mistral Deal = €950 Million
• Sagem Deal = numbers was never revealed neither number of units or the deal costs.
• Type 209 can you provide the link with cost please ?
• all the F-16 fleet is paid from the US aid which was signed after peace treaty with israel first delivery was in 1982 and last one was yesterday.
• 4 Ambassador MKIII Ordered in 2008 and built specifically for egypt and paid by US aid.
• Mig Deal Link with Price details please ?
• Ka-52 Link with Price please ?
• S300 Deal most sources stated the deal between 3 and $3.5 B so again i need link with details ?
• Molniya Class = it was a gift from russia

13 A400M where did you find these numbers

Mate, if i had find the cost of the deal from internet, i wrote down it here. If i couldn't find the unit cost, multiplied by the unit number you wanted to buy.

 

[MICA]

Mate, if i had find the cost of the deal from internet, i wrote down it here. If i couldn't find the unit cost, multiplied by the unit number you wanted to buy.

then most of your claims are wrong unless you are a wizard , because wiki unit cost will never let you know the whole deal price , and if you read my previous comment you will notice that most of your claims are already wrong

 

[-SINAN-]

then most of your claims are wrong unless you are a wizard , because wiki unit cost will never let you know the whole deal price , and if you read my previous comment you will notice that most of your claims are already wrong

Mate, these are not claims but estimations. But these none the less are accurate estimations. I read your previous post and saw no sources for your claims on my estimations.

Let me give you an example.

• Sagem Deal = numbers was never revealed neither number of units or the deal costs.

Cairo placed a 24-unit order last February
Sagem signs teaming agreement to offer Patroller UAV to Egypt

24 units x 20 million. = 0.48 Billion. I know the whole packages price may differentiate but it gives an average price. Also note that i took the minimum value.

Another point is although 24 units might not be true. It felt not so wrong as we are operating 10 Herons and just ordered 10 ANKA-S. All UAVs are at the same class (MALE)

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I'm open to discussion. All i'm trying to figure out is; how Egypt will pay for these.

 

[MICA]

Mate, these are not claims but estimations. But these none the less are accurate estimations. I read your previous post and saw no sources for your claims on my estimations.

Let me give you an example.



Cairo placed a 24-unit order last February
Sagem signs teaming agreement to offer Patroller UAV to Egypt

View attachment 268304

24 units x 20 million. = 0.48 Billion. I know the whole packages price may differentiate but it gives an average price. Also note that i took the minimum value.

Another point is although 24 units might not be true. It felt not so wrong as we are operating 10 Herons and just ordered 10 ANKA-S. All UAVs are at the same class (MALE)

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

I'm open to discussion. All i'm trying to figure out is; how Egypt will pay for these.

i meant you were wrong about the F-16 , Ambassador and Molniya , i understand how u calculated but again this is just wrong , and about the Patroller UAV article you may need to read it again

"Egypt is in the process of modernizing its inventory of military equipment, and has already committed to purchase another French aircraft – the Dassault Rafale multi-role fighter. Cairo placed a 24-unit order last February"

they are talking about the 24 rafale which was ordered in February , as i said the uav deal details was never revealed neither the price nor the number of units ordered