Dr Tahir Shamsi says passive immunisation can treat coronavirus patients

[PakSword]

Dr Tahir Shamsi, the head of National Institute of Blood Diseases said, “The body of a COVID-19 patient creates antibodies to fight off the virus. These antibodies in the blood of a recovered patient could be used to boost the immunity of the newly infected people.”

According to the details, Top hematologist and transplant surgeon of Pakistan said that the blood of recovered patients of coronavirus– the mysterious respiratory illness caused by the novel COVID-19 which could be used to slow the spread of the deadly contagion which has killed more than 10,000 people and affected 254,801 others worldwide.

“We can save precious lives using this technique,” Dr Shamsi said while adding that the National Institute of Blood Diseases is fully equipped to successfully use this technique. “Doctors have saved hundreds of lives with the help of this technique in China since February,” he added.

While talking to the newspaper he further said, “A vaccine works by training the immune system to recognise and combat pathogens – either viruses or bacteria – by creating antibodies in the blood. And when the pathogens enters the body, the antibodies already present in the blood successfully fight it off.”

@Mangus Ortus Novem @masterchief_mirza @jaibi @Ace of Spades @Syed Hammad Ahmed @SIPRA @Path-Finder @Areesh @Verve @BHarwana @Blacklight @Dubious

https://www.bolnews.com/health/2020...s-patients-says-top-hematologist-of-pakistan/

 

[PakSword]

Today he also said in a program on Samaa TV that he has proposed an implementation program and waiting for the government to give him a go ahead. .

He says that the approval is expected from Imran Khan in a couple of days.. he is directly in contact with him..

He also said that US experts also believe that passive immunization by injecting plasma of recovered patients can save many lives..

If someone has the clip of that program, please post here..

This is a sound scientific idea... though blood needs to be from someone young... it needs further experiementations...

This might work...

May Allah make it a success!

He further said in the program (if I heard that correctly) that government is planning to ask Chinese help as there are many recovered patients in China, and China used the same method to contain this disease and to keep the death rates low..

 

[masterchief_mirza]

https://ccforum.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s13054-020-2818-6

Great initiative. The sooner Dr Shamsi trials this, the better! This is dependent on recovered patients being available and being fully recovered (I.e. negative PCR test for the virus itself). I hope this trial starts asap.

On a slightly separate note, why does his name ring a bell? Is this the same haematologist who treated nawaz Sharif's platelets??

 

[Dr. Strangelove]

Today he also said in a program on Samaa TV that he has proposed an implementation program and waiting for the government to give him a go ahead. .

He says that the approval is expected from Imran Khan in a couple of days.. he is directly in contact with him..

He also said that US experts also believe that passive immunization by injecting plasma of cured patients can save many lives..

If someone has the clip of that program, please post here..

This is not something new Researchers have proposed this several times in the past month. The problem with this is the cost involved and difficulty in extracting IVIGs. No one knows exactly how much IVIG would be required to treat one patient. May be you would need anywhere between 1-10 recovered people to treat just one person.

And its not a one time deal passive immunity gotten this way will go away in a month or two once Antibodies infused get broken down. Their own immune system has not been stimulated to produce its own Antibodies. And they could get reinfected so they are back to square one and neither could their plasma be used to treat others.

 

[PakSword]

This is a sound scientific idea... though blood needs to be from someone young... it needs further experiementations...

Many young will be available within Pakistan a couple of weeks later.. I don't expect many young people dying from this disease.. so they will be available.

And its not a one time deal passive immunity gotten this way will go away in a month or two once Antibodies infused get broken down. Their own immune system has not been stimulated to produce its own Antibodies. And they could get reinfected so they are back to square one and neither could their plasma be used to treat others.

Yeah, he is not the first one.. that's why he said Chinese are saving lives through this method since February.
He was confident in today's program..
I think he is suggesting to use on very sick patients.. which means the patient's body has started identifying the disease.. but it requires help which can be given in the form of plasma of a recovered patient..

What do you think doc?

 

[Ace of Spades]

It's a years old tested method and can work. But it's a temporary solution, kinda stopgap measure since it is a passive immunity and body won't start making active antibodies unless infected by the virus itself or via vaccination. But a very doable approach in vulnerable groups and severely sick.

 

[denel]

Dr Tahir Shamsi, the head of National Institute of Blood Diseases said, “The body of a COVID-19 patient creates antibodies to fight off the virus. These antibodies in the blood of a recovered patient could be used to boost the immunity of the newly infected people.”

According to the details, Top hematologist and transplant surgeon of Pakistan said that the blood of recovered patients of coronavirus– the mysterious respiratory illness caused by the novel COVID-19 which could be used to slow the spread of the deadly contagion which has killed more than 10,000 people and affected 254,801 others worldwide.

“We can save precious lives using this technique,” Dr Shamsi said while adding that the National Institute of Blood Diseases is fully equipped to successfully use this technique. “Doctors have saved hundreds of lives with the help of this technique in China since February,” he added.

While talking to the newspaper he further said, “A vaccine works by training the immune system to recognise and combat pathogens – either viruses or bacteria – by creating antibodies in the blood. And when the pathogens enters the body, the antibodies already present in the blood successfully fight it off.”

@Mangus Ortus Novem @masterchief_mirza @jaibi @Ace of Spades @Syed Hammad Ahmed @SIPRA @Path-Finder @Areesh @Verve @BHarwana @Blacklight @Dubious

Please ensure that the serum taken is checked and rechecked for other issues - hiv/hep first.

 

[PakSword]

Please ensure that the serum taken is checked and rechecked for other issues - hiv/hep first.

I am not the one doing that.. I am just telling that a proposal is with Pakistani government and decision is expected in a couple of days on that..

This will be used on very sick patients.. Most of the patients don't even require anything other than a paracetamol as far as I know.

 

[litman]

this idea is not new. passive immunity by injecting immunoglobulins taken from animals or humans is done for many other disease. rabies is treated that way . rabies vaccine is there but if the exact history about the dog or any other animal such as bats which has bitten the patient is not clear immuloglobulins are injected. they have immediate effect but lasts for shorter duration. but this treatment is very costly. i think a complete treatment of a suspected rabies patient costs more then 50000 pak rs.

 

[PakSword]

It's a years old tested method and can work. But it's a temporary solution, kinda stopgap measure since it is a passive immunity and body won't start making active antibodies unless infected by the virus itself or via vaccination. But a very doable approach in vulnerable groups and severely sick.

This is exactly what he said.. to be given to people who are very sick..

At one point, the body starts recognizing the enemy but it gets too weak to even make enough antibodies..

This method may support those patients who are very sick.

This can't be used as a vaccine of course..

 

[litman]

Please ensure that the serum taken is checked and rechecked for other issues - hiv/hep first.

that goes without saying. you cant expect that in today's world some institute will undergo the process of immunoglobulins without checking for other diseases.

 

[Ace of Spades]

I think he is suggesting to use on very sick patients.. which means the patient's body has started identifying the disease.. but it requires help which can be given in the form of plasma of a recovered patient..

Precisely, that's one way of the usage, in already sick. Second is to use it prophylactically with high risk population. But again a stopgap measure.

 

[masterchief_mirza]

This is not something new Researchers have proposed this several times in the past month. The problem with this is the cost involved and difficulty in extracting IVIGs. No one knows exactly how much IVIG would be required to treat one patient. May be you would need anywhere between 1-10 recovered people to treat just one person.

And its not a one time deal passive immunity gotten this way will go away in a month or two once Antibodies infused get broken down. Their own immune system has not been stimulated to produce its own Antibodies. And they could get reinfected so they are back to square one and neither could their plasma be used to treat others.

Yep, far from a perfect treatment but the key in Pakistan should be to get people stable enough to be out of intensive care and on a non-intensive isolation ward. Such treatment is standard protocol for some diseases, e.g.rabies. If ivig dampens lung damage enough to save people from ventilators then it would be a great way to go. This has to be the priority in Pakistan - if there is no cure, at least give something to lessen disease severity so everyone gets a fighting chance.

 

[PakSword]

Precisely, that's one way of the usage, in already sick. Second is to use it prophylactically with high risk patients. But again a stopgap measure.

What if the patient's body has already recognized the virus but due to weakness/ old age, can't make enough to counter that virus.. and help is arrived in the form of plasma of a recovered person? I think his immune system can take a sigh of relief and continue making antibodies after plasma finishes its job..

Yep, far from a perfect treatment but the key in Pakistan should be to get people stable enough to be out of intensive care and on a non-intensive isolation ward. Such treatment is standard protocol for some diseases, e.g.rabies. If ivig dampens lung damage enough to save people from ventilators then it would be a great way to go. This has to be the priority in Pakistan - if there is no cure, at least give something to lessen disease severity so everyone gets a fighting chance.

Yaar I am unable to find the clip.. dr. tahir said that he is in direct contact with Imran Khan and decision on using this method is expected in just two days.

Also, he said that he has enough means to manage the job.. but I think government is also planning to talk to China on this..

 

[Ace of Spades]

What if the patient's body has already recognized the virus but due to weakness/ old age, can't make enough to counter that virus.. and help is arrived in the form of plasma of a recovered person? I think his immune system can take a sigh of relief and continue making antibodies after plasma finishes its job..

That's indeed the indication. Can be of help in severely sick whose body can't cope it by itself.