Does US install secret sensors in military equipment given to Pakistan?

[pak-yes]

Well unfortunately the thread is already derailed and in part because of me.Guys no fighting pls peaceful discussion

 

[Novice09]

Old news but it can address forum members' concerns

China finds spy bugs in Jiang's Boeing jet - Telegraph

- CHINA claims to have found almost 30 surveillance bugs, including one in the headboard of the presidential bed, on a Boeing 767 that had just been delivered from America to serve as President Jiang Zemin's official aircraft.

- A search of the twin-engined aircraft, which was manufactured and fitted out in America, yielded 27 devices, according to Chinese officials, hidden in its seats, lavatory and panelling.

- It was customised for the Chinese president by the San Antonio-based company.

- Army scientists will now have the opportunity to "reverse engineer" the latest in American surveillance equipment.

 

[graphican]

Leave military hardware..what about US financial aid ? IMF & ADB all have American Leverage....Pakistan won't survive without US help (with its heavy deft and poor repayment history) THIS ALL HAPPENED BECOZE U PEOPLE ONLY HAD INDIA CENTRIC VIEWS..nothing else...Since independence Pak's only aim was to defeat INDIA & win Kashmir.Now what the point in cutting Off relations with US..(from frying pan to fire) I think there r no alternatives other than comply with US at present and work towards less dependence on US aid in future.Make peace with INDIA at any cost.
Hope am not derailing the thread !!!

American aid given to Pakistan helps America back. This aid is used to support corrupt and inapt politicians that cannot stand otherwise, and because American help them stay and rule, America get favors from them that were previously not possible. Look at the present government that intervenes every time an American misbehave or violate law of the land and this was only because of government's help that Black Water, Xe and Dynacore were able to get in.

Pakistan would never die because of shortage of money. The moment we did Nuclear Explosions, we were down to 300 million dollars as compared to 12 Bullion dollars of India's foreign reserves. We survived sanctions and the toughest economic crunch and we can do that again. America fills the pocket of "few" and get favours from them. American aid is not for the Pakitani Nation and a common man on ground has this (lu*d) benefit of that money.

 

[graphican]

Old news but it can address forum members' concerns

China finds spy bugs in Jiang's Boeing jet - Telegraph

- CHINA claims to have found almost 30 surveillance bugs, including one in the headboard of the presidential bed, on a Boeing 767 that had just been delivered from America to serve as President Jiang Zemin's official aircraft.

- A search of the twin-engined aircraft, which was manufactured and fitted out in America, yielded 27 devices, according to Chinese officials, hidden in its seats, lavatory and panelling.

- It was customised for the Chinese president by the San Antonio-based company.

- Army scientists will now have the opportunity to "reverse engineer" the latest in American surveillance equipment.

Wao, Chinese are the coolest people on the face of the earth. Instead of throwing American Spy Equipment on their face back, they are going to reverse engineer and learn the best tech out on the planet. you .

 

[Novice09]

Wao, Chinese are the coolest people on the face of the earth. Instead of throwing American Spy Equipment on their face back, they are going to reverse engineer and learn the best tech out on the planet. you .

This is from that news... read that news b4

 

[TruthSeeker]

- CHINA claims to have found almost 30 surveillance bugs, including one in the headboard of the presidential bed, on a Boeing 767 that had just been delivered from America to serve as President Jiang Zemin's official aircraft.

Yeah! they found the easy ones. The ones we wanted them to find. Now they are confident that all bugs are gone. How do they know how many remain!

 

[S-2]

Why would the Chinese reverse engineer a device for which they can already detect? I would hope hubris doesn't run sufficiently amuck in Beijing to believe only they have the means to detect such.

I really don't believe the article but I'm very happy they found everything. Now when the captain signals to turn all electronic devices off in the cabin prior to takeoff or landing, we'll all feel more comfortable knowing that all devices, indeed, are turned off.

Maybe...

Thanks.

 

[TaimiKhan]

Yeah! they found the easy ones. The ones we wanted them to find. Now they are confident that all bugs are gone. How do they know how many remain!

That is why they did not used it for the intended purpose.

 

[fhassan]

This is actually quite serious, I'm surprised people are taking it lightheartedly!

 

[pak-yes]

This is actually quite serious, I'm surprised people are taking it lightheartedly!

They just dont believe that US could do it.

 

[TruthSeeker]

This is actually quite serious, I'm surprised people are taking it lightheartedly!

I think it is funny that Pakistanis see a conspiracy under every rock and behind every tree. Such constant worry over USA conspiracies is gonna cause the brains of the Pakistani nation to explode! Conspiracies against the USA may be going on constantly, also, but we Yanks are too laid back to worry (or too dumb?). Anyway, whatever floats your boat......

 

[graphican]

Naturally, we (Indian's & US) are friends. Even Chinese & Indians have military relationships. We are friends... NOT ALLIES.

In my opinion, we hardly have few friends in life. A friend is person who does not do trade of favours or would expect you to return the favour before he would offer next favour and that holds true for the countries too. Considering that, Pakistan and Saudi Arabia are friends, Pakistan and Turkey are friends, Pakistan and China are friends but Pakistan and America are traders of favors.

In your case, India-USA ties is also a trade of favors. America hasn't asked India to return the favor as yet but by strengthening India, it is attempting to weaken China. When USA tries to make India stronger, it is not the wellbeing of people of India in mind but the thought that stronger Indian would give hard time to America's enemy, China. But India's ties Israel are friendly and you both offer each other more than you have taken back. So enjoy that, BUT be careful of America and this is all I can suggest you.

 

[Penguin]

Another example was the Iraqi Radars and Anti-Aircraft Batteries KILL CODES provided by the Russians to the US during the first wave of US aircraft bombing run on Baghdad in Desert Storm One. Not a single Iraqi Radar System (whihc were quite advanced and well networked) was able to detect the US in coming aircraft.

By the summer of 1990, Iraq possessed 16,000 radar-guided and heatseeking surface-to-air missiles (SAMs), including the Soviet SA-2, SA-3, SA-6, SA-7, SA-8, SA-9, SA-13, SA-14, and SA-16, and the Franco-German Roland. Additional air defense was provided by Air Force interceptors and organic Army assets, including the SA-7/14, SA-8, SA-9/13, SA-16 missile systems, and the ZSU-23/4 self-propelled AAA system. In addition, the Iraqi air defense had more than 7,500 AAA pieces protecting all targets of value, some deployed on the roofs of numerous buildings in Baghdad housing government facilities. These weapons -- 57-mm and 37-mm AAA pieces, ZSU-23/4 and ZSU-57/2 self-propelled AAA systems, and hundreds of 14.5-mm and 23-mm light antiaircraft weapons -- formed the backbone of the integrated air defense network. In major high value target areas (such as Baghdad, airfields, chemical agent production complexes, and nuclear facilities) the combined arms air defense could prove lethal to aircraft operating below 10,000 feet.

The UN and Kuwait say Iraq did not return extensive Kuwaiti military equipment, including one Hawk battery and 675 Russian-made surface-to-air missile batteries.

Iraqi Air Defense - Introduction
Iraqi Air Defense - Equipment

The above Russian systems as well as the radars associated with them weren't the most impressive even in those days. They were old and well-known from the Vietnam war, the wars in the Middle East and other conflcits. By 1991, these could easily and effectively be JAMMED.

Air Defense of Ground Troops (PVO Sukhoputnykh Voysk)
Russian Missiles
Russian Air Defense Radars

Radar guided missiles
* SA-2 deployment began on a wide scale since early 1958
* SA-3 was first introduced into operational service in 1961
* SA-6 was accepted into service in 1967 and went into production that same year
* SA-8 was first introduced in 1971-1972

IR-Homing missiles (not radar guided):
* SA-7 MANPADS entered service in 1968, with series production starting in 1970
* SA-9 entered service in 1968
* SA-13 entered service in 1979
* SA-14 MANPADS accepted to service in the Soviet Army in January 1974.
* SA-16 MANPADS igla-1 entered service in 1981 and igla in 1983

Radarguided SPAAG
* ZSU-57/2 entered service in 1955
* ZSU-23/4 entered service in 1962

AAA
* ZPU-4 entered services in 1949
* ZU-23-2 entered service in 1960
* 37mm AAA cannon date as far back as WW2
* 57mm AAA cannon date from 1947-48

Even the non-Russian systems were at least a decade old by Desert Storm.

Roland 1 - manual optical tracking and guidance, entered service 1977
Roland 2 - full automatic tracking and guidance with radar, 1981
Roland 3 - extended range, enlarged warhead, 1988

MIM-23 Hawk was initially deployed by the U.S. Army in 1959, and by the US Marine Corps in 1960. (Iraqi forces captured four or five Kuwaiti Hawk batteries in 1990. The captured systems are unlikely to have been fully mastered and integrated into the AD-system by 1991)

 

[Penguin]

I was wondering that Pakistan get's a lot of equipment from US.So isn't it logical to install some secret sensors in it.However after reading some threads i though it was necessary to make another thread for this discussion.I know that people will say that Pakistan is more than capable to detect such spy equipment.But is Pakistan really capable?.As everyone knows that US is very much technologically very advanced so maybe they put some spy equipment that are so much hidden that we can't detect them.F-16s,Frigates from US.Also is it true that during the tomahawk strike on Afghanistan were Pakistani radars jammed.

- Is there (or has there ever been) any evidence or even a clear indication that this is in fact the case with US supplied equipment, whether in Pakistan or elsewhere?
- Is there (or has there ever been) any evidence or even a clear indication that this is in fact the case with equipment supplied by other nations than the US, whether in Pakistan or elsewhere?

 

[Kompromat]

IMO Lack of trust between USA and Pakistan has a major impact on both countries , USA when being the major supplier let us down and left us vulnerable to Polar bears and Indians by freezing our much needed F-16's.

During all major conflicts USA stopped our arms supply so all of these factors have put Pakistan on a route to Indigenous/Joint productions.

Learning the lessons from Pakistan and considering Pakistan's importance in Muslim world United state will lose a major share of its arms supply to China in coming years.

Today no fighter jet in the world can compete JF-17 thunder's Performance and Price tag and home production options.
If i am not mistaken if Pakistan and China Take Thunder program's export seriously all of those Mig-21's ( about 8000+) Mig-23's Older sukhoi's Mirages and F-5 E , F-4 Phantoms can be replaced by this Affordable fighter .

It will generate a hell lots of money which can be put back into the production
and for 5th generation fighter.

Hence in my opinion the only way Pakistan should follow is the way of
Indigenous Production of all major Military hardware.

Regards: