Dassault Rafale, tender | News & Discussions [Thread 2]

[punit]

If this is true then MoD should be congratulated for its negotiation skills for bring down from $12 Billion to $8.8 Billion.

Further will MoD pursue with F-18s & F-16s offer ?

F18 and F16 were bogeymen !

 

[PARIKRAMA]

@PARIKRAMA
Bro you mentioned 300 LCA will be built does this include Indian Navy as well? This is the 1st time I'm hearing a number of 300. What will it include?

Also.....90 Rafales will be built in India, does the contract have an option of 45+ jets as a follow-on order?

Its what has been discussed. The present LCA orders is just tranche 1. thats for MK1A product.. post that a repeat order will be given for same product line or an improved version based on the development plan results.

Naval ones are touted to be capped at 40-60. Mostly the real naval plane wont be of light category so its more of a technology proof towards AMCA naval variant.

Rafales 90 are tranche 1. There would be more tranches. For the amount we are paying and for the fact that there would be more orders to Merignac line for quicker induction schedules, the numbers needed are much bigger.

with just 90, the MII establishment and cost incurred wont be justified

 

[Manindra]

Wait, in some report its saying that deal cost 9 billion Euro aka 10.15 billion US dollar, then from where 8.8 billion US dollar figure come from ?

 

[Nilgiri]

Wait, in some report its saying that deal cost 9 billion Euro aka 10.15 billion US dollar, then from where 8.8 billion US dollar figure come from ?

I'm hearing 7.8 billion Euro. Lets wait for the final deal...too much friggin speculation.

What matters is the fine print on whats covered by the final price anyway.

 

[Nilgiri]

Its what has been discussed. The present LCA orders is just tranche 1. thats for MK1A product.. post that a repeat order will be given for same product line or an improved version based on the development plan results.

Naval ones are touted to be capped at 40-60. Mostly the real naval plane wont be of light category so its more of a technology proof towards AMCA naval variant.

Rafales 90 are tranche 1. There would be more tranches. For the amount we are paying and for the fact that there would be more orders to Merignac line for quicker induction schedules, the numbers needed are much bigger.

with just 90, the MII establishment and cost incurred wont be justified

How long is the production line open for within France (given they just have a relatively few number of orders from other countries and are wrapping up their own domestic requirement)? Are we just moving the production line from there to India in essence? It would be advantage for India if so since any future rafale exports to other countries will be sourced from Indian based production line. I wonder if this is on the anvil as part of the future tranches to make them more cost effective/viable.

@Vauban @Taygibay votre opinion SVP

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

Wasn't the original deal $11 billion for 126 Rafale?

Now it's almost as much ($9 billion) for only 36 Rafale?

That is some serious inflation.

 

[PARIKRAMA]

How long is the production line open for within France (given they just have a relatively few number of orders from other countries and are wrapping up their own domestic requirement)? Are we just moving the production line from there to India in essence? It would be advantage for India if so since any future rafale exports to other countries will be sourced from Indian based production line. I wonder if this is on the anvil as part of the future tranches to make them more cost effective/viable.

@Vauban @Taygibay votre opinion SVP

its a capacity expansion plan not transferring the line..
Implying Indian line will exist independent of Merignac line which will be there for long long time..

There are markets to cater too via Merignac line.. Even we ourselves may order more from Merignac owing to immediate needs for IN jets.

Only ydy in another forum , a professional called Vstol says IAC1 may sport Rafales.. such a case IAC1 is suppose to come by 2019 and thus a contingent of 42-45 Rafale M cant be build in Indian line and has to be then ordered from Merignac..

Some part of our line will be used for exports but primarily our own order catering would be there as order is big and timelines are set with late production penalty

 

[Shinigami]

Wasn't the original deal $11 billion for 126 Rafale?

Now it's almost as much ($9 billion) for only 36 Rafale?

That is some serious inflation.

the $11 billion for 126 aircraft was drafted almost 2 decades back, so obviously its inflation

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

the $11 billion for 126 aircraft was drafted almost 2 decades back, so obviously its inflation

Two decades? The Rafale won the Indian deal in 2012, only a few years ago.

Almost 300% inflation (in the per aircraft costs) for a few years isn't exactly normal.

 

[Nilgiri]

Wasn't the original deal $11 billion for 126 Rafale?

Now it's almost as much ($9 billion) for only 36 Rafale?

That is some serious inflation.

We have covered this many times.

The numbers do not cover the same things. The former is just mostly airframe based. The current numbers are total life cycles costs +weapons.

 

[#hydra#]

its a capacity expansion plan not transferring the line..
Implying Indian line will exist independent of Merignac line which will be there for long long time..

There are markets to cater too via Merignac line.. Even we ourselves may order more from Merignac owing to immediate needs for IN jets.

Only ydy in another forum , a professional called Vstol says IAC1 may sport Rafales.. such a case IAC1 is suppose to come by 2019 and thus a contingent of 42-45 Rafale M cant be build in Indian line and has to be then ordered from Merignac..

Some part of our line will be used for exports but primarily our own order catering would be there as order is big and timelines are set with late production penalty

I think rafale needs ti be modified for its operation from iac1,mainly for foldable wings. It will be a coatly affair.

Its what has been discussed. The present LCA orders is just tranche 1. thats for MK1A product.. post that a repeat order will be given for same product line or an improved version based on the development plan results.

Naval ones are touted to be capped at 40-60. Mostly the real naval plane wont be of light category so its more of a technology proof towards AMCA naval variant.

Rafales 90 are tranche 1. There would be more tranches. For the amount we are paying and for the fact that there would be more orders to Merignac line for quicker induction schedules, the numbers needed are much bigger.

with just 90, the MII establishment and cost incurred wont be justified

Is there any chance of lcamk2 flying for iaf?

 

[Shinigami]

Two decades? The Rafale won the Indian deal in 2012, only a few years ago.

Almost 300% inflation (in the per aircraft costs) for a few years isn't exactly normal.

its 126 aircraft not rafales einstein

The IAF projected a requirement for about 126 aircraft in 2001
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indian_MRCA_competition

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

its 126 aircraft not rafales einstein

Huh?

Indian sources (and the Indian defence minster) clearly said 126 Rafales:

Deal for 126 Rafale jets ‘economically unviable’: Defence Minister Manohar Parrikar - Indian Express

Einstein.

 

[Dash]

Its what has been discussed. The present LCA orders is just tranche 1. thats for MK1A product.. post that a repeat order will be given for same product line or an improved version based on the development plan results.

Naval ones are touted to be capped at 40-60. Mostly the real naval plane wont be of light category so its more of a technology proof towards AMCA naval variant.

Rafales 90 are tranche 1. There would be more tranches. For the amount we are paying and for the fact that there would be more orders to Merignac line for quicker induction schedules, the numbers needed are much bigger.

with just 90, the MII establishment and cost incurred wont be justified

Just read in TOI, there is a mandatory cause of of a follow on of 18 which purplexes me.

I could go by the only fact that IAF might not get anymore but navy will.

Top back Pic, it is precisely because of the canards that low speeds for carrier landing were achieved.
There are countless documents, written and video, with Dassault people stating the fact.

Good day all, Tay.

Tayji...there is no disagreement that canrads are helpful as additional control surfaces to control flight characteristics.

I was only saying that lift comes from broader surfaces such as wings. Anyway that's for another day

 

[kaykay]

I will wait till deal is officially signed....