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CPEC a game changer ?

I remember just a couple of days back, I saw an interview in some Pakistani news channel. One of the guest asked why are we gloating so much about CPEC? Firstly, we would be under so much loan, that whatever little we will gain, will be used up in paying interests.

Secondly, CPEC is essentially a trade route, just like Panama Canal or Suez Canal. Did it make Panama or Egypt an economic giant??

Answer is a big NO...



A guy just got a bicycle on rent from a shop and thinking that his neighbor (who owns a Ferrari) must be jealous of him! :p:


Completely false logic. Which is far removed from the ground reality in Pakistan. Which I can confirm from my recent trip to Pakistan. It's not the trade route of CPEC that is causing a stir, it's the MASSIVE infrastructure projects that are going on all over Pakistan ESPECIALLY along the CPEC route. There are massive projects on a scale that has never ever been seen before in Pakistan's history. 2 years ago everyone would have said this was impossible. But now it is a reality. The same was said about our nuclear weapons program. There is a reason WHY our Chinese brothers and sisters helped Pakistan becomes a nuclear weapons state. It is the same reason why they now want Pakistan to become a nation that is economically, scientifically, technologically and militarily powerful. This will be realised and come true no matter what our enemies say or do. It can't be stopped. Just like NO ONE could stop us from becoming a nuclear weapons state.
 
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CPEC can only become a game changer when Pakistani have accomplished the following steps.

1. Fix doors and fences. That means national defense. The fact that US can fly their drone over without telling Pakistan government is a bad sign.
2. Clean the house. That means internal peace. Sweep all domestic terrorists. Maintain peaceful relationship between different groups or ethnics or religious factions, etc.
3. After #1 and #2 are accomplished, open doors. That means to eagerly compete for business with the rest of the world. That is time when CPEC can make a difference. How successful CPEC will be highly depends on how #1 and #2 are done and how earnestly Pakistani engage in world market.
 
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It's shocking how little people understand what we call 'CPEC'.

Ok I have been reading about CPEC and its impact on Pakistan and the region. Now can someone please correct me if I am wrong, from a nutshell it looks like a well oiled transit route which China will use to egress and ingress its products easily to the outside world and Pakistan.

Some quick questions.

- What does Pakistan gain from it apart from transit fees ?

- Is the term "game changer" being used without being backed by concrete facts and figures ?

- What is the main Pakistani export to China that is currently not being undertaken using the current road networks

/Peace


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http://www.dawn.com/news/1236949

CPEC is not a road, it's a portfolio for a diverse list of investments totalling almost half of one hundred billion dollars. And there's more yet to come. It's a significant opportunity for Pakistan to invest in energy projects, infrastructure, revitalising industry and skills. Gwadar to Kashgar trade links are one small part, you don't spend $46 billion developing a port and a few roads.

Pakistan's media is doing a pathetic job telling us the actual worth and nature of these projects, your post hints at the same understanding based on the oversimplification of what this all actually means.
 
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I dont think they are going to get any transit fee... Roads are built by them and pakistan has to repay at a rate of 18% on dollar value... Gwadar is leased for 40 years as of now and chinese have all rights on port.. no fees for Pakistan as per my understanding... power plants are also chinese companies, chinese engineers and chinese maintenance... but pakistan has to payback at 18% interest rate... i am not sure what pakistan will gain...

local businesses will thrive.. enterpreneurs will bloom in SMEs mostly... those will generate taxes.. but wil they offset the loss and compensate for 18% annual interest rate ?? Big question.

and NO, there might not be any major exports from pakistan except mangoes.


Any source for your claim of 18% interest rate?
 
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Cpec can be pakistan's google...

Like google services are free for users... and like google u make money from traffic not services....
Keep in mind google is 2nd largest company in world and does not charge any thing to its customers from day 1 when it was valued at 16000 dollars....

Make money from traffic....
 
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One analogy could be the US railway link that connected the east coast to the west coast, which opened up the west coast link with the pacific ocean and made california the richest state in the USA. China only has east coast and no west coast. West coast can be provided by Pakistan. That is the ultimate potential. Base case could be that Pakistan handles Chinese trade of 100 billion dollars which will make gwadar a city like Karachi. That will add 20% to the GDP, 50% to govt taxes and a decent living to 5 million Pakistanis.
 
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Ok I have been reading about CPEC and its impact on Pakistan and the region. Now can someone please correct me if I am wrong, from a nutshell it looks like a well oiled transit route which China will use to egress and ingress its products easily to the outside world and Pakistan.

Some quick questions.

- What does Pakistan gain from it apart from transit fees ?

- Is the term "game changer" being used without being backed by concrete facts and figures ?

- What is the main Pakistani export to China that is currently not being undertaken using the current road networks

/Peace


_______________________________________

http://www.dawn.com/news/1236949
CPEC has the potential to be very benefical to Pakistan as it is clearly a massive amount of investment (pledged) for a infrastructure starved nation.

That said, there is a serious risk that if the returns are not as high as expected or there are serious implementation issues that the next generation of Pakistani taxpayer will be heavily burdened as Pakistan has given China almost unheard of return rates (7-30%) and the Pakistani govt has given sovereign guarentees for all of these loans. China could end up effectively owning the state of Pakistan. Pakistan is already in a circular debt trap and CPEC could make this exponentially worse.

CPEC won't transform Pakistan, this is something that many here won't accept BUT it will help in improving their economy IF everything works out.
 
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CPEC has the potential to be very benefical to Pakistan as it is clearly a massive amount of investment (pledged) for a infrastructure starved nation.

That said, there is a serious risk that if the returns are not as high as expected or there are serious implementation issues that the next generation of Pakistani taxpayer will be heavily burdened as Pakistan has given China almost unheard of return rates (7-30%) and the Pakistani govt has given sovereign guarentees for all of these loans. China could end up effectively owning the state of Pakistan. Pakistan is already in a circular debt trap and CPEC could make this exponentially worse.

CPEC won't transform Pakistan, this is something that many here won't accept BUT it will help in improving their economy IF everything works out.
Again, how do you source your claims ?
 
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Which part do you disagree with?
China almost unheard of return rates (7-30%) and the Pakistani govt has given sovereign guarentees for all of these loans
Where have you sourced such nonsense from ?

Secondly, CPEC is essentially a trade route, just like Panama Canal or Suez Canal. Did it make Panama or Egypt an economic giant??
LOl at your comprehension skills. The fact that you are comparing it with Suez and Panama leak canals shows that you dont even have slightest Idea of what is going around and that you have already started to leak.

Did you even bother to read what CPEC is all about ? Do you even know what is Economic corridor and what projects are included in it, apart from ONLY road ?
 
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Pakistan has a great military, the only Muslim nuclear power but without economy to back it, it has scant credibility and whatever say it had in Middle East in 70s and 80s or in world affairs is also diminished.

Again if Pakistan has this type of economy thats on crutches of foreign loans, Pakistan still will not be able to utilize CPEC to its advantage.

Actually, Pakistan has a strategic location which has benefited powers before and will continue to benefit future powers if we dont have the strong economy. Every time there is war in Afghanistan, we are the natural passage and our strategic location has been used so far by US and now China will use it for CPEC. Pakistani nation will just be a bystander.
 
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@A-Team First I need to compliment you for opening this thread. One look at the map and it is very obvious that Afghanistan is as tied into the fate of the CPEC as Pakistan for the simple fact (Indian's need to note this) that major portion of Afghan population live adjacent to Peshwar. In fact Kunduz - Kabul - Peshawar - Islamabad - Lahore lie on the same transport axis. Indeed Kabul and the region around it with very high population falls within the Indus Basin catchment area via the Kabul River. Below. Population density map.

Afghan_Pop.jpg


CkK7abO.jpg


The above map shows the transport corridor that connects the high density areas of Afghanistan (including Kabul) to high density areas of Pakistan (including Islamabad). Of course the eastern point on this terminus is Lahore which is adjacent to Amritsar in Indian Punjab and I don't think that border is going to open anytime soon.

The Af-Pak corridor is marked red. However what is interesting is that one of the alignments of the CPEC (marked green) running from China to Islamabad (where it meets the Af-Pak corridor) on south to Gwadar and Karachi. This means that potentially CPEC could impact Afghanistan as much as Pakistan. This is plainly obvious by looking at the maps. That this potential will actualized very much depends on regional politics which is something that hot heads on both sides need to bear in mind. Over the long term those Afghan refugees everybody complains so much about might turn out to be asset for Pakistan as their presence will reinforce the Af-Pak corridor which links into the CPEC near Islamabad/Taxila.

The real question that needs answering and OP brought that up was "what is CPEC all about". I can't believe that after so much song and dance about this CPEC the real question as to what it is all about has not been resolved. So here is my take on it. Imagine this desert below.

desert-test.jpg


There is almost no economic activity. It is almost disconnected from the vibrant pulsating centres of world economic powerhouses. Now imagine your going to build a canal through it. What would you look forward to? Charging transit fee for the water discharge along the canal? Or emergency supply of drinking water to some town downstream?

Well you could just dream of those two benefits that the canal would bless the desert inhabitants. Or you could think big. You could think of the canal as offering huge potential to bring about revolution to the backward desert.

(i) The desert could be irrigated to become huge farming country.
(ii) massive agriculture exports
(iii) towns develop to service the farms
(iv) industries develop to service agriculture
(v) exports connect you to markets far way. Imports come from far away.
(vi) You are now connected to the world which brings new ideas and ways of doing things.

In the same way do not regard the CPEC as strip of tarmac. Regard it as corridor to China which is pulsating economic powerhouse. Down that corridor will come cascading Chinese goods, ideas, industrial investment. Yes of course the Chinese economic wind will kill many industries in Pakistan. But why should anybody care? Do you guy's want rackets run by corrupt rentier class to continue milching the Pakistani customer?

As much as Chinese influence will kill many decrepit industries inside Pakistan it will also hasten new investment by Chinese companies which will bring their way of doing business to Pakistan. This is comparable (to a degree) how new entrants to European Union go through after joining. As they join the old inefficient industries are wiped out as western products flood the market. However soon enough those western companies start moving some of thier operation over to those countries because of cheap labour.

So it all depends on Pakistan. If it does this properly Pakistan will get flooded by Chinese products followed by Chinese companies moving in. A common market could come about out of CPEC. Will CPEC potential be exploited by Pakistan. My concern is that Pakistan's fascination with run awy religion might trip CPEC. If Pak can muzzle the mullahs and instead create pragmatic business climate than this could be game changer and Afghanistan being next door could also be sucked into this.

@nang2 Excellant points you make. If Pakistan can follow China in letter and spirit then CPEC would turn into 21st century success story. In thirty years time if Islamabad Airport is recieving 10 million visitors from China and the airport is linked daily to every major Chinese city than CPEC will have been a "game changer".
 
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Ok I have been reading about CPEC and its impact on Pakistan and the region. Now can someone please correct me if I am wrong, from a nutshell it looks like a well oiled transit route which China will use to egress and ingress its products easily to the outside world and Pakistan.

Some quick questions.

- What does Pakistan gain from it apart from transit fees ?

- Is the term "game changer" being used without being backed by concrete facts and figures ?

- What is the main Pakistani export to China that is currently not being undertaken using the current road networks

/Peace


_______________________________________

http://www.dawn.com/news/1236949

I don't quite understand transit economy..
Pakistan was major transit hub for NATO containers heading to Afghanistan for 10-12 years? Earned billions in both transit fees and other aid support, which would have financed energy plants and other industries...advanced NATO countries were moving their cargo through Pakistan for over a decade, how did it really change anything for Pakistan?.
 
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@Oscar Could please be kind enough to supervise this thread and have a look at deliberate trolling by Indian losers, I mean members
 
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