Civil war in Ukraine: News & discussion

[Hindustani78]

Ukraine truce hangs in balance after 'difficult' talks - Yahoo News

Donetsk separatist leader Alexander Zakharchenko told reporters on Thursday that the "very difficult" process would now involve videoconference consultations that should stretch into the weekend.

Both he and security sources in Kiev said that a deal on the terms of a prisoner swap involving 150 Ukrainian soldiers and 225 guerrillas was the only tangible achievement of Wednesday's talks.

State security sources in Kiev said this would leave the separatists in eastern Ukraine holding about 500 government soldiers.

Ukraine would be ready to exchange them for several dozen rebels still languishing in the country's jails.

NATO believes the rebel surge was backed by crack Russian forces and tanks, witnessed by reporters on the ground at the time.

But Russian President Vladimir Putin denies sending in his army and calls soldiers who crossed into the war zone volunteers who were "answering the call of the heart".

A source close to the Kiev delegation said the rebels pressed demands on Wednesday that went far outside the scope of the original Minsk deal.

"If we continue these consultations, it should only be in order to sign the Minsk (deal) and to develop them further -- and not to revise them, which is what the Donetsk and Lugansk representatives tried to do," the source told the Interfax-Ukraine news agency.

A Ukrainian helicopter flies past the headquarters of the Ukrainian forces in Kramatorsk, in the Donetsk region, on December 24, 2014

Alexander Zakharchenko, leader of the self-proclaimed Donetsk People's Republic, meets with families in Donetsk on November 22, 2014 (AFP Photo/Menahem Kahana)

Ukrainian government army soldiers secure an area near the village of Debaltseve, Donetsk region, eastern Ukraine Wednesday, Dec 24, 2014. Peace talks aimed at reaching a stable cease-fire in Ukraine between its government forces and pro-Russian armed groups began on Wednesday in Minsk, Belarus, with the discussions to include a pullout of heavy weapons and an exchange of war prisoners. (AP Photo/Sergei Chuzavkov)

Ukrainian government army soldiers secure an area near the village of Debaltseve, Donetsk region, eastern Ukraine Wednesday, Dec 24, 2014. Peace talks aimed at reaching a stable cease-fire in Ukraine between its government forces and pro-Russian armed groups began on Wednesday in Minsk, Belarus, with the discussions to include a pullout of heavy weapons and an exchange of war prisoners. (AP Photo/Sergei Chuzavkov)

Ukrainian government army soldiers at a check-point near the village of Debaltseve, Donetsk region, eastern Ukraine Wednesday, Dec 24, 2014. Peace talks aimed at reaching a stable cease-fire in Ukraine between its government forces and pro-Russian armed groups began on Wednesday in Minsk, Belarus, with the discussions to include a pullout of heavy weapons and an exchange of war prisoners. (AP Photo/Sergei Chuzavkov)

Ukrainian soldiers man the frontline outside the eastern Ukrainian city of Debaltseve, Donetsk Oblast, on Dec. 24,2014. The nation's parliament voted to revoke neutral status in the wake of Russian aggression this year.

Ukrainian government army soldiers patrol an area in the village of Debaltseve, Donetsk region, eastern Ukraine on Dec 24, 2014.

 

[Superboy]

Woohoo. Snow melted in Donbas. Can they start fighting again?

 

[Hindustani78]

Woohoo. Snow melted in Donbas. Can they start fighting again?

it means that Ukrainian army is in control over there.

 

[Superboy]

it means that Ukrainian army is in control over there.

Only the big cities like the capitals Donetsk and Lugansk are important. As you drive in the country, you will notice humans only live in cities and most areas of the Earth's land is not settled by humans but by wild animals. Humans are puny compared to nature.

 

[Hindustani78]

Only the big cities like the capitals Donetsk and Lugansk are important. As you drive in the country, you will notice humans only live in cities and most areas of the Earth's land is not settled by humans but by wild animals. Humans are puny compared to nature.

Donetsk and Lugansk are like city of the province and Donetsk is the 5th largest city of Ukraine where as Lugansk the 11th largest city. i know both these cities are important for the Ukrainians as its about sovereignty.

 

[Superboy]

Donetsk and Lugansk are like city of the province and Donetsk is the 5th largest city of Ukraine where as Lugansk the 11th largest city. i know both these cities are important for the Ukrainians as its about sovereignty.

Donetsk and Lugansk are two of Ukraine's capitals. Without them, there really isn't Donetsk oblast and Lugansk oblast. Russia sacrificed over 10,000 soldiers to take back Grozny, capital of Chechnya. NAF goes nea nea nea nea nea Ukraine is missing two of its capitals nea nea nea nea nea Not to mention over half of Ukraine's coal mines are controlled by NAF.

UAF better watch out. Once NAF sets up arms industry in Donbas, bam, thousands of T-72B3 and T-90MS tanks be manufactured in Donetsk, Lugansk, Alchevsk, Gorlovka, Makiivka, Stakhanov, Krasnyi Luch, Pervomaisk, Torez, Krasnodon,Yenakiieve, Snizhne, Antratsyt, Rovenky, Amvrosiivka, Yasynuvata, llovaisk, Novoazovsk, Sverdlovsk, Lutuhyne, Telmanove.

1921 Russian poster, Donbas, the industrial heart of Russia

 

[Hindustani78]

Donetsk and Lugansk are two of Ukraine's capitals. Without them, there really isn't Donetsk oblast and Lugansk oblast. Russia sacrificed over 10,000 soldiers to take back Grozny, capital of Chechnya. NAF goes nea nea nea nea nea Ukraine is missing two of its capitals nea nea nea nea nea Not to mention over half of Ukraine's coal mines are controlled by NAF.

UAF better watch out. Once NAF sets up arms industry in Donbas, bam, thousands of T-72B3 and T-90MS tanks be manufactured in Donetsk, Lugansk, Alchevsk, Gorlovka, Makiivka.

Both are administrative centers but seperatists is not under control of the whole province. majority of province in under control of Ukranian military if we check the map. here you are talking about Donet basin .
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lysychansk
24 December 2014
government-controlled Mariupol (113km south of Donetsk).
government-controlled Volnovakha (47km south-west of Donetsk)
government-controlled Debaltseve (55km North East of Donetsk) at the JCCC Headquarters (HQ)
government-controlled Druzhkivka (70km north of Donetsk)
government-controlled Artemove (40km North of Donetsk),
government-controlled Starobilsk (90km north of Luhansk)
outskirts of Vrubivka (74km north-ewast of Luhansk), Ukrainian soldiers stopped the SMM at a checkpoint.

oint Centre for Control and Co-ordination (JCCC)


high numbers of dumper trucks transporting coal from the Luhansk region to the Russian Federation.

 

[Superboy]

Both are administrative centers but seperatists is not under control of the whole province. majority of province in under control of Ukranian military if we check the map. here you are talking about Donet basin .
24 December 2014
government-controlled Mariupol (113km south of Donetsk).
government-controlled Volnovakha (47km south-west of Donetsk)
government-controlled Debaltseve (55km North East of Donetsk) at the JCCC Headquarters (HQ)
government-controlled Druzhkivka (70km north of Donetsk)
government-controlled Artemove (40km North of Donetsk),
government-controlled Starobilsk (90km north of Luhansk)
outskirts of Vrubivka (74km north-ewast of Luhansk), Ukrainian soldiers stopped the SMM at a checkpoint.

oint Centre for Control and Co-ordination (JCCC)


high numbers of dumper trucks transporting coal from the Luhansk region to the Russian Federation.

NAF doesn't need the whole Donbas for now. Most of Donbas is uninhabited wild lands inhabited by wild animals. The important things are the big cities which are industrial centers, including the two capitals. Donetsk and Lugansk have the two national universities in Donbas. Donetsk also has a technical university. Alchevsk has the biggest technical university in Donbas. Universities are necessary for manufacturing high tech weapons like T-72B3 and T-90MS tanks. High tech weapons determine the outcome of modern wars. If I can see you at night with thermal but you can't see me, then I can shoot you and kill you.

 

[Hindustani78]

NAF doesn't need the whole Donbas for now. Most of Donbas is uninhabited wild lands inhabited by wild animals. The important things are the big cities which are industrial centers, including the two capitals. Donetsk and Lugansk have the two national universities in Donbas. Donetsk also has a technical university. Alchevsk has the biggest technical university in Donbas. Universities are necessary for manufacturing high tech weapons like T-72B3 and T-90MS tanks.

T 72 and T 90 tanks can be manufactured by the Russians and right now Donetsk and Luhansk both doesn't have anything much to provide to the local population. They are not producing any food items more having any stock of grains and its a known fact that Russian Federation is providing them everything.

What is needed is food for the population there which you are over looking.

 

[Superboy]

T 72 and T 90 tanks can be manufactured by the Russians and right now Donetsk and Luhansk both doesn't have anything much to provide to the local population. They are not producing any food items more having any stock of grains and its a known fact that Russian Federation is providing them everything.

Hey, if the people want to eat food, go to Russia. It's right off the friggin' border. NAF controlled Donbas is a military base, not a people feeder.

 

[Hindustani78]

Hey, if the people want to eat food, go to Russia. It's right off the friggin' border. NAF controlled Donbas is a military base, not a people feeder.

So you are saying its all about coal and industries ?

 

[Superboy]

So you are saying its all about coal and industries ?

It's about building up an army to take the fight to Ukraine next year.

 

[Hindustani78]

It's about building up an army to take the fight to Ukraine next year.

If people are having to eat then army can be made. Are these Donetsk And Luhansk Republic self reliant ? We know that they are not.

Ukraine sends more than 300 tonnes of humanitarian aid to Donbas| Ukrinform

The map that reflects the situation in Donbas as of 12.00 on December 25 has been released by the information and analytical center of the National Security and Defense Council.

 

[Superboy]

If people are having to eat then army can be made. Are these Donetsk And Luhansk Republic self reliant ? We know that they are not.

Ukraine sends more than 300 tonnes of humanitarian aid to Donbas| Ukrinform

The map that reflects the situation in Donbas as of 12.00 on December 25 has been released by the information and analytical center of the National Security and Defense Council.

Ukraine can't out man Russia. Millions of Russian unemployed are joining NAF to fight for land in Ukraine.

 

[Hindustani78]

Ukraine can't out man Russia. Millions of Russian unemployed are joining NAF to fight for land in Ukraine.

This is the reason that Ukraine, Georgia and now even Finland is thinking to join NATO.