Featured Chinese arrive in Argentina to negotiate sale of 12 JF-17 fighters

[iLION12345_1]

Nope, if strategic partnership started with China then Chinese footprint in Argentina will change dynamics as China will like to have logistics facilities from Argentina which could lead to some sort of military base in future, that is what rising powers have mostly done in past.

An Argentina-China strategic relationship is out of the scope of our discussion, that will have too many more factors to it, far beyond some simple aircraft deal. I would not expect that to happen either, Argentina only has issues with UK, not USA and Europe, on the contrary all Argentinian weapon systems are French or American in origin. They cannot afford Sanctions from these countries, it is unlikely they will form any major partnership with China, even if they do, UK and NATO will still stay in the lead in that region, simply due to their head-start and geography.

 

[UKBengali]

Argentina will need 70+ JF-17 to have any chance of fighting off British Aircraft carrier battle group.

Even that would result in all 70+ JF-17s being shot down with a handful of F-35Bs at most being lost in return.

UK will soon have the capability to lay waste to Argentine coastal cities when the 2 carriers are fully inducted by 2025.

Argentine had its one chance to capture the Falkland by force in 1982 and got beaten back when they were stronger and UK was weaker than now in terms of expeditionary firepower.

 

[Genghis khan1]

Even that would result in all 70+ JF-17s being shot down with a handful of F-35Bs at most being lost in return.

UK will soon have the capability to lay waste to Argentine coastal cities when the 2 carriers are inducted by 2025.

Argentine had its one chance to capture the Falkland by force in 1982 and got beaten back when they were stronger and UK weaker is now.

JF-17 got some serious teeth. Specially with long range anti-ship missiles. Aircraft Carries has its limitation to launch and refuel/rearm its aircraft. So with right tactics, Argentine can do real damage.

 

[Basel]

Even that would result in all 70+ JF-17s being shot down with a handful of F-35Bs at most being lost in return.

UK will soon have the capability to lay waste to Argentine coastal cities when the 2 carriers are inducted by 2025.

Argentine had its one chance to capture the Falkland by force in 1982 and got beaten back when they were stronger and UK weaker is now.

Very bias analysis, there is something called A2 AD capability which is cheaper to achieve, also hot war will not happen between UK and Argentina in near future.

12 JFTs with good weapons package are good start as they can carry weapons like CM-400AKG, C-802 AKG, SD-10, SD-10A, PL-5E, PL-15, PL-10E, LT series of PGMs, GB-6 & GB-6A standoff munitions dispenser etc. currently Argentina don't have any of such capabilities.

JF-17 got some serious teeth. Specially with long range anti-ship missiles. Aircraft Carries has its limitation to launch and refuel/rearm its aircraft. So with right tactics, Argentine can do real damage.

JFTs can launch combo of C-802/803s with CM-400AKGs to make things very bad for any carrier group of UK heading Argentina coast, also they can buy C-302, CX-1, or C-602Gs for coastal defense.

 

[siegecrossbow]

Why UK veto even 12 F/A-50 trainer/fighter? So you are saying F/A-50 can threaten but 12 JF-17 are less even a threat?

Of course the JF-17 or even FA-50 offer way more advanced capabilities than the existing Argentina fleet. However this does not mean that Argentina will be able to fight Great Britain toe to toe with only a small batch of light fighters, especially without force multipliers.

Let me put it this way. Suppose China exports FC-1s to North Korea. Would it help them achieve air superiority over SK and the US? Definitely not. But you can bet on the US and SK doing their best to block the deal.

 

[Beast]

Of course the JF-17 or even FA-50 offer way more advanced capabilities than the existing Argentina fleet. However this does not mean that Argentina will be able to fight Great Britain toe to toe with only a small batch of light fighters, especially without force multipliers.

Let me put it this way. Suppose China exports FC-1s to North Korea. Would it help them achieve air superiority over SK and the US? Definitely not. But you can bet on the US and SK doing their best to block the deal.

That will depend on how Argentina going to use their asset wisely. We have seen a few super Etenard with just a few missiles causes havoc on RN and nearly won the war. Never say never.

 

[LeGenD]

This is good news.

- - - - -

It looks like members are imagining UK versus Argentina showdown PART II as well.

Even if WE consider a Fleet of the very best of JF-17 configuration (or numerous 4th generation types) taking cues from an AEW&C, it stands no chance against a Fleet of F-35B in aerial clashes. F-35B will frustrate sensor systems of an AEW&C, let alone any JF-17 configuration (or numerous 4th generation types).

Detection possibilities offered by a powerful AEW&C platform for reference:

The maximum is 60 KM (vs. F-35 variants) in ideal conditions. F-35B will introduce top-of-the-line EW capabilities in the environment instead. You see where this is going?

Modern British Carrier Strike Group (CSG) is on another level of warfighting capability in comparison to what it used to be back in times of the Falklands War.

Design of the British Type 45 destroyer is informed by lessons drawn from the Falklands War with automated functions and a new generation of munitions guided by Sea Viper Missile System.

HMS Duncan: What capabilities does the warship bring to the Gulf?

HMS Duncan will join HMS Montrose in the Gulf region as Iran threatens to disrupt shipping.

www.forces.net

Aster 30 SAMP/T Surface-to-Air Missile Platform / Terrain, Europe - Army Technology

The Aster 30 SAMP/T (sol-air moyenne portée terrestre or surface-to-air medium range / land) is a land-based air defence system…

www.army-technology.com

ASTER-30 will be sufficient to neutralize supersonic threats and even TBMs.

Argentina cannot do much now.

 

[siegecrossbow]

That will depend on how Argentina going to use their asset wisely. We have seen a few super Etenard with just a few missiles causes havoc on RN and nearly won the war. Never say never.

I think you meant A-4s. I doubt that Argentina knows how to wisely use assets after their Air Force has languished from disuse for so many years.

 

[lcloo]

JF-17 would be a great boaster for Argentine air force. Their airforce is practically a non-fighting force with existing invenotry. They urgently need to replace whatever number of obsolete A-4 that is still in flying conditions.

 

[925boy]

Taiwan military is a lot tougher than Indian military. Beating up the Indian military is a lot more fun.

thats the not truth from the Galwan clash where PLA lost 40-50 soldiers TOO..PLA was surprised they lost so many troops to "weak" Indian troops...just saying, i dont like truth being bent.

 

[CAPRICORN-88]

thats the not truth from the Galwan clash where PLA lost 40-50 soldiers TOO..PLA was surprised they lost so many troops to "weak" Indian troops...just saying, i dont like truth being bent.

That is not the truth either.
But Galwan Valley is off topic.

 

[Genghis khan1]

This is good news.

- - - - -

It looks like members are imagining UK versus Argentina showdown PART II as well.

Even if WE consider a Fleet of the very best of JF-17 configuration (or numerous 4th generation types) taking cues from an AEW&C, it stands no chance against a Fleet of F-35B in aerial clashes. F-35B will frustrate sensor systems of an AEW&C, let alone any JF-17 configuration (or numerous 4th generation types).

Detection possibilities offered by a powerful AEW&C platform for reference:

The maximum is 60 KM (vs. F-35 variants) in ideal conditions. F-35B will introduce top-of-the-line EW capabilities in the environment instead. You see where this is going?

Modern British Carrier Strike Group (CSG) is on another level of warfighting capability in comparison to what it used to be back in times of the Falklands War.

Design of the British Type 45 destroyer is informed by lessons drawn from the Falklands War with automated functions and a new generation of munitions guided by Sea Viper Missile System.

HMS Duncan: What capabilities does the warship bring to the Gulf?

HMS Duncan will join HMS Montrose in the Gulf region as Iran threatens to disrupt shipping.

www.forces.net

Aster 30 SAMP/T Surface-to-Air Missile Platform / Terrain, Europe - Army Technology

The Aster 30 SAMP/T (sol-air moyenne portée terrestre or surface-to-air medium range / land) is a land-based air defence system…

www.army-technology.com

ASTER-30 will be sufficient to neutralize supersonic threats and even TBMs.

Argentina cannot do much now.

Kiya baat hy, but it takes one missile in a saturated attack to slip through defenses.

 

[TNT]

People think JF17 will not do much but give the Argentinians block 3 with PL15, PL10, anti ship missiles and stand off weapons and then see the brits jumping up and down like monkeys.

 

[White Lion]

JF-17 will pose no threat to the Brits in or around Falkland Islands. As is, airpower is not enough on its own to win a war. Do they have any semblance of a navy? I'm afraid nothing compared to the foe.
JF-17 will be helping them revitalize their small air force back to the standards of South America. Every country in their neighborhood has some 4-4.5 gen aircraft and given it's size, Argentinians need a small yet modern air force and it starts with acquiring a light weight fighter.
The country has good relationships with all it's neighbors and the US. They also have supported Pakistan in the UN whenever we bring up the right of self-determination. We need to build up our exports to south and central America and certainly weapon exports are part of that.
Argentina also has a history of manufacturing aircraft with European help. Their PAC is called FMA, now owned by Lockheed Martin. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/FMA_IA-63_Pampa
They also have primary and advance jet trainers so basically missing a fast jet from their fleet. We might also see them manufacture some parts of the Thunder. They will most likely overhaul the jets themselves. All in all a very good deal for China and Pakistan. Thunders will be flying in Asia, Africa and now South America!

This is what the British Parliament authorized for the defense of Falkland Islands. 4 RAF Typhoons against 12 JF-17 is a matter of concern.

UK military assets UK military assets are drawn from all three services and include infantry and specialist troops, air defence assets, a maritime patrol capability and RAF Typhoon aircraft. The British Forces South Atlantic Islands (BFSAI) is based at Mount Pleasant Complex, 35 miles (56km) from the capital, Stanley. It consists of approximately 1,300 Service personnel plus around 50 MOD civil servants.
As of February 2012 assets include: • Approximately 1300 personnel • Four Typhoon fast-jet aircraft • VC-10 tanker aircraft • Hercules C-130 aircraft • Rapier surface-to-air missiles • Frigate or Destroyer (currently Type 23 frigate HMS Montrose to be replaced by Type 45 destroyer HMS Dauntless) • Royal Fleet Auxiliary Gold Rover • HMS Clyde permanently stationed in the region as Falklands Patrol • Infantry company currently from 2 Scots The RAF currently has four Typhoon fast-jet aircraft based at Mount Pleasant Airfield to provide air defence of the islands; one VC-10 tanker aircraft for air-to-air refuelling; and one Hercules C-130 aircraft providing airborne maritime patrol capability, including fisheries patrolling. The C130 can also be used for air transport or medical evacuation if required. Two Sea King helicopters are available for search and rescue coverage; while the RAF regiment provides a Rapier Squadron of surface-to-air missiles. In addition, two Sikorski S61 helicopters, operated by British International, are based at Mount Pleasant for the routine movement of personnel and freight. Air traffic control, fire and meteorological services are also present. Remotely deployed early warning radars also provide an air defence framework.7 Atlantic Patrol Task (South), APT(S), is the standing naval commitment to provide either a destroyer or a frigate and an RFA support vessel to the South Atlantic and the West African region. The vessel is present in the Falkland Islands area for the majority of the year, including through the southern winter, and is at a maximum of 14 days notice from the islands for the remainder of the year. The current APTS vessel is the Type 23 frigate HMS Montrose, supported by RFA tanker Gold Rover8 . HMS Montrose began her 6½ month deployment in October 20119 . She is to be replaced by Type 45 destroyer HMS Dauntless in 5 “Duke of Cambridge to deploy to Falklands”, Defence News, 10 November 2011 [online] (accessed 11 January 2012) 6 MoD email, 17 January 2012 7 More information on the RAF deployment is available on its website 8 “RFA Black Rover returns from 18 month deployment”, Defence News, 29 September 2011 9 “Montrose begins six month stint in South Atlantic”, Royal Navy News, 25 October 2011 4 spring 201210. Type 42 destroyer HMS Edinburgh was on patrol prior to HMS Montrose for much of 2011. In addition, HMS Clyde11 is permanently stationed in the region as the Falkland Islands Patrol Vessel. The ship’s company rotates every six months. A nuclear-powered attack submarine also supplements Atlantic Patrol Task South, on occasion. A Naval Engineering unit supports naval assets in the region. HMS Protector deployed to the Antarctic and South Atlantic in January 2012 to take up duties as the Ice Patrol Ship. HMS Protector is on loan from Norway and replaces the ice patrol ship HMS Endurance, in dock since 2008 with damage sustained by flooding.12 13 The Falkland Islands Reinforcement Infantry company rotates on a regular basis. A number of joint units also support Armed Forces personnel and assets based in the Falkland Islands, including: • Falkland Islands Joint Logistics Unit • Falkland Islands Support Unit • Joint Communications Unit Falkland Islands • Joint Services Provost and Security Unit • Joint Services signals Unit. The Falkland Islands Defence Force provides local support to British military personnel. Funded by the Falkland Islands Government, the Defence Force is recognised as a skilled and effective Territorial Army unit, not only forming an integral part of the Islands’ defence operation, but also carrying out search and rescue operations. The MoD provides a brief introduction to the Falkland Islands for the service community, including information on weather and flying time (18 hours).

 

[retaxis]

Rome wasn't built in a day and neither was China's Rise. This is just the beginning for the Argentinian air force. Its a revival and foundations for something greater in the years to come. It is obvious a few JF17s are no match for one of the premier military nations in the world (UK) but small steps towards the right direction should be applauded.