Chinese Aero Engine information thread

[j20blackdragon]

Now, this RD-93, WS-13 both lookalike, is indistinguishable from outside.
Makes one wonder if their is something similar for AL-31, maybe a lookalike clone says for eg. used by J-15?

Perhaps you don't have to wonder. J-20 2016 is probably already using a domestic 'AL-31' derivative.

The original unpainted AL-31 on the J-20 looks like this.

AL-31FN on the J-10 looks like this.

However, I've never seen any AL-31 look like this.

The color is significantly darker, including the inside of the nozzles.

The nozzles are either shorter or embedded deeper into the airframe. Either way, there is no precedent on any other aircraft that makes the AL-31 look like this.

 

[Beast]

Perhaps you don't have to wonder. J-20 2016 is probably already using a domestic 'AL-31' derivative.

The original unpainted AL-31 on the J-20 looks like this.
View attachment 259350

AL-31FN on the J-10 looks like this.
View attachment 259352

However, I've never seen any AL-31 look like this.
View attachment 259353
View attachment 259354
The color is significantly darker.

The nozzles are either shorter or embedded deeper into the airframe. Either way, there is no precedent on any other aircraft that makes the AL-31 look like this.

WS-15 maybe using the AL-31 design as core for development pave with upthrust and lifespan. I will not be surprised this engine is WS-15.

 

[ChineseTiger1986]

WS-15 maybe using the AL-31 design as core for development pave with upthrust and lifespan. I will not be surprised this engine is WS-15.

The WS-15 is related to the WS-10.

Since many late variants of the WS-10 has black nozzle, so they might have used the new advanced materials for this engine as well.

 

[Beast]

The WS-15 is related to the WS-10.

Since the many late variants of the WS-10 has black nozzle, so they might have used the new advanced materials for this engine as well.

Yup, I think during the interview with AVIC chairman lin. He did mention something about the material of WS-10 engine.

 

[j20blackdragon]

Let me post three pictures in a row.

J-20 2001 with a single unpainted AL-31 engine

J-20 2016

Ukrainian Su-27S with dark AL-31F nozzles

Somehow I feel that the shape, color, and texture of the 2016 engine is unique. It doesn't feel like an AL-31 to me.

 

[JSCh]

Perhaps you don't have to wonder. J-20 2016 is probably already using a domestic 'AL-31' derivative.

The original unpainted AL-31 on the J-20 looks like this.
View attachment 259359

AL-31FN on the J-10 looks like this.
View attachment 259352

However, I've never seen any AL-31 look like this.
View attachment 259353
View attachment 259354
The color is significantly darker, including the inside of the nozzles.

The nozzles are either shorter or embedded deeper into the airframe. Either way, there is no precedent on any other aircraft that makes the AL-31 look like this.

Or maybe another possibility - the whole engine is shorter due to reduced turbine stage blade count.

 

[BoQ77]

Perhaps you don't have to wonder. J-20 2016 is probably already using a domestic 'AL-31' derivative.

The original unpainted AL-31 on the J-20 looks like this.
View attachment 259359

AL-31FN on the J-10 looks like this.
View attachment 259352

However, I've never seen any AL-31 look like this.
View attachment 259353
View attachment 259354
The color is significantly darker, including the inside of the nozzles.

The nozzles are either shorter or embedded deeper into the airframe. Either way, there is no precedent on any other aircraft that makes the AL-31 look like this.

AL-31FM-2 ?

 

[j20blackdragon]

AL-31FM-2 ?

We don't have any in service pictures of the AL-31FM2, so it's hard to compare.

Here is the AL-31FM1 on the Su-34.

In my opinion, it looks nothing like the 2016 engines.

The 2016 engines have several unique characteristics:

1. The shade of black is very unique.
2. The color distribution is very even.
3. It has a smooth texture when viewed from a distance, so smooth you have trouble seeing the individual petals on the nozzle.

Everything else about it looks like the AL-31.

 

[kuge]

http://bbs.wforum.com/upfile/images/20151001/20151001081620_36228_big.jpg

would the chart provide the clue to engines on j-20?

the chart describes the engine(ws-10-T?) was a scale-down version of ws15 using existing tech & materials to produce 14500kn. The exhaust nozzle is grey-black in color.

the designed thrust of ws-15a is 15600kn.

 

[j20blackdragon]

http://bbs.wforum.com/upfile/images/20151001/20151001081620_36228_big.jpg

View attachment 261692

would the chart provide the clue to engines on j-20?

the chart describes the engine(ws-10-T?) was a scale-down version of ws15 using existing tech & materials to produce 14500kn. The exhaust nozzle is grey-black in color.

the designed thrust of ws-15a is 15600kn.

The black WS-10 does not look like the engines on 2016 imo.

 

[ChineseTiger1986]

The black WS-10 does not look like the engines on 2016 imo.

According to the chart, those black nozzled Taihang engines in your pics are the WS-10B-III.

While the J-20 uses the WS-10T; the T1 is the silver nozzle and the T2 is the black nozzle from the prototype 2016.

http://bbs.wforum.com/upfile/images/20151001/20151001081620_36228_big.jpg

View attachment 261692

would the chart provide the clue to engines on j-20?

the chart describes the engine(ws-10-T?) was a scale-down version of ws15 using existing tech & materials to produce 14500kn. The exhaust nozzle is grey-black in color.

the designed thrust of ws-15a is 15600kn.

The early model of the WS-15 could be similar to the F119 which is about 156kN, but the later upgrade variant could perhaps reach close to 180kN.

 

[aliaselin]

先进间冷热力循环40MW功率级舰船用燃机性能达世界领先水平
他主持突破了先进间冷循环燃机总体气动热力与结构设计、机上紧凑型高效低损失间冷系统、高性能压气机与动力涡轮、高温高效燃烧室、全权限数字式控制系统等关键技术，实现ISO条件下，热效率为42.2%,超过同档功率世界最先进的英国船用燃机MT30。

Power of QC-185 with cold thermodynamic cycle has reached 40MW，with thermo efficiency for 42.2%, which exceeding MT30

 

[kuge]

oo..i made a grave mistake in stating the thrust in xxxxxkn instead of N

 

[TopWater]

oo..i made a grave mistake in stating the thrust in xxxxxkn instead of N

The black WS-10 does not look like the engines on 2016 imo.

Let me post three pictures in a row.

J-20 2001 with a single unpainted AL-31 engine
View attachment 259421

J-20 2016
View attachment 259422

Ukrainian Su-27S with dark AL-31F nozzles
View attachment 259423

Somehow I feel that the shape, color, and texture of the 2016 engine is unique. It doesn't feel like an AL-31 to me.

The section where the body necks down to meet the nozzles is thicker in photo number two compared to photo number one. The angle of the photos are similar and the difference is apparent from that angle.

 

[BoQ77]

While the J-20 uses the WS-10T; the T1 is the silver nozzle and the T2 is the black nozzle from the prototype 2016.

The early model of the WS-15 could be similar to the F119 which is about 156kN, but the later upgrade variant could perhaps reach close to 180kN.

How did you get those specs ?