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China and Japan Inching Closer to War Over a Few Disputed Islets..

It is really funny, even comical to see someone here, with their infinite battlefield wisdom, to go on here snd talk about a 100% sure win guaranteed war

Even in the case with US fighting in Iraq, nobody is gonna say they are sure win, infact country like US, Italy and France were even sometime got beaten back by Rifle wielding Taliban farmer, someone here go on and say a war between Chinese and Japanese is a sure deal.

Lol really funny, you lot really made my day
This is not going to be the same war as US in Iraq. It will not be a ground war. Neither side can bring soldier over to fight. It will be on the sea, air, and missile exchange war.

What is the strength of Japanese missile arsenal and its sophistication? This is key to limit the damage on China mainland territory. War with Japan will involved us launching at their air base to destabilize their air force from lifting up in the air. On the sea, we can sink as many even if it's game of 2 vs 1. We have the number game and will continue to build even more. Will the US involved directly? If it will, then a total global war is inevitable and will lead to nuclear exchange to decide a victor. In that case, it's a lose-lose situation. If we lost the war, it will be the end of CPC and myself included, either dying on the battlefield or commit suicide.

Let Tibet go. Problem solved.
Tibet stays, but Tibetan can free go to live in your USA country. We will not oppose but in fact willing to pay for shipping and air ticket cost.
 
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It would indeed be fun to watch China to teach Japan with an unforgettable lesson, but i am afraid that Japan might back down at the end.
Dude!. Peace is always the best way moving forward...Let bygones be bygones. Hopefully both back down and reach an agreement.
 
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I'm interested what Russia will do in case hell breaks loose. As a strategic partner and important trading partner, will Russia stand by and watch?
 
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This is not going to be the same war as US in Iraq. It will not be a ground war. Neither side can bring soldier over to fight. It will be on the sea, air, and missile exchange war.

What is the strength of Japanese missile arsenal and its sophistication? This is key to limit the damage on China mainland territory. War with Japan will involved us launching at their air base to destabilize their air force from lifting up in the air. On the sea, we can sink as many even if it's game of 2 vs 1. We have the number game and will continue to build even more. Will the US involved directly? If it will, then a total global war is inevitable and will lead to nuclear exchange to decide a victor. In that case, it's a lose-lose situation. If we lost the war, it will be the end of CPC and myself included, either dying on the battlefield or commit suicide.


Tibet stays, but Tibetan can free go to live in your USA country. We will not oppose but in fact willing to pay for shipping and air ticket cost.

That's where you thought wrong...

since the inception of flight, nations try to finish war with air power alone, and from the last 100 years, we see a 100% failure (Well, unless you count the dropping of 2 atomic bomb is an "Air War")

History told us, in the following battle

Battle of Britain
Battle of Midway
Air War over Japan
Mig Alley in Korean War
Operation Rolling thunder in Vietnam War
Operation Line Backer in Vietnam War
Operation Desert Strom in Iraq
No Fly Zone in the Balkan

That air war alone cannot win the war for the country. And you are talking about massive destruction not just a few air sortie.

If you want to defeat japan, a ground war must be done, back in WW2, japan were bombed 24 hours a day and 7 days a week, more than 60% of ALL JAPAN were destroyed, up to 1.5 million Japanese Resident dead, yet they keep on pressing the war in the Pacific. You can try to destroy the Japanese Air Power and Sea power and bomb them day and night (which China still lack this capacity) and you can try and see if Japan surrender. You do know they won't surrender when we hit 2000 sortie per month back in WW2 with every B-29 Strike deal more damage than a single DF-21D warhead can do. Do you really think oh, we lob 100 or 200 DF-21D to japan and destroy maybe 150 military target (Giving the work rate is 75%, very generous) and they will simply surrender??

Not to mention the moment China and Japan have a fight, they will fortify the Island and put SAM there, barren does not mean undefendable. Then China are looking at a 3 dimension strike to incoming force.

Not to mention the distance between China and Senkaku and Japan to Senkaku. Every flight (sortie) made by Chinese from their Nearest airbase will be met with 2 flight of Japanese fighter launch from Ishigaki. The nearest airbase from China is Wenzhou, 330 Km away, where Ishigaki is just 170 Km away. In Air war, you are not talking about how many aircraft you get in your inventory, but how many sortie you can launch vs how many sortie the enemy can launch, you cannot launch all 2000 aircraft in PLAAF Arsenal from Wenzhou base all at the same time....

220px-Senkaku_Diaoyu_Tiaoyu_Islands.png


And then there are naval ship, ok, let's assume China can actually destroy all of the Japanese Ship. Then what?? YOu want to enact an blockade in international water?? First, you need to ask yourselve this, after the engagement with JMSDF, would you still have enough ship to do such a blockade. As i can tell you this, without a Naval Blockade, a naval victory mean nothing. Supply can still float in and out of Japan. Nothing is changed.

Then ask yourselves this, what happened if China actually stupid enough to start a naval blockade in international water?? It will piss off the World. Do remember senkaku dispute is a regional dispute, it's between China, ROC and Japan. Enact a blockade in international water will trouble everyone running across the region, Russia, South and North Korea and US to start with, do you think China can take all that heat from these country??

And that is all before US got involved. US can of course choose if or if not to involved, if they choose not to involve directly, they will still send secondary asset in international water and airspace and pipe down info for Japan for them to locate Chinese Target. US AWACS and NAVAL Intelligence ship do run around in international water. And Chinese cannot touch them unless they want to risk a total war with US. These kind of false flag operation we done it time and again, it's not something new.

Even if US decided to involve directly, they can send support ship to supplment the JMSDF, do remember if you claim it is just a Sea and Air war, then there will not be any nuclear exchange as 7th fleet alone with JMSDF can be more than take on the Chinese Fleet as of now. You do know Liaoning is not fully operational until 2015/2016 right? Not enough?? How about sending the 5th fleet along as well, now you got 4 aircraft carrier, 8 Guided Missile cruiser and 12 Destoryer in the US Force, with 30 destroyer and 20 frigate in JMSDF, more than a match to the whole PLAN fleet, which i doubt they would even muster up that kind of strength (No one will ever mobilse 100% naval power in a single threater, unless you want to get stab from behind.)

So all this, this is what Chinese looking at when they start a war with Japan, and when you start a war you better damn win it, otherwise your economy will set back a hundred mile, and Chinese government will become an international laughting stock.

If you are the Chinese Leader, would you want to go back to eat dirt or you want to fix your economy so you have sharkfin soup every day?? :lol:

Hence a war can only happen in these forum member imagination, if you really want a war, go apply for a Japan vias and kill some japan defense personnel yourselve and see what your country will do for you??

I'm interested what Russia will do in case hell breaks loose. As a strategic partner and important trading partner, will Russia stand by and watch?

If you are Putin, will you

1.) Sitting in you living room watching the whole thing expose and ready to sell Chinese some more ship and aircraft?? or

2.) Get your own hand dirty??

What do you think?? You do know Russia sell arms to Vietnam and India and South Korea too right, a war with their name on it in that region is not a good business. A war with country that buying their arms on that region, on the other hand is a very good business.

That is the exact same reason why US will not help out Japan much or even at all.
 
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How many countries is china trying to bully?
Is this your answer to:
You don't bully Pakistan? don't kill Pakistan? and do you think the problem between Pakistan and indian is same with the genocide made by Japan? don't mix them up.
?


So you talked these shit:
My chinese brothers talk about genocide by Japan decades ago and wanna take revenge for that.

Then why are you guys supporting Pakistan, which is till date trying to bleed india, kill us and destablize us?

Double standards ? :china:
 
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Of course, the consequence of losing this possible coming proxy war is definitely dangerous for both China and USA in this proxy war.

If China loses that proxy war, it would be the end of us.

If US loses that proxy war, they will lose all the credibilities in front of their allies, it will probably create a huge domino effect to end their global empire.

But the problem is that China will make sure that she will 100% win if that proxy war ever happened in the near future. China just tested all her nuclear deterrence and anti-missile shield again, it is to draw a clear red line for USA not to directly intervene the possible coming confrontation between China and Japan.

There are only two available options for US if China and Japan ever engaged into a war.

1. To fight China for Japan, but the result will be the global nuclear warfare.
2. Just watch Japan to face China alone without directly involving into it.


All these two options above are bad options for USA, and they will look for the third option, which is to prevent any physical war between China and Japan. Haven't you seen all those pro-USA/anti-China posters are now chanting how the war between China and Japan will not happen? Because they know it, they know that USA cannot win this proxy war if it ever happened.

I hate to say this but somewhere deep down...i want China to win the proxy war against US...and end its Big brother attitude (or should i call it a bully like attitude) towards other countries.
But China has to stop being aggressive to its neighboring countries.
Japan..China...Russia...India if ever unite then god save Britain and US.




Off topic:
I did not get alert for getting quoted here.......:angry:
 
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That's where you thought wrong...

since the inception of flight, nations try to finish war with air power alone, and from the last 100 years, we see a 100% failure (Well, unless you count the dropping of 2 atomic bomb is an "Air War")

History told us, in the following battle

Battle of Britain
Battle of Midway
Air War over Japan
Mig Alley in Korean War
Operation Rolling thunder in Vietnam War
Operation Line Backer in Vietnam War
Operation Desert Strom in Iraq
No Fly Zone in the Balkan

That air war alone cannot win the war for the country. And you are talking about massive destruction not just a few air sortie.

If you want to defeat japan, a ground war must be done, back in WW2, japan were bombed 24 hours a day and 7 days a week, more than 60% of ALL JAPAN were destroyed, up to 1.5 million Japanese Resident dead, yet they keep on pressing the war in the Pacific. You can try to destroy the Japanese Air Power and Sea power and bomb them day and night (which China still lack this capacity) and you can try and see if Japan surrender. You do know they won't surrender when we hit 2000 sortie per month back in WW2 with every B-29 Strike deal more damage than a single DF-21D warhead can do. Do you really think oh, we lob 100 or 200 DF-21D to japan and destroy maybe 150 military target (Giving the work rate is 75%, very generous) and they will simply surrender??

Not to mention the moment China and Japan have a fight, they will fortify the Island and put SAM there, barren does not mean undefendable. Then China are looking at a 3 dimension strike to incoming force.

Not to mention the distance between China and Senkaku and Japan to Senkaku. Every flight (sortie) made by Chinese from their Nearest airbase will be met with 2 flight of Japanese fighter launch from Ishigaki. The nearest airbase from China is Wenzhou, 330 Km away, where Ishigaki is just 170 Km away. In Air war, you are not talking about how many aircraft you get in your inventory, but how many sortie you can launch vs how many sortie the enemy can launch, you cannot launch all 2000 aircraft in PLAAF Arsenal from Wenzhou base all at the same time....

220px-Senkaku_Diaoyu_Tiaoyu_Islands.png


And then there are naval ship, ok, let's assume China can actually destroy all of the Japanese Ship. Then what?? YOu want to enact an blockade in international water?? First, you need to ask yourselve this, after the engagement with JMSDF, would you still have enough ship to do such a blockade. As i can tell you this, without a Naval Blockade, a naval victory mean nothing. Supply can still float in and out of Japan. Nothing is changed.

Then ask yourselves this, what happened if China actually stupid enough to start a naval blockade in international water?? It will piss off the World. Do remember senkaku dispute is a regional dispute, it's between China, ROC and Japan. Enact a blockade in international water will trouble everyone running across the region, Russia, South and North Korea and US to start with, do you think China can take all that heat from these country??

And that is all before US got involved. US can of course choose if or if not to involved, if they choose not to involve directly, they will still send secondary asset in international water and airspace and pipe down info for Japan for them to locate Chinese Target. US AWACS and NAVAL Intelligence ship do run around in international water. And Chinese cannot touch them unless they want to risk a total war with US. These kind of false flag operation we done it time and again, it's not something new.

Even if US decided to involve directly, they can send support ship to supplment the JMSDF, do remember if you claim it is just a Sea and Air war, then there will not be any nuclear exchange as 7th fleet alone with JMSDF can be more than take on the Chinese Fleet as of now. You do know Liaoning is not fully operational until 2015/2016 right? Not enough?? How about sending the 5th fleet along as well, now you got 4 aircraft carrier, 8 Guided Missile cruiser and 12 Destoryer in the US Force, with 30 destroyer and 20 frigate in JMSDF, more than a match to the whole PLAN fleet, which i doubt they would even muster up that kind of strength (No one will ever mobilse 100% naval power in a single threater, unless you want to get stab from behind.)

So all this, this is what Chinese looking at when they start a war with Japan, and when you start a war you better damn win it, otherwise your economy will set back a hundred mile, and Chinese government will become an international laughting stock.

If you are the Chinese Leader, would you want to go back to eat dirt or you want to fix your economy so you have sharkfin soup every day?? :lol:

Hence a war can only happen in these forum member imagination, if you really want a war, go apply for a Japan vias and kill some japan defense personnel yourselve and see what your country will do for you??



If you are Putin, will you

1.) Sitting in you living room watching the whole thing expose and ready to sell Chinese some more ship and aircraft?? or

2.) Get your own hand dirty??

What do you think?? You do know Russia sell arms to Vietnam and India and South Korea too right, a war with their name on it in that region is not a good business. A war with country that buying their arms on that region, on the other hand is a very good business.

That is the exact same reason why US will not help out Japan much or even at all.
What nonsense!

You do realize neither us or Japan can engaged in a ground war over each other main territory right? We have no meant to send massive troop over and likewise, send Japanese troop over is a suicide mission. The war is about who can endure the damage before backing down. You can bet your ***, the CPC and Chinese people will not back down unless all of us perish. Our civilization will be put on the line if we go to war with Japan.

Yeah yeah, you talk a bunch of nonsense. What is the result of WWII? Japan surrendered right? What's the point? They end up surrender even before the US dropped two atomic bombs. But no, we don't expect Japan to surrender any time soon. It will be a long drag out war to see who back down first given the damage being done to both sides. But all points are mute. Everything depends on the US involvement. If US don't involve, Japan is finish in the long run. If US involves, then we will have trouble fighting. This is why our leaders will need to read the US's response carefully to decide whether a war with Japan is worth it or not.

If the war is restrict to Senkaku/Diaoyu to see who can transfer troop over to the island and defend, then we have an advantage in transport. Once we occupy the island, then it's game over. If Japan occupied it, we can easily take it back or else the Japanese troop on the island is open to missile fire.

Time, resources, manpower is on our side.

I hate to say this but somewhere deep down...i want China to win the proxy war against US...and end its Big brother attitude (or should i call it a bully like attitude) towards other countries.
But China has to stop being aggressive to its neighboring countries.
Japan..China...Russia...India if ever unite then god save Britain and US.




Off topic:
I did not get alert for getting quoted here.......:angry:
India needs to stay on our side if they ever want to be respect in the future because if you go over to the US's side, you will only be regard as a puppet and there will be no equal partnership with the US's led coalition.
 
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I hate to say this but somewhere deep down...i want China to win the proxy war against US...and end its Big brother attitude (or should i call it a bully like attitude) towards other countries.
But China has to stop being aggressive to its neighboring countries.
Japan..China...Russia...India if ever unite then god save Britain and US.




Off topic:
I did not get alert for getting quoted here.......:angry:

We know deep down many Indians support us despite showing your hatred towards us.

I think Indian pride, ego and our border dispute make Indians deny that they support China in a war against the US.

To be honest, if India and the US ever square off in economic dispute or military dispute, I would always support India. Why? Because despite our spats with India, India is an Asian country and I want Asia to beat the west in anything. Same goes for sports.
 
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India needs to stay on our side if they ever want to be respect in the future because if you go over to the US's side, you will only be regard as a puppet and there will be no equal partnership with the US's led coalition.
China cant force India to respect it.It will get respect when it learns to respect its neighbors.Right now China is India's menacing neighbor.
But I hope things will improve in the future.

We know deep down many Indians support us despite showing your hatred towards us.

I think Indian pride, ego and our border dispute make Indians deny that they support China in a war against the US.

To be honest, if India and the US ever square off in economic dispute or military dispute, I would always support India. Why? Because despite our spats with India, India is an Asian country and I want Asia to beat the west in anything. Same goes for sports.
:-)

You've echoed my thoughts.Asian countries have always been suppressed by US and the other European countries.....high time they are are overturned.
 
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China cant force India to respect it.It will get respect when it learns to respect its neighbors.Right now China is India's menacing neighbor.
But I hope things will improve in the future.


:-)
You gain our respect by being a force that will defy the US's led Western hegemonic global system. If you follow the Western's dictate system, then you are nothing more than a puppet. That is what I mean by "respect". Of course, we can't force respect on India. We never intend to.

I am not sure what you mean that we don't respect the neighbors. What exactly do you mean by that? Any example that we don't respect the neighbor sovereignty? Did we drop bomb on them or put military base like the US did? You do realize we could have put military base in NK after the war but chose not to right?
 
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What nonsense!

You do realize neither us or Japan can engaged in a ground war over each other main territory right? We have no meant to send massive troop over and likewise, send Japanese troop over is a suicide mission. The war is about who can endure the damage before backing down. You can bet your ***, the CPC and Chinese people will not back down unless all of us perish. Our civilization will be put on the line if we go to war with Japan.

Yeah yeah, you talk a bunch of nonsense. What is the result of WWII? Japan surrendered right? What's the point? They end up surrender even before the US dropped two atomic bombs. But no, we don't expect Japan to surrender any time soon. It will be a long drag out war to see who back down first given the damage being done to both sides. But all points are mute. Everything depends on the US involvement. If US don't involve, Japan is finish in the long run. If US involves, then we will have trouble fighting. This is why our leaders will need to read the US's response carefully to decide whether a war with Japan is worth it or not.

If the war is restrict to Senkaku/Diaoyu to see who can transfer troop over to the island and defend, then we have an advantage in transport. Once we occupy the island, then it's game over. If Japan occupied it, we can easily take it back or else the Japanese troop on the island is open to missile fire.

Time, resources, manpower is on our side.


India needs to stay on our side if they ever want to be respect in the future because if you go over to the US's side, you will only be regard as a puppet and there will be no equal partnership with the US's led coalition.

Lol, again, feel free to believe you can bomb Japan day and light and you will make them submit

I am just telling you there were never and conflict solved by a pure air and sea campaign, the German tried it on Britain, US and UK did it on Germany, US did that with Japan, US tried it in Vietnam, UN tried in Balkan, US tried in Iraq

No one even come close to making it, but hey, if you think china can do it to Japan, then you are free to believe it too

Just so you know, if US never invaded Okinawa in 1945 will you think Japan will surrender to the US after the two bomb drop?

I done talking to you, no need to reply me
 
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You gain our respect by being a force that will defy the US's led Western hegemonic global system. If you follow the Western's dictate system, then you are nothing more than a puppet. That is what I mean by "respect". Of course, we can't force respect on India. We never intend to.

I am not sure what you mean that we don't respect the neighbors. What exactly do you mean by that? Any example that we don't respect the neighbor sovereignty? Did we drop bomb on them or put military base like the US did? You do realize we could have put military base in NK after the war but chose not to right?

I quoted this yesterday too....that very recently China had shown Arunachal pradesh(an Indian state in the north east) as its territory,which was a very big blunder.
When i said respect,i meant China should stop supplying arms to the terrorist groups which attack India so often.China has been notoriously disturbing the regional peace.
Nations are reassured by the reasonable stance and behaviour of others, not rhetoric. Laying poorly clarified claims to most of the waters in the South China Sea and attempting to coerce others to submit to these claims ....is by no means reasonable.
The only way China can reassure its neighbours is to bring its claims in conformity with UN law of seas and international law of border.China should be prepared to negotiate in good faith the limits of the disputed areas.
 
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