Can Hindutva Terrorists Provoke India-Pakistan War?

[Gazzi]

Happens all over. Look in your own backyard before criticising your neighbors

Here here.............maybe now is a good time to talk about Maoists/Naxal terrorists who have a presence in 1/3 of India.....or the VHP terrorists, and BJP terrorists who have been nranded a Political party in India and while we are at it.....genocide of say, Kashmir, Gujarat, Christians, Muslims, Sikhs ..............I think I may have left something out.........i'll come back with those...just the above for now please......as India tends to point at Pakistan alot, using your comment, lets look in your own backyard first..............

 

[PlanetWarrior]

Here here.............maybe now is a good time to talk about Maoists/Naxal terrorists who have a presence in 1/3 of India.....or the VHP terrorists, and BJP terrorists who have been nranded a Political party in India and while we are at it.....genocide of say, Kashmir, Gujarat, Christians, Muslims, Sikhs ..............I think I may have left something out.........i'll come back with those...just the above for now please......as India tends to point at Pakistan alot, using your comment, lets look in your own backyard first..............

Okay since you seem so well versed with Indian terrorism. When did any of the Maoist/Naxals, VHP , Bajrang Bal, RSS etc "terrorists" sneak out of India and create mayhem in any part of the world including Pakistan? Need a list of registered Pakistani nationality terrorists ? Check your buddy the CIA's worldwide website list on the net. Thing is none of the groups mentioned in your long list has any members on that list. And neither has Pakistan voiced any concerns about their activities either. We know how to keep ours at home

 

[Justin Joseph]

US Defense Secretary Robert Gates has warned in New Delhi today that Al-Qaeda is trying to destabilize the whole of South Asia hoping to provoke a deadly war between India and Pakistan, according to the BBC. In addition to Al-Qaeda, he has pointed the finger at the Taliban in Afghanistan and in Pakistan, and the Pakistan-based group Lashkar-e-Taiba as groups seeking to spark conflict between India and Pakistan, or to provoke instability in Pakistan.

Mr. Gates is only partially correct. Conspicuously absent from his list of the region's "bad guys" are the Hindutva terrorist outfits who are implicated in a series of bombings designed to fan the flames of hatred between Hindus and Muslims and then blame Pakistan for their handiwork.

sir,

1. The Mr. Gates has said about LeT type elements based in Pakistan but you tailed a troll and posted on this forum.

This shows your complex and over obsession about India.

2. There is nothing called "Hindutva Terrorists" this is the fact. And as a Indian and a Christian i hold more credibility than you in this regard.

3. Why make a fuss about it, just for hypothetically suppose you are right and there will be a war between India and Pakistan.

Then what's wrong in this?????

Many will get a chance to become Gaazi and Zaid Hamid's forecast will become reality just walk into India and host Pakistani flag on Red Fort, what's the problem???????

This is what u want????? Just do it, why afraid of it.

thanks

 

[Gazzi]

Okay since you seem so well versed with Indian terrorism. When did any of the Maoist/Naxals, VHP , Bajrang Bal, RSS etc "terrorists" sneak out of India and create mayhem in any part of the world including Pakistan? Need a list of registered Pakistani nationality terrorists ? Check your buddy the CIA's worldwide website list on the net. Thing is none of the groups mentioned in your long list has any members on that list. And neither has Pakistan voiced any concerns about their activities either. We know how to keep ours at home

no no no....planetwarrior.....you asked to look at our own backyard with regards to terrorism and oher factors before looking at our neighbours....wel guess what, you go thte same points out back to you.....

And anyways.....Indian state sponsored terrorist organisation RAW is enough to be exported to Pakistan.....as well as the terrorism during the 80's and 90's using religious sects to carry out mayhem in Pakistan like Shias, Ahmadis, MQM............however, another topic for another thread......

 

[Speaker]

US Defense Secretary Robert Gates has warned in New Delhi today that Al-Qaeda is trying to destabilize the whole of South Asia hoping to provoke a deadly war between India and Pakistan, according to the BBC. In addition to Al-Qaeda, he has pointed the finger at the Taliban in Afghanistan and in Pakistan, and the Pakistan-based group Lashkar-e-Taiba as groups seeking to spark conflict between India and Pakistan, or to provoke instability in Pakistan.

Mr. Gates is only partially correct. Conspicuously absent from his list of the region's "bad guys" are the Hindutva terrorist outfits who are implicated in a series of bombings designed to fan the flames of hatred between Hindus and Muslims and then blame Pakistan for their handiwork.

In a new book titled "Who Killed Karkare?"(published by Pharos Media), the author and former Maharashtra police chief S.M. Mushrif says a nationwide network of Hindutva terrorists that has its tentacles spread up to Nepal and Israel is out to destroy India's secularism and to reshape it into a theocratic state like Afghanistan under the Taliban.

Haq's Musings: Terror in India--Who Killed Karkare?

This is an irresponsible post. A war between India and Pakistan cannot be sparked off by a Hindu-Muslim confrontation. India is not a Hindu state, and I don't know why you think you are the torch-bearers of Islam. When Ajmal Kasab and his gang caused mayhem, they were asked to kill as many Indians as possible, not target Hindus alone. Do you even care to know how many Muslims were massacred by these guys?

Conspiracy theories will never die - if you want to subscribe to those, man has never been to the moon, and 9/11 and 26/11 were inside jobs. Till proven to the contrary, be a responsible person and stay within the premises of what has been proven in court.

Justice being delayed/denied to victims of the Gujarat massacre is not something we are proud of, but that is not because of religion, but the despicable "immunity" political parties and politicians enjoy in our country. How many people from the Congress have been charged for 1984? You surely seem to see things the way you want to.

Please stop painting a picture of a larger "Hindutva" lobby or conspiracy. With 80% of the country from one religion, this country could have dug the theocratic grave if it had ever wanted to.

 

[Bull]

a nationwide network of Hindutva terrorists that has its tentacles spread up to Nepal and Israel is out to destroy India's secularism and to reshape it into a theocratic state like Afghanistan under the Taliban.

A theocratic state like Afghanistan is showered with muslim brotherhood love while alarm bells start ringing when a possibility of Hindu theocratic state is felt.

I would love to have India as a Hindu nation , which lets every faith be followed.

 

[RiazHaq]

sir,

There is nothing called "Hindutva Terrorists" this is the fact. And as a Indian and a Christian i hold more credibility than you in this regard.

thanks

I think All Indian Christian Council speaks for a lot more Indian Christians than you a an individual.

Here's a report on their website:

Up to 20,000 Indian Christians face Christmas as refugees – two years after a wave of attacks by militant Hindus in the state of Orissa.

Release International warns many displaced by the worst sectarian rioting in India are still unable to return to their villages for fear of death or forcible conversion to Hinduism. Many who were witnesses to the riots face threats and intimidation by mobs gathered outside courtrooms. Up to 75 people were killed in the ultra-nationalist riots and 50,000 were driven from their homes, yet two years on, hundreds of cases have yet to be dealt with effectively by the judicial system.

Release International, which is part of the Religious Liberty Partnership (RLP), is calling for the Indian government to do all in its power to bring about justice, and for churches around the world to remember at Christmas the Indian Christians who were victims of the riots.

Andy Dipper, CEO of Release International, which serves persecuted Christians worldwide, says: "Please pray for Christians in India this Christmas, especially those in Orissa who still face the high risk of attack and marginalization from the Hindu fundamentalists."

Release partner, the All India Christian Council, estimate up to 20,000 Christians who were driven from their villages by Hindu ultra-nationalists have been unable to return home. "Many village leaders are only allowing people to settle if they convert to Hinduism," says Release partner John Dayal, Secretary General of the All India Christian Council.

christiancouncil.in - Home

Haq's Musings: South Asian Christians Celebrate Christmas in Fear

 

[PlanetWarrior]

no no no....planetwarrior.....you asked to look at our own backyard with regards to terrorism and oher factors before looking at our neighbours....wel guess what, you go thte same points out back to you.....

And anyways.....Indian state sponsored terrorist organisation RAW is enough to be exported to Pakistan.....as well as the terrorism during the 80's and 90's using religious sects to carry out mayhem in Pakistan like Shias, Ahmadis, MQM............however, another topic for another thread......

Gazzi, every nation has a dissatisfied minority who will remain dissatisfied for a host of reasons (religion, race, wealth distribution etc) and hence every nation in the world will have an organisation capable of creating mayhem or creating mayhem. Even a peaceful, respected nation like South Africa is now being threatened (verbally) by extremists white right wingers who are enraged by the recent murder of their leader at the hands of his Black farm workers. The question I posed is simply whether it is encumbent for anyone to mock the Naxal uprising in India considering the situation in their own backyard/s.

You may label R&AW a terrorist organisation whilst we do the same to your ISI. So in essence you may say tomato whilst I say tomatoe but the essence of the fruit remains the same

 

[RiazHaq]

This is an irresponsible post. A war between India and Pakistan cannot be sparked off by a Hindu-Muslim confrontation. India is not a Hindu state, and I don't know why you think you are the torch-bearers of Islam. When Ajmal Kasab and his gang caused mayhem, they were asked to kill as many Indians as possible, not target Hindus alone. Do you even care to know how many Muslims were massacred by these guys?

Conspiracy theories will never die - if you want to subscribe to those, man has never been to the moon, and 9/11 and 26/11 were inside jobs. Till proven to the contrary, be a responsible person and stay within the premises of what has been proven in court.

Justice being delayed/denied to victims of the Gujarat massacre is not something we are proud of, but that is not because of religion, but the despicable "immunity" political parties and politicians enjoy in our country. How many people from the Congress have been charged for 1984? You surely seem to see things the way you want to.

Please stop painting a picture of a larger "Hindutva" lobby or conspiracy. With 80% of the country from one religion, this country could have dug the theocratic grave if it had ever wanted to.

SM Mushrif is not a conspiracy theorist. He is the former police chief of Maharashtra and he speaks with inside knowledge and experience of how deeply Indian intelligence is infiltrated by Hindutva extremists.

In his book "Who Killed Karkare?", he cites specific cases where the Hindutva outfits, allied with the Sangh Parivar, have carried out terrorists attacks inside India, and such attacks were falsely blamed on ISI and Pakistan. In one instance of Samjhota Express bombing, it is now known to have been carried out by Col Purohit, a serving Indian officer. Mushrif says that the IB tried to deflect the blame for the blast to Pakistan's ISI. Such a serious allegation was designed to spark a war between India and Pakistan.

Haq's Musings: Hindutva Terror to Spark India-Pakistan War?

 

[Justin Joseph]

I think All Indian Christian Council speaks for a lot more Indian Christians than you a an individual.

You are trying to tell me about my own faith and country??????

The people you are mentioning are doing politics and want donations from foreign sources.

Here is the truth from Archbishop Raphael Cheenath of Cuttack-Bhubaneshwar publised in christianpost.com :

Indian Christians Reject USCIRF Report; Defends 'Secular' India

The U.S. Commission on International Religious Freedom's decision to place India on its Watch List was slammed by Christian leaders in the state of Orissa.

Stating that India is truly secular in letter and spirit, Archbishop Raphael Cheenath of Cuttack-Bhubaneshwar rejected USCIRF's report and said there should be "no doubt over the secular credentials of India."

USCIRF last week criticized India for its inadequate response in protecting religious minorities and placed it in the category of nations that require “close monitoring due to the nature and extent of violations of religious freedom engaged in or tolerated by the government.” The list also includes countries like Afghanistan, Somalia and Cuba.

The 14-page report by the U.S. panel cited last year's violence against Christians in Orissa and said it had "sparked a prolonged and destructive campaign targeting Christians, resulting in attacks against churches and individuals."

But this alone cannot substantiate what the report has claimed, Indian Christians say. The country's secular character "overpowered" a few communal elements and has restored peace, Archbishop Cheenath pointed out to the PTI.

"What the Commission said is against our country's Constitution," he said, adding that India believes in respecting all religions and one should not forget it "thrives on secular character since ages."

Expressing similar views, the Orissa Minority Forum president, Swarupananda Patra, said India has been the target of a hate campaign by a small section and the “civil society of the majority community has been extremely cordial and supportive."

The riots in Kandhamal district in Orissa and earlier in Gujarat must not be generalized to embarrass the strong secular foundation of the nation, another organization maintained.

An American-based Hindu organization also came strongly against the USCIRF report which it said contained “innate bias, lack of insight and absence of understanding."

"This is a country whose last President was Muslim, whose leader of the largest political party is Christian and whose Prime Minister is Sikh. In contrast, behold the shrill outcry when our own President Obama was alleged to be Muslim," the Hindu American Foundation said.

HAF further also took a dig at the core members of the USCIRF panel. "Six members are Christian, one is Jewish and one Muslim. Not a single non-Abrahamic faith is represented.”

Meanwhile, the Obama Administration on Friday refrained from making any comment on the USCIRF report, but said freedom of expression and religion was important for the United States.

"You know, freedom of expression and religious freedom we think are hallmarks of stable, progressive societies in the 21st century. It is obviously important to us," Assistant Secretary of State for Public Affairs P.J. Crowley said at the daily State Department press briefing.

USCIRF, an independent, bipartisan federal government commission, releases its annual report on religious freedom each May. This year, however, the India chapter was delayed because of a planned trip to India in June. A USCIRF delegation had planned to meet with officials, religious leaders and civil society activists to discuss religious freedom conditions but was denied visas for entry.

Indian Christians Reject USCIRF Report; Defends 'Secular' India | Christianpost.com

 

[notsuperstitious]

add kindergardens after all caste system still prevails in india and people are killed, burned alive or praded nude on basis of color, race and religon

Oh yes, thanks fo adding that too. I just came back from one such parade, nice weather for it these days.

And I suppose these aborrant practices of ours will lead to a war (as thats the topic YOU have posted) because the morally scrupulous pakistan will feel the moral need to attack india and rescue its people

Anything on topic other than throwing up the yellow stuff?

 

[RiazHaq]

You are trying to tell me about my own faith and country??????

The people you are mentioning are doing politics and want donations from foreign sources.

Here is the truth from Archbishop Raphael Cheenath of Cuttack-Bhubaneshwar publised in christianpost.com :

Indian Christians Reject USCIRF Report; Defends 'Secular' India

The U.S. Commission on International Religious Freedom's decision to place India on its Watch List was slammed by Christian leaders in the state of Orissa.

Stating that India is truly secular in letter and spirit, Archbishop Raphael Cheenath of Cuttack-Bhubaneshwar rejected USCIRF's report and said there should be "no doubt over the secular credentials of India."

USCIRF last week criticized India for its inadequate response in protecting religious minorities and placed it in the category of nations that require “close monitoring due to the nature and extent of violations of religious freedom engaged in or tolerated by the government.” The list also includes countries like Afghanistan, Somalia and Cuba.

The 14-page report by the U.S. panel cited last year's violence against Christians in Orissa and said it had "sparked a prolonged and destructive campaign targeting Christians, resulting in attacks against churches and individuals."

But this alone cannot substantiate what the report has claimed, Indian Christians say. The country's secular character "overpowered" a few communal elements and has restored peace, Archbishop Cheenath pointed out to the PTI.

"What the Commission said is against our country's Constitution," he said, adding that India believes in respecting all religions and one should not forget it "thrives on secular character since ages."

Expressing similar views, the Orissa Minority Forum president, Swarupananda Patra, said India has been the target of a hate campaign by a small section and the “civil society of the majority community has been extremely cordial and supportive."

The riots in Kandhamal district in Orissa and earlier in Gujarat must not be generalized to embarrass the strong secular foundation of the nation, another organization maintained.

An American-based Hindu organization also came strongly against the USCIRF report which it said contained “innate bias, lack of insight and absence of understanding."

"This is a country whose last President was Muslim, whose leader of the largest political party is Christian and whose Prime Minister is Sikh. In contrast, behold the shrill outcry when our own President Obama was alleged to be Muslim," the Hindu American Foundation said.

HAF further also took a dig at the core members of the USCIRF panel. "Six members are Christian, one is Jewish and one Muslim. Not a single non-Abrahamic faith is represented.”

Meanwhile, the Obama Administration on Friday refrained from making any comment on the USCIRF report, but said freedom of expression and religion was important for the United States.

"You know, freedom of expression and religious freedom we think are hallmarks of stable, progressive societies in the 21st century. It is obviously important to us," Assistant Secretary of State for Public Affairs P.J. Crowley said at the daily State Department press briefing.

USCIRF, an independent, bipartisan federal government commission, releases its annual report on religious freedom each May. This year, however, the India chapter was delayed because of a planned trip to India in June. A USCIRF delegation had planned to meet with officials, religious leaders and civil society activists to discuss religious freedom conditions but was denied visas for entry.

Indian Christians Reject USCIRF Report; Defends 'Secular' India | Christianpost.com

Your post in no way contradicts the reality of tens of thousands of Indian Christians in Orissa and Muslims in Gujarat languishing in refugee camps years after the riots. The Indian government has failed to create a sense of security among them because the culprits and the killers still roam free.

Here's another piece by an Indian Kapil Komireddy demolishing the carefully crafted secular image of India:

For decades Indian intellectuals have claimed that religion, particularly Hinduism, is perfectly compatible with secularism. Indian secularism, they said repeatedly, is not a total rejection of religion by the state but rather an equal appreciation of every faith. Even though no faith is in principle privileged by the state, this approach made it possible for religion to find expression in the public sphere, and, since Hindus in India outnumber adherents of every other faith, Hinduism dominated it. Almost every government building in India has a prominently positioned picture of a Hindu deity. Hindu rituals accompany the inauguration of all public works, without exception.

The novelist Shashi Tharoor tried to burnish this certifiably sectarian phenomenon with a facile analogy: Indian Muslims, he wrote, accept Hindu rituals at state ceremonies in the same spirit as teetotallers accept champagne in western celebrations. This self-affirming explanation is characteristic of someone who belongs to the majority community. Muslims I interviewed took a different view, but understandably, they were unwilling to protest for the fear of being labelled as "angry Muslims" in a country famous for its tolerant Hindus.

The failure of secularism in India – or, more accurately, the failure of the Indian model of secularism – may be just one aspect of the gamut of failures, but it has the potential to bring down the country. Secularism in India rests entirely upon the goodwill of the Hindu majority. Can this kind of secularism really survive a Narendra Modi as prime minister? As Hindus are increasingly infected by the kind of hatred that Varun Gandhi's speech displayed, maybe it is time for Indian secularists to embrace a new, more radical kind of secularism that is not afraid to recognise and reject the principal source of this strife: religion itself.

Kapil Komireddi: India's failing secularism | Comment is free | guardian.co.uk

 

[ramu]

Extermisim irrespective of the religion should be condemned and put to rest. Terrorism can be practiced by illogical misinterpretations of religion and it is not the religion that is to be blamed.

 

[Justin Joseph]

Your post in no way contradicts the reality of tens of thousands of Indian Christians in Orissa

This only proves your arrogance and proves that you just don't wanna listen or be rational, just to troll.

When you are not ready to Liston to the Archbishop Raphael Cheenath of Cuttack-Bhubaneshwar's view published in Christian's own newspaper christianpost.com no one can satisfy you.

@ Indian Members, No need to reply to him.

 

[Speaker]

SM Mushrif is not a conspiracy theorist. He is the former police chief of Maharashtra and he speaks with inside knowledge and experience of how deeply Indian intelligence is infiltrated by Hindutva extremists.

In his book "Who Killed Karkare?", he cites specific cases where the Hindutva outfits, allied with the Sangh Parivar, have carried out terrorists attacks inside India, and such attacks were falsely blamed on ISI and Pakistan. In one instance of Samjhota Express bombing, it is now known to have been carried out by Col Purohit, a serving Indian officer. Mushrif says that the IB tried to deflect the blame for the blast to Pakistan's ISI. Such a serious allegation was designed to spark a war between India and Pakistan.

Haq's Musings: Hindutva Terror to Spark India-Pakistan War?

I don't intend this to be a verbal ping-pong, but till it is not proven to be an insider's job, it is a conspiracy theory. I don't know which all "attacks" we have falsely been accusing you of. There has been ample proof of Pakistani involvement where applicable. If left to theorists, Kasab is an India with the name of Amar Singh or something. For all this, there was a Congress government at the center and in Maharasthra and they will not align with the Sangh Parivar any day. Logic suffers collateral damage when writers indulge in flights of imagination. Unfortunately, this seems to be one such case.