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Britain is No Longer a Major Military Power

Every country having a second strike capability is a major military power,developing or not.
And quit calling your country ''developing'',you know thats not true anymore.:pissed::pissed::pissed:

Well we are still a developing country. :P

The cities along the coast have a high level of development, similar to Hong Kong, but at least half of China still lives in the rural areas. And that means our GDP per capita does not reach the required amount to be classified as a developed country, not for a while yet.

China's GDP per capita is currently lower than Mexico. It's important to understand our own limitations, in my opinion at least.

China is currently trying to acquire blue water navy "capability", and acquiring tools needed for power projection, but these capabilities will remain untested for the foreseeable future. This is in direct contrast to the old-world developed countries which have proven power projection capabilities, that are being used right now.
 
Why are people not able to understand that UK today is indeed no major power in the sense of having the capabilities of fighting and occupying a foreign country like the US did in Iraq. But this does not mean that Brits are weak. No sane nation would dare to touch them. They still can annihilate every country and military that attacks them.
 
The Brits are capable of defending themselves against every threat if needed. As long as this is the case, Britain remains strong in my opinion.

Britain may no longer be a major military power but on the other hand no current military major power would dare to attack them.
agree. any more powerful than that is a waste of taxpayers' money.
 
yeah bro- I forgot how Pakistan existed well before 1947 and Pak fauj, fizia etc. were fighting in the 2nd ww. Anyway that's beside the point. The point is how there is always an excuse for the brits getting a thrashing ---and let's be clear, they ONLY got thrashings until the yanks came in. Lose Singapore and Indo- China-- oh we were fighting in Europe. Take a thrashing in Europe and withdraw from Dunkirk is 'glorious'. When Stalin was burning bridges and Russian troops fought street for street.

Of course Pakistan didn't exist then. I just wanted to acknowledge that a great portion of the men came from Pakistan.
What do you mean "excuse". The British have always been forensic when analysing defeats on the battlefield. Yet again you repeat the same thing that "when the yanks came", they were not there during the Africa campaign or at the Battle of Britain.
As for Stalin he wiped out his entire military hierarchy. The idiot was to blame for a great deal of the damage the German army managed to inflict. Holding him up as an ideal just shoots your credibility.
 
Well we are still a developing country. :P

The cities along the coast have a high level of development, similar to Hong Kong, but at least half of China still lives in the rural areas. And that means our GDP per capita does not reach the required amount to be classified as a developed country, not for a while yet.

China's GDP per capita is currently lower than Mexico. It's important to understand our own limitations, in my opinion at least.

In nominal, China has higher GDP/capita than Mexico.

Sometime around 2025, China will join the ranks of the developed world.
 
@waz do you support @Blue Marlin claim that we are "bloody leeches" ?
Blue Marlin sad that he:


Some 2,600 British ex-soldiers jailed last year for violent, sexual crimes
Sun Mar 19, 2017 3:13AM
Nearly 2,600 British war veterans deployed to Iraq and Afghanistan during the US-led invasion of the two countries have been imprisoned over the past year over committing violent crimes as well as sexual offences.

The figure represents between four and five percent of Britain’s total prison population, according to UK’s Ministry of Justice (MoJ), prompting concerns about the impact the military invasion of Afghanistan and Iraq has had on the mental health of former members of the British armed forces, The Guardian reported Saturday.

The MoJ began identifying the convicted ex-soldiers as they entered the prison system in January 2015 after concerns over the management of British war veterans were raised in a review of the criminal justice system.

Based on the figures, the former members of the armed forces accounted for 721 of the “first receptions” from July to September 2015, the initial period when they were released.

The numbers, the report adds, appear to have dropped since, 545 arrived in the system in the same period a year later. In the year leading up to last September, 2,565 veterans were imprisoned.

The development came after historic murder conviction against British soldier Alexander Blackman, who shot dead a seriously wounded Taliban prisoner in Afghanistan, was overturned earlier in the week and replaced with the lighter charge of manslaughter on the grounds of “diminished responsibility,” according to the report.

Blackman’s lawyers argued that he had adjustment disorder at the time of the killing after “serving for months on the frontline in terrible conditions.”

Although the British veterns of the US-led wars in Iraq and Afghanistan represent five percent of UK’s prison population, “but they represent a disproportionate number of serious violent offences and sexual offences, and that raises questions that need answering,” said Fraces Crook, the chief executive of independent charity organization, the Howard League for Penal Reform.

“These are not victimless crimes. They have a terrible effect on the victim,” he added.

Crook further added that several factors contributed to the number, including alcohol abuse and post-traumatic stress disorder.

Research by the organization also found that 25 percent of former combat forces were in prison for sexual offences, compared with 11 percent of the civilian prison population.

The report further quoted a Defense Ministry spokesperson as saying, “Most former service personnel return to civilian life without problems and are less likely to commit criminal offences than their civilian counterparts, but we’re determined to help those who fall into difficulty, and last year awarded £4.6m to schemes targeted at tackling this issue.”

“The government has enshrined the Armed Forces Covenant in law to make sure veterans are treated fairly and receive the support they deserve, including with mental health issues, getting on the housing ladder, and applying for civilian jobs,” the official added.

British soldiers represented the second largest contingent of mostly Western military forces that took part in the US-led occupation of Afghanistan in 2001 and Iraq in 2003 under the purported “war on terror” schemes. Nearly 15 years later, both countries are struggling with unrelenting incidents of terrorism amid growing suspicions that they have directly and indirectly aided the establishment of some terrorist elements in both countries.
Source: http://www.presstv.com/Detail/2017/...of-Justice-prison-population-Iraq-Afghanistan

No I don't believe Poles are leeches. I like Polish folks. You seem to hate the English though.

Oh yes war crimes, let's see.

On March 19, the Military District Court in Warsaw cleared of war crimes four Polish soldiers accused of killing civilians during their mission in Afghanistan in 2007. The five-judge court declared that “there was a lack of convincing proof that the war crime was committed.”

Court spokesman Tomasz Krajewski stated: “The court did not establish that the soldiers’ actions were deliberate. The shooting of the village was not on purpose; neither was the killing of the civilians.” Three troops were also charged with the lesser violation of improper execution of a command and the use of an incorrect type of weaponry, inconsistent with the rules implemented by the Polish military contingent in Afghanistan.

On August 16, 2007, a Polish squad from the 18th storm trooper battalion, a member of US-NATO forces, fired 24 rounds of mortar shells into a wedding party in the Nangar Khel (Sha Mardan) village in Paktika province of eastern Afghanistan, killing eight civilians. Six were killed immediately while two more died from their injuries at the hospital. Among the victims were the groom, children and women, one of them pregnant. Although an emergency C-section was performed, the baby died.

The unprovoked attack was most likely revenge for the injury suffered by two Polish soldiers from a different unit when their vehicle hit a Taliban mine near the village earlier that day. According to the witnesses, the order carried by Lt. Col. Łukasz “Bolec” Bywalec, was issued by captain Olgierd “Olo” Cieśla, a commander of Charlie combat team at Wazi-Kwa base in Afghanistan, who told his men to “f--- over a couple of villages.”

Commander Maciej Nowak and Lieutenant Artur Pracki, who later served as witnesses for the prosecution, refused to follow the order and contacted the base with a request to stop the attack on the wedding party. It was also reported that the battalion members were wearing informal arm badges with a skull and crossbones on black background, a symbol of the Bielsko-Biała Delta platoon.

In 2009, the Warsaw Military District Court charged four officers and three privates with war crimes for the incident. All seven were acquitted in 2011 for lack of evidence of deliberate killing. The Military Supreme Court trial was reopened for four of them in 2012.

Lt. Col. Łukasz Bywalec, facing 12 years in prison, received a six-month suspended sentence. Warrant officer (reserve) Andrzej Osiecki, facing an eight-year sentence, was given a suspended two-year term. Platoon commander (reserve) Tomasz Borysiewicz, who used the mortar, received a two-year suspended sentence, while Private Damian Ligocki, who shot at the village with the machine gun, was not sentenced. All of the accused pleaded not guilty.

According to the prosecution, the attack on Nangar Khel was a deliberate crime, targeting a civilian population. It was not, as the accused and later the Polish Minister of Defense Bogdan Klich had claimed, a tragic accident during a mission to eliminate identified Taliban targets. The action of the soldiers was not a response to enemy fire, making the use of the mortar against residential buildings unjustified. “The accused acted with a deliberate intent”, stated prosecutor Konopka, “they at least agreed to the death of civilians.”

Defense attorney Witold Leśniewski argued the importance of acquitting the accused in the framework of the political atmosphere and the message a guilty verdict would send to the troops: “The accused are warriors, born soldiers,” he declared in his final statement. “Such people are needed in Poland.”

After the first acquittal, Radosław Sikorski, former minister of foreign affairs in the government of Donald Tusk, commented: “During the war mistakes occur, they always have, but today we can have satisfaction that it does not mean that the Polish soldiers are guilty.”

The announcement that the Nangar Khel massacre was not a war crime sends a very dangerous signal to the public, demonstrating the readiness of the Polish government to support the geostrategic ambitions of US imperialism while ignoring international law.

It is the first time in the history of Poland that its military forces have been openly accused of a violation of The Hague Convention and the Fourth Geneva Convention protecting civilians during armed combat. The court ruling also gives carte blanche to all those who are willing to engage in combat where “collateral damage” is allowed, as the consequences for committing such atrocities are minimal or none.

The Nangar Khel crime is just a tip of the iceberg of unlawful and barbaric actions of the US- and NATO-led war machine in the Middle East. According to a 2014 Amnesty International report, most of war crimes committed by US and NATO forces since the invasion of Afghanistan in 2001 have gone unpunished.

The report cited only six cases in which members of the military were criminally prosecuted, with only 10 defendants convicted of serious crimes, including in the 2012 case of US Staff Sgt. Robert Bales. In nine out of ten cases, eyewitnesses were not even interviewed by the military investigators.

The enormous scale of US-NATO operations in occupied Afghanistan was revealed in the 2010 disclosures of WikiLeaks, which posted 91,731 American military documents, including thousands of cases of reports of “friendly action” by US-NATO forces. The total number of civilian casualties is unknown, but it can be estimated at tens of thousands.

In 2014 alone, the UN documented 10,548 Afghan civilian casualties, 3,699 deaths and 6,849 injuries. These numbers are most likely higher as nobody bothers to count deaths from hunger and disease among the Afghan people, including refugees who were forced to flee areas affected by war.

From the very beginning Poland, acting as a proxy state, offered its support for US predatory military actions in Iraq and Afghanistan. Its shameful involvement in Operation Enduring Freedom in Afghanistan began in March 2002, with the sending to Bagram of approximately 120 logisticians and combat engineers as well as soldiers from special operations unit GROM.

From 2006, as part of the NATO-led International Security Assistance Force (ISAF), Poland assumed responsibility for the Ghazni Province, where it stationed about 2,600 soldiers and army civilians along with a reserve of 400 soldiers. Despite his pre-election promises of withdrawing troops from Afghanistan by 2012, President Bronisław Komorowski, backed by the Tusk government, offered to send an additional contingent of 2,500 soldiers.

Although Poland’s involvement in the Afghan war officially ended in 2014, the country is still taking part in the Resolute Support Mission that began in January 2015, with about 150 personnel currently stationed in Afghanistan.

In total, more than 28,000 Polish soldiers and army civilians served in Afghanistan: 45 of them died in combat and 866 were wounded, 361 seriously. Materiel losses included three Mi-24 helicopters, three unmanned reconnaissance vehicles and eight Rosomak armored vehicles, among others. The general cost of Polish involvement in Afghanistan is estimated at PLN 5,908.6 billion (approximately US$1.5 billion).

As with the war in Iraq, Poland’s military involvement in Afghanistan was highly unpopular among Poles, with only 17 percent supporting the country’s military operations, according to a 2011 poll taken shortly after the first trial of the soldiers.

Despite the popular opposition to war, the Polish government continues to blindly follow the US lead, committing more funds to revamp its military forces and using conflict in Ukraine as a pretext for a push for war with Russia. Recently, minister of defense Tomasz Siemoniak announced plans to acquire Tomahawk cruise missiles, 1000-mile-range first-strike weapons suited for precise strikes on distant high-value targets.

Last Thursday’s verdict serves to legitimize imperialist war crimes. It is not only the soldiers directly responsible for deaths of eight Afghan civilians who should have received guilty verdicts, but such a judgment should have been extended to all those responsible for the devastation of Afghanistan, from commanders and officers of the Polish army all the way up to President Komorowski, the commander in chief.


https://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2015/03/25/poli-m25.html
 
Of course Pakistan didn't exist then. I just wanted to acknowledge that a great portion of the men came from Pakistan.
What do you mean "excuse". The British have always been forensic when analysing defeats on the battlefield. Yet again you repeat the same thing that "when the yanks came", they were not there during the Africa campaign or at the Battle of Britain.
As for Stalin he wiped out his entire military hierarchy. The idiot was to blame for a great deal of the damage the German army managed to inflict. Holding him up as an ideal just shoots your credibility.


I'm not holding stalin as an ideal, I'm saying NOT retreating and fighting tough has been norm of pride among the major victors. The issue with Dunkirk- it is not the retreat alone but that it is a part of a continuing trend of defeat of the british forces, Indo China, Europe. And the political fate of the second WW was not decided in Africa. The brits have rarely been forensic or accrate in anything. They're generally delusional and self congratulatory even in defeat.
 
In nominal, China has higher GDP/capita than Mexico.

Sometime around 2025, China will join the ranks of the developed world.

Sure, the exact year would have a lot to do with currency fluctuations though.

And even if we reach the nominal GDP per capita to be considered a developed country, it will be at a very low level compared to other advanced economies.

With no real chance to test the power projection capabilities that we are currently acquiring.
 
Sure, the exact year would have a lot to do with currency fluctuations though.

And even if we reach the nominal GDP per capita to be considered a developed country, it will be at a very low level compared to other advanced economies.

With no real chance to test the power projection capabilities that we are currently acquiring.

you must be getting a real high.
 
I thought you would have stopped reading this pile of rubbish when he cites a historian recounting the failure of the British forces early on in the war, then in the next sentence cites the same author who outlines the numerous victories that came after. So the British became better right? He hilariously writes about he failure of the British to contain the NI insurgency, when the entire movement, including half the IRA leadership were infiltrated by the British services. They were bought crashing down from the inside! By his own admission their last major meeting clearly stated "we can't win the war".
The man is a Buffon and being cheered on by a number of known anti-British posters here, half of whom were never around during any of the events they speak of.

The British remain a top level military power with reach.

262763F600000578-2972278-image-a-41_1425054732481.jpg


A new era is dawning.
i know, i have not trolled in a while so i thought i may as well let it out.

you mean with 2 million Indian troops...THEY NEEDED MORE HELP?



I have clarified my quest is for TRUTH. And as far as this ship is concerned, talk to me after it actually does a fully loaded 30 knots. Right now it's been a tourist attraction barely able to move on it's own power. I don't even want to talk about it's aircraft complement. And no- this ship won't be a scratch on INS Vishal. Vishal will be leagues ahead of this.
ins vishal......lol
indigenous???? only if you call it being designed by the italians and smaller than the america class amphibious ships.
 
Well we are still a developing country. :P

The cities along the coast have a high level of development, similar to Hong Kong, but at least half of China still lives in the rural areas. And that means our GDP per capita does not reach the required amount to be classified as a developed country, not for a while yet.

China's GDP per capita is currently lower than Mexico. It's important to understand our own limitations, in my opinion at least.

China is currently trying to acquire blue water navy "capability", and acquiring tools needed for power projection, but these capabilities will remain untested for the foreseeable future. This is in direct contrast to the old-world developed countries which have proven power projection capabilities, that are being used right now.
yeah sure,why not,i believe you.:sarcastic:
 
Of course Pakistan didn't exist then. I just wanted to acknowledge that a great portion of the men came from Pakistan.
What do you mean "excuse". The British have always been forensic when analysing defeats on the battlefield. Yet again you repeat the same thing that "when the yanks came", they were not there during the Africa campaign or at the Battle of Britain.
As for Stalin he wiped out his entire military hierarchy. The idiot was to blame for a great deal of the damage the German army managed to inflict. Holding him up as an ideal just shoots your credibility.

It is true Stalin shot a lot of officers prior to 1941
Give him credit he stiffened the resolve of the Red Army when the Germans were close to scoring a decisive win
 
i know, i have not trolled in a while so i thought i may as well let it out.


ins vishal......lol
indigenous???? only if you call it being designed by the italians and smaller than the america class amphibious ships.

I forgot how the excellent british education system teaches you addition where 70,000 T is lesser than 44,000 T
 
Why does it matter? Their (UK) people still live a far better quality life than people from countries insulting them here. They really don't need a military stronger than what it is right now.
 
Britain is No Longer a Major Military Power
Matthew JAMISON | 14.02.2017 | WORLD

In particular, the performance of the British army throughout the 20th century and early 21st century raises serious concerns if the British army is really fit for purpose. Despite having vastly more troops than the Wehrmacht and the added strength of the French army, the British Expeditionary Force was unable to secure the borders of France against the invading Nazis and were resoundingly defeated and humiliated with their withdrawal to and subsequent scuttle from Dunkirk. Indeed, the British army were very lucky that they were not completely annihilated at Dunkirk and it was only due to ironically and perversely the mercy of Adolf Hitler and his peculiar admiration for England. The Nazis could have finished off the British army at Dunkirk but rather than delivering the killer blow Hitler allowed the remnants of the British army to escape. Indeed one of Hitler's last statements before his suicide on 30 April 1945, claimed that he had allowed the British Expeditionary Force to escape as a «sporting gesture» in order to induce British Prime Minister Winston Churchill to conclude a peace agreement with Nazi Germany.

Germans were true pioneers in blitzkrieg - Mannstein, Guderian & co
 
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