BrahMos test-flown from Su-30 MKI fighter jet; world will envy IAF, says BrahMos Aerospace MD

[kṣamā]

Could you PLEASE answer this query --Which Missile should be fired FIRST for taking out a Target -- SCALP or BRAHMOS

Definitely neither of them. They will launch a decoy before they move in for the final kill. They , atlest in theory, would start with inexpensive PGMs like the long range glide bombs. Those will highlight the passive QR air defences. Then it would be a firing sequence of n * Supersonic ammunition then x*mix of ammunition subsonic followed by x*Supersonic ammunition. This will ensure that both sub and Supersonic ammunition reach there target without resistance.

Could you PLEASE answer this query --Which Missile should be fired FIRST for taking out a Target -- SCALP or

 

[noksss]

M777 howtizer for the Army and Sukhoi-30 with Brahmos for the airforce in the north east to take on the Chinese

 

[SrNair]

I'd still take the Super Bug with LRASM

That system suits for the US.Because their enemies are far away from them .But in ours case ,one irritant and one threat is right next to our door .So less range yet supersonic would be helpful.

 

[MilSpec]

Do you know that the LRASM program was initially divided into LRASM-A and LRASM-B? A is what you see today. B was supposed to be a short-medium range Brahmos class missile.

B was canceled because the technology was not feasible while being very expensive.

The US doesn't have a Brahmos class missile, and that's not because of choice. In fact, the US attempted to buy Russian KH-31. The sale was supposed to happen but the Russians canceled in the last minute. They realized the US doesn't have the technology so it was pointless to sell it to them.

Russia did sell the MA31 variant of the mini moskit KH31 to US as a target drone.

 

[randomradio]

The United States never tried to acquire the KH-31, only the MA-31 as a stopgap before the GQM-163 was ready:


AQM-127 SLAT, that was supposed to succeed Vandal, has problems with its software and was proving costly to fix.

Due to the spiraling costs, an interim solution was sought, and with relations between the US and Russia good duing those years, the MA-31 was asked for.

You keep mentioning the KH-31 as proof the US can't make supersonic AShMs because it lacked the tech to do so. The acquisition of the MA-31 had nothing to do with AShM programs, hence why I said it wasn't bought for that purpose.

You're conflagrating two independent items.

Thanks for being courteous this time around. I noticed you have edited your previous post.

Anyway, this is a bit more complex than the MA-31 merely being an interim program. The program first started with McDonnell Douglas, it was meant to study the KH-31. Obviously the Russians wouldn't supply the weaponized version so they delivered a stripped down version with no electronics to Boeing, after McDonnell was bought over. This missile was in competition with Honeywell's Sea Snake and later Orbital Sciences's Coyote.

When they say the MA-31 was interim, that's because the missile itself was heavily downgraded, could do only 50Km and had no Russian seeker. Another reason was it did not replicate Russian AShM threats. Boeing planned to purchase engine designs and modify the MA-31 to match the SSST's requirements. But the Russians did not allow ToT. It became pointless to invest in the US after the Chinese had offered to buy a long range version of the KH-31, which is now called the YJ-12, while India and other countries purchased the Russian version.

The Sea Snake was canceled and Boeing's MA-31 won as the interim solution. The follow up MA-31PG designed to match the SSST requirements then lost to Coyote.

The delivery of the MA-31 was directly related to corruption in the Russian military, Boeing was paying off Russian generals for the technology. This stopped once Putin became President. So the Russians no longer provided export clearance for the follow on versions. So there was a lot of politics involved, check the link.

The Coyote wasn't chosen because it was better, it was chosen because it no longer had competition. So they were not independent.

Some info from page 58 onwards.
https://books.google.co.in/books?id=oP7jwUl7FzkC&pg=PA63&lpg=PA63&dq=sea+snake+missile&source=bl&ots=2NfhwAXHNc&sig=Fdta8ROduPb9BPEPBv-uJmMCF88&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwi9qve008PNAhUBPo8KHfVVBp8Q6AEIGzAA#v=onepage&q=sea snake missile&f=false

The Coyote is very heavy, has no warhead, simpler electronics, range that is no better than the MA-31 and is not as maneuverable as a standard Russian supersonic AShM. After all Coyote was only an expendable target.

There should be a pretty good reason why the LRASM-B was canceled by DARPA and funding wasn't the only reason.

And now it appears the Russians have gone many steps ahead again.
http://nationalinterest.org/blog/th...-hypersonic-zircon-cruise-missile-enter-15909

Russia did sell the MA31 variant of the mini moskit KH31 to US as a target drone.

 

[#hydra#]

not is all types of missiles. we dont have much to show in the field of SAM and BVR and anti tank missiles.

May not be now,but surely in next 10yrs. And after all we don't require a missiles like lrasm in near future. We may require it for AMCA,then again we got enough time to devolop such missile for AMCA.

 

[Nilgiri]

@fsayed @Abingdonboy @Water Car Engineer @PARIKRAMA @noksss and all others

 

[Mufflerman]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GQM-163_Coyote

It's a target tmissile designed to simulate oniks and moskits. Goes in a straight line. Does not do terminal manoeuvres. And was still shit difficult to shoot down despite being hat simple. So good luck shooting down a missile that 2 generations later, has terminal manoeuvres, vertical dive etc.


And now think what a modern destroyer can do to a subsonic lrasm when the ships radar catches it 30 km out. Do you know how high the mfstar mast is?

 

[#hydra#]

Instead of modifying mki,we should order some 40+ su34.

 

[Stephen Cohen]

Instead of modifying mki,we should order some 40+ su34.

We cannot integrate Brahmos with SU 34 immediately

And we have spent a lot of time and efforts in modifying SU 30 and Brahmos both
so why waste that

 

[zebra7]

@zebra7

I read in Prasun Sir's blog about an India Israel standoff EMP-emitting missile,
based on SPICE 250

I don't recall Prasun ever mentioning EMP detonation based on Spice 250, neither I am convinced, that it could be used either because Spice 250 is very small. For such detonation, of EMP surge attack to supress the enemy electronic warfare capability, the explosion would be made at certain altitude above ground for maximum effect, and that would need GPS guilded Cruise Missile, which can carry EMP warhead and the size of the warhead should be around 1000 kg, and that's my guess. May some one else would like to comment. @randomradio @PARIKRAMA @Abingdonboy @MilSpec

 

[Stephen Cohen]

I don't recall Prasun ever mentioning EMP detonation based on Spice 250, neither I am convinced, that it could be used either because Spice 250 is very small. For such detonation, of EMP surge attack to supress the enemy electronic warfare capability, the explosion would be made at certain altitude above ground for maximum effect, and that would need GPS guilded Cruise Missile, which can carry EMP warhead and the size of the warhead should be around 1000 kg, and that's my guess. May some one else would like to comment. @randomradio @PARIKRAMA @Abingdonboy @MilSpec

This is the link ; please read it yourself

http://trishul-trident.blogspot.in/2015/05/missing-woods-for-trees.html

 

[zebra7]

Instead of modifying mki,we should order some 40+ su34.

My personal choise for ground attack was SU-24/25, with license build by HAL instead of Jaguar and MIG-27/23 but its a history now, and if that would have been the case, than we might think of SU-34, but now since we are already inducting Rafale, their is no need to induct another platform to have the similar capability, with the overhead of maintenance, spares, training and cost.

Its not modification of MKI, rather the deep upgradation process, which would involved AESA Bars upgrade, Internal EW jammer, up gradation and strengthening of airframe, and engine, and MAWS installation, which has become must to survive the modern combat.

BARS AESA upgrade, would add the capability of the MKI to do interleave operation of A2A and A2G simultaneously, and add the A2G attack capability, making it true Multirole fighter plane from the Air Defence/ Air Superiority fighter plane, with an edge of tangem seat with an extra pilot, to share the work load.

 

[#hydra#]

My personal choise for ground attack was SU-24/25, with license build by HAL instead of Jaguar and MIG-27/23 but its a history now, and if that would have been the case, than we might think of SU-34, but now since we are already inducting Rafale, their is no need to induct another platform to have the similar capability, with the overhead of maintenance, spares, training and cost.

Its not modification of MKI, rather the deep upgradation process, which would involved AESA Bars upgrade, Internal EW jammer, up gradation and strengthening of airframe, and engine, and MAWS installation, which has become must to survive the modern combat.

BARS AESA upgrade, would add the capability of the MKI to do interleave operation of A2A and A2G simultaneously, and add the A2G attack capability, making it true Multirole fighter plane from the Air Defence/ Air Superiority fighter plane, with an edge of tangem seat with an extra pilot, to share the work load.

I m agreeing with u,but nothing come close to su34s effective range. We can't perform any offensive strike on Chinese mainland with rafale (because of poor range,cant fly back to Indian based from Chinese mainland. At the most rafale can do some operations in Tibet's.)

 

[zebra7]

This is the link ; please read it yourself

http://trishul-trident.blogspot.in/2015/05/missing-woods-for-trees.html

Its been offered by Israeli to co develoved as JV and would be based on Spice 1000 and not Spice-250.