Bangladesh to China ordered 16 F-7BGI light fighter

[Major Shaheb]

JF-17 & JL-9 both had their maiden flight on 2003.

 

[Emmie]

Global Security: Reports:

It is widely reported that the FC-1 is a continuation of the "MiG-33 [R33]" program developed in the 1980s. The Russian company Mikoyan OKB Design Bureau, which designs all MIG series of aircraft, sold the design of MIG-33 to the China and Pakistan. This report is the source of considerable confusion, and indeed some rather fanciful speculation. The so-called MiG-33 design used in conjunction with the FC-1 program was apparently a the poorly attested "Product 33" lightweight single-engine project of the mid-1980s. A decade later, the MiG-33 nomenclature was briefly associated with the much larger twin-engine Mig-29M. This confused history has led to observations that the "FC-1 features air inlets on the lateral sides of the fuselage rather than the ventral inlets of the MiG-33. ... the most apparent modifications to the MiG-33 design is the repositioning of the ventral fins from the engine compartment..." These supposed modifications to the mid-90s MiG-33 design actually reflect the fact that the FC-1 has no design relationship to the MiG-33 [MiG-29M].

In July 2003 it was reported that the "SUPER-7" fighter jet was ready to take its maiden flight, although a detailed timetable was not released. China's Super-7 Fighter completed its taxiing test on July 03, 2003 at a test ground of Chengdu Aircraft Industrial Corporation (CAC). As one of the eight major ground tests that must be completed before test flight, the taxiing test is aimed at trying the correctness of the design of electricity supply system, as well as signal connections between the electricity supply system and other external systems so as to provide important data to guarantee a successful first fly. Leiqiang, deputy director of the Chengdu Flight Group's trial flight department under the Chinese Air Force, said on Tuesday he will carry out the maiden flight task. On the day of the first flight, China Central Television (CCTV) will dispatch a special report group to broadcast the whole flight live. Leiqiang, also a "SUPER-7" pilot, and Yangwei, the jet's designer, who is also regarded as the father of "SUPER-7," will be featured on the CCTV program "Face to Face." On 25 August 2003 the FC-1 airplane carried on the initial flight. It flews 17 minutes before it returned to the airport. The serial production of the aircraft was to begin by January 2006.


Wikipedia:

In 1999, Pakistan and China signed the contract to jointly develop the FC-1/Super 7. Initial difficulties in acquiring an avionics and radar package from Europe led to many problems, which was solved in 2001, when design of the airframe was "de-coupled" from the avionics. In 2003, the maiden flight of the first prototype occurred in China. The Pakistani designation "Super-7", meanwhile, were replaced with "JF-17". Later test flights with a modified design occurred in 2006. Deliveries to the PAF for further flight testing and evaluation began in 2007[11] and the aircraft's first public aerial display took place that year in Islamabad. The PAF officially inducted its first JF-17 squadron, No. 26 Squadron, on 18 February 2010 with fourteen aircraft.

Defense Industry Daily: Reports:

Sino Defense reminds us that the JF-17/FC-1 ‘Xiaolong’ has a long history. The site recalls that China signed a $550 million agreement with Grumman in 1986 to modernise its J-7 fighter (MiG-21 copy) under the “Super-7” upgrade project, with US and British firms competing to provide the engine and avionics. The project was canceled after the Tienanmen Square massacre, but Chengdu Aircraft Industry Corporation managed to continue the program with its own resources, and the project was eventually re-branded as FC-1 (Fighter China-1).

Wait a second.... Paragraph one mentions JF-17 is a continuity of Mig-33...! Make up your mind 1st, is it continuity of J-7 or Mig-33?... And do read the entire stuff at first and then post excerpt... I help you with that. BTW JFT has nothing to do with Mig-33.

It is widely reported that the FC-1 is a continuation of the "MiG-33 [R33]" program developed in the 1980s. The Russian company Mikoyan OKB Design Bureau, which designs all MIG series of aircraft, sold the design of MIG-33 to the China and Pakistan. This report is the source of considerable confusion, and indeed some rather fanciful speculation. The so-called MiG-33 design used in conjunction with the FC-1 program was apparently a the poorly attested "Product 33" lightweight single-engine project of the mid-1980s. A decade later, the MiG-33 nomenclature was briefly associated with the much larger twin-engine Mig-29M. This confused history has led to observations that the "FC-1 features air inlets on the lateral sides of the fuselage rather than the ventral inlets of the MiG-33. ... the most apparent modifications to the MiG-33 design is the repositioning of the ventral fins from the engine compartment..." These supposed modifications to the mid-90s MiG-33 design actually reflect the fact that the FC-1 has no design relationship to the MiG-33 [MiG-29M].

Last three paragraphs mention same stuff....Yeah, project started as super 7 but later on the design undergone a complete alteration to meet PAF requirements, PAF wanted something like F-16... JFT inlets are DSI and quite redolent of F-18, tail is more like f-16, it has connard like leading edge root extension (LERX) like F-18.... Canopy, hard points, nose, vertical stabiliser in short everything is different... I have no idea what you want to prove by making JFT a derivative of J-7!

Let me suggest you something, do read the articles in their entirety before taking excerpts from them, just don't extract your favourite part... You will never face embarrassment this way... All the reference you posted had a lot different to say pertaining redesigning of JFT..

 

[Zabaniyah]

JF-17 & JL-9 both had their maiden flight on 2003.

So?

 

[Major Shaheb]

As BAF is considering 4 fighter aircraft contender so Im posting some pics of the 4:

Mig-29CMT:

 

[kobiraaz]

^ can you compare between CMT and present Bangladesh variants ? If possible also include indian Mig29..

 

[TopCat]

@Zabanya use your common sense. I totally agree with Major Saheb. F7->J7->JF17.

 

[Emmie]

@Zabanya use your common sense. I totally agree with Major Saheb. F7->J7->JF17.

Edited this part... Use signs smartly please..

Kindly elaborate with your knowledge how these 3 are same, in fact 2... I wonder if you can do it technically?..

 

[houshanghai]

@Zabanya use your common sense. I totally agree with Major Saheb. F7->J7->JF17.

JF17 is only in connection with project of J7, not design

well,
if JF17 is a MIG21/J7‘s variant,then can I say:"all F16 F18 MIG29 are a MIG21's variant?"lol

 

[TopCat]

Edited this part... Use signs smartly please..

Kindly elaborate with your knowledge how these 3 are same, in fact 2... I wonder if you can do it technically?..

I did not say all thse plane are similar. I said all of them derived from F7

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

I did not say all thse plane are similar. I said all of them derived from F7

You cant just derive a new jet from another...

 

[Emmie]

I did not say all thse plane are similar. I said all of them derived from F7

If you don't know then please note a fact that J-7 and F-7 are same, F-7 is export version of J-7... Plus, last 3 pages contain info that isolate JF-17 from J-7... If you still don't agree to that info then please prove your point technically.. What exactly is similar between JF-17 and F-7? Letter J and F or 7 of 17?

 

[Imran Khan]

If you don't know then please note a fact that J-7 and F-7 are same, F-7 is export version of J-7... Plus, last 3 pages contain info that isolate JF-17 from J-7... If you still don't agree to that info then please prove your point technically.. What exactly is similar between JF-17 and F-7? Letter J and F or 7 of 17?

yaar what they proove to you? design engine radar avionces weapons whole program told a story . but as they buy F-7 in 2012 now they may wanna hide behind something thats all i can say you think major deserve to be reply when he bring wiki and other 3rd rate sources with few images from here and there? he need more 5 years then we give him importance and time to reply him . choro na bhai jee .

 

[Zabaniyah]

@Zabanya use your common sense. I totally agree with Major Saheb. F7->J7->JF17.

I did not say all thse plane are similar. I said all of them derived from F7

No, it is not a matter of common sense. It's you who's not informed.

The Super-7 project took a different turn after the Western nations refused China access to technology. This Super-7 was originally based on the F-7.

And that turn lead to the development of the JF-17. And I am sure you didn't know that some design and test data were taken from the Soviet MiG-33 project.

MiG-33:

Although work on Product 33 became well advanced, with extensive wind-tunnel testing was conducted on the design, it was not ordered due to the the Soviet Air Force (VVS) dropped its support for concept about 1986 after a reorientation towards multi-role aircraft - the lightweight Product 33 could be used for close air combat only. The basic Product 33 design was offered by Mikoyan to China as the FC-1 fighter. However, the FC-1 is not a direct derivative of the Product 33 design, and while the wings may reflect Soviet aerodynamic data, the fuselage and air inlets reprsent an entirely rather different configuration.

MiG-33 FULCRUM

The development of this fighter, the improved copy of Soviet MIG-33 (which R&D was terminated due to absence of money at the beginning of 1990s), started at Chengdu Aircraft Industry Corp., in 1994-95.

More exactly, MIG-33 designers resumed this terminated project in Moscow under supervision of experts from Chengdu city and with financing from PLA. In 1995, Chengdu Corp. purchased 100 units advanced RD-93 jet engines, for the future FC-1, at Klimov Aircraft Corp. in St. Petersburg.

In 1997-98, Pakistani Air Forces joined this project; Pakistan provided significant part of R&D financing and is obliged to purchase one half of the future FC-1 production. Despite all the efforts, the project dealt with a lot of problems, and only at the beginning of 2001 did it enter the last stage.

Chinese Airshow a Hit With the Military

Basically, the MiG-33 had a very similar body to the F-16 but it's cockpit design was very similar to the MiG-29. And there was in fact one active prototype of that.

As I said before, the F-7's and JF-17's landing-gear positions and design are completely different. The radar and EW suite on the JF-17 are far more advanced than that of the F-7.

I never see you in JF-17 discussions here, or any military-related ones. Please do some research before making naive statements.

yaar what they proove to you? design engine radar avionces weapons whole program told a story . but as they buy F-7 in 2012 now they may wanna hide behind something thats all i can say you think major deserve to be reply when he bring wiki and other 3rd rate sources with few images from here and there? he need more 5 years then we give him importance and time to reply him . choro na bhai jee .

Some people like to undermine the JF-17 project over very petty things, and because it has the 'Pakistani connection'.

Some people say it's a 'derivative' of the F-7. Some say it's a copy of the MiG-33.

They do not understand how projects are carried out, how knowledge is shared and distributed, how knowledge is lost and found, how key technologies differentiate the product and how politics can potentially influence a military project.

Those people's minds are blanketed by ignorance, and they're proud of that ignorance.

 

[TopCat]

No, it is not a matter of common sense. It's you who's not informed.

The Super-7 project took a different turn after the Western nations refused China access to technology. This Super-7 was originally based on the F-7.

And that turn lead to the development of the JF-17. And I am sure you didn't know that some design and test data were taken from the Soviet MiG-33 project.

MiG-33:

MiG-33 FULCRUM


Chinese Airshow a Hit With the Military

Basically, the MiG-33 had a very similar body to the F-16 but it's cockpit design was very similar to the MiG-29. And there was in fact one active prototype of that.

As I said before, the F-7's and JF-17's landing-gear positions and design are completely different. The radar and EW suite on the JF-17 are far more advanced than that of the F-7.

I never see you in JF-17 discussions here, or any military-related ones. Please do some research before making naive statements.



Some people like to undermine the JF-17 project over very petty things, and because it has the 'Pakistani connection'.

Some people say it's a 'derivative' of the F-7. Some say it's a copy of the MiG-33.

They do not understand how projects are carried out, how knowledge is shared and distributed, how knowledge is lost and found, how key technologies differentiate the product and how politics can potentially influence a military project.

Those people's minds are blanketed by ignorance, and they're proud of that ignorance.

ok lab lab la...

After so many inclusions why the hell it still look like a F-7.

I am not undermining JF-17 but you guys undermining F-7 which is very unfair. I belive F-7 still the best platform of its class China ever built and were adored all over the world.

 

[MiG-21]

This is.. this is incredible! Look at the wing. Look at the fuckin evolution of those wings!! That wing was there even before the west pulled the plug. Not to mention the side intakes. So JF-17 is indeed a Super J-7. Proprietary Trade secret Indeed!!! Thank you Grumman! Major Saheb is right.

If you post this in any neutral forum, anyone with 2 brain cells will have to accept your argument that JF-17 is a heavily modified F-7. Major Bhai, you've won.

After the west pulled out, there were a few modifications afterwards ofcourse, but there is no denying who is it's grandfather.

The chinese have known to heavily modify the plans of their planes. F-6 and A-5 fantan are their first examples. They slapped another engine into an f-7 and called it an F-8. Even now in the JF-17, the central engine housing fuselage to cockpit reeks of the MiG-21.

If the chinese can manage to add 2 ENGINES!!!! to the MiG-21, who is to stop them from making a JF-17 out of a MiG-21. Compared to the insanely difficult 2 Engine architecture, JF-17 is a child's play. Not to mention China even had Grumman to help them out in the evolution.