Armenians kill five Azeri soldiers

[TurAr]

To clear that, Armenians are not Iranian.

And Azeris are Turkic, after the pages of dabtes still insisting on these retarded arguments.

After all those pages, why do you still insisting on arguing with a troll?

 

[PERSIAN GOD KING]

^^
I wish you people were "arguing" with me lol, you are simply a way for me to get a laugh.

 

[Targon]

We're arguing againts someone who has no real argument at all, as usual people with low level of intelligence starts trying to mock other side.

 

[PERSIAN GOD KING]

We're arguing againts someone who has no real argument at all, as usual people with low level of intelligence starts trying to mock other side.

LMAO, your are the one saying azeris are turks because they speak Turkish hahahahaha

 

[Targon]

I feel like I'm to puke when I see those sh.tty arguments.

I think this can I help you to improve your intelligence a bit, come back later.

 

[Ottoman-Turk]

CIRPINIRDI KARADENIZ , ELCI BEY ALLAH RAHMET EYLESIN

 

[Kajutyun]

Hey everyone, I'm new to the forum.

Seeing as mostly Turks are on this thread, I'm expecting to encounter some flame wars. I don't intend to piss anyone off on purpose, but there are numerous misconceptions about Armenia and Azerbaijan that need to be corrected.

First, Armenians are not Iranian people. Both Armenians and Iranians are Indo-Aryan, and from there they have split into two different ethnicity. Armenian is not an Iranic language and they are not similar (I speak both). Azerbaijani people contain synchretic elements of Persial culture, but they are Turkic people as far as I am aware.

Iranian-Azerbaijani relations are a lot more complicated than they are being portrayed in this thread. I don't know how many of you have been to Iran, but you need to understand that the fact that both people are Shia is of little significance. If anything, this fact combined with Aliyev secularism only aggravates relations. The bigger picture that most are dissmissing is that Aliyev and the Milli Majilis of Azerbaijan have laid claims to Iran. First, Aliyev has claimed in a televised event that he is president of all ethnic Azeris worldwide, which is ridiculous. Second, there was a discussion in azeri Parliament on whether to rename the country "Northern Azerbaijan", implying the existence of South in Iran. This has sowed deep distrust in Iranian regime. Not to mention the fact that, among the Azeri $1.6 purchase of Israeli weapons, Azerbaijan also bought anti missiles (which could only be directed against Iran).

Iranian Armenian relations are eternal. Iran tacitly supports Armenian control of Nagarno Karabakh, and openly trades with its population. There have been rumors of military aid (although I will address this later). Besides, Persians love Armenians, and vice versa. I have an ethnic Armenian friend who joined Iranian Army, and was promoted immediately just because. I have no doubts about the relationship between these two countries.

The military balance between the two countries is not equal, but Armenia is not far behind. Unlike Azerbaijan, Armenian Defence ministry is very secretive about its ordnance. For example, Hayastan acquired S300s from Russia in 2005, thought he public only found out in 2010 during a parade. I would not be surprised if Armenian arsenal already has Iskander-M missiles and upgraded S-300s. Also, the possibility of Iranian Shahab missiles being transferred to Armenia should not be ruled out.

None of that matters though. Any war will result from Russia's wishes, and it will turn out according to its wishes as well. If Russia deems that it is time to take out Azeri pipelines, it will give Armenia more than enough support to do so. Turkiye will not intervene for two reasons. 1. It does not want to risk defeat to Russia military, which is (arguably) superior and has nuclear weapons. 2. NATO charter does not allow members to enter bilateral military agreements with other nations. In other words, recent turk-Azeri military pact is null and void.

Again, I mean no disrespect. I'd be happy to discuss anything related to these issues.

 

[Axa-]

CIRPINIRDI KARADENIZ , ELCI BEY ALLAH RAHMET EYLESIN

Azerbaijan Turktur, Turk kalacak.

 

[Ottoman-Turk]

Well then russia will be against , Turkiye , Georgia , Azerbiajan as georgia will want to get its land back and has very good relations with Turkiye , plus Nato will intervene depending on the situation

Hey everyone, I'm new to the forum.

Seeing as mostly Turks are on this thread, I'm expecting to encounter some flame wars. I don't intend to piss anyone off on purpose, but there are numerous misconceptions about Armenia and Azerbaijan that need to be corrected.

First, Armenians are not Iranian people. Both Armenians and Iranians are Indo-Aryan, and from there they have split into two different ethnicity. Armenian is not an Iranic language and they are not similar (I speak both). Azerbaijani people contain synchretic elements of Persial culture, but they are Turkic people as far as I am aware.

Iranian-Azerbaijani relations are a lot more complicated than they are being portrayed in this thread. I don't know how many of you have been to Iran, but you need to understand that the fact that both people are Shia is of little significance. If anything, this fact combined with Aliyev secularism only aggravates relations. The bigger picture that most are dissmissing is that Aliyev and the Milli Majilis of Azerbaijan have laid claims to Iran. First, Aliyev has claimed in a televised event that he is president of all ethnic Azeris worldwide, which is ridiculous. Second, there was a discussion in azeri Parliament on whether to rename the country "Northern Azerbaijan", implying the existence of South in Iran. This has sowed deep distrust in Iranian regime. Not to mention the fact that, among the Azeri $1.6 purchase of Israeli weapons, Azerbaijan also bought anti missiles (which could only be directed against Iran).

Iranian Armenian relations are eternal. Iran tacitly supports Armenian control of Nagarno Karabakh, and openly trades with its population. There have been rumors of military aid (although I will address this later). Besides, Persians love Armenians, and vice versa. I have an ethnic Armenian friend who joined Iranian Army, and was promoted immediately just because. I have no doubts about the relationship between these two countries.

The military balance between the two countries is not equal, but Armenia is not far behind. Unlike Azerbaijan, Armenian Defence ministry is very secretive about its ordnance. For example, Hayastan acquired S300s from Russia in 2005, thought he public only found out in 2010 during a parade. I would not be surprised if Armenian arsenal already has Iskander-M missiles and upgraded S-300s. Also, the possibility of Iranian Shahab missiles being transferred to Armenia should not be ruled out.

None of that matters though. Any war will result from Russia's wishes, and it will turn out according to its wishes as well. If Russia deems that it is time to take out Azeri pipelines, it will give Armenia more than enough support to do so. Turkiye will not intervene for two reasons. 1. It does not want to risk defeat to Russia military, which is (arguably) superior and has nuclear weapons. 2. NATO charter does not allow members to enter bilateral military agreements with other nations. In other words, recent turk-Azeri military pact is null and void.

Again, I mean no disrespect. I'd be happy to discuss anything related to these issues.

 

[Shahin Vatani]

Well done Armenia, very good news. Don't take any bullying from these Aliyevbaijanis. Wish you all the best in reclaiming Nagarno Gharabagh.

 

[Kajutyun]

Well then russia will be against , Turkiye , Georgia , Azerbiajan as georgia will want to get its land back and has very good relations with Turkiye , plus Nato will intervene depending on the situation

You are correct on all but one count. Russia will in fact be against Georgia (because it may need to create a supply line to its base in Armenia if Georgia becomes subversive) and Azerbaijan (because Russia secretly hates them for BTC pipeline, Southern Caucasus pipeline, increasing rent on Gabala radar station, etc.)

NATO will not get involved. I already explained why in my post. Turkiye did not get NATO's consent to sign military pact with Azerbaijan. Russia is NATOs biggest fear, and they will jump on every excuse they can get not to engage them.

Besides, NATO charter says that NATO states must intervene on Turkiye's behalf if Turkiye is attacked. If it is the aggressor (which in this situation it would be), than they will receive no support.

ShahinVatani: and we wish you luck with liberating Lankaran!

 

[TurAr]

You are correct on all but one count. Russia will in fact be against Georgia (because it may need to create a supply line to its base in Armenia if Georgia becomes subversive) and Azerbaijan (because Russia secretly hates them for BTC pipeline, Southern Caucasus pipeline, increasing rent on Gabala radar station, etc.)

NATO will not get involved. I already explained why in my post. Turkiye did not get NATO's consent to sign military pact with Azerbaijan. Russia is NATOs biggest fear, and they will jump on every excuse they can get not to engage them.

Besides, NATO charter says that NATO states must intervene on Turkiye's behalf if Turkiye is attacked. If it is the aggressor (which in this situation it would be), than they will receive no support.

ShahinVatani: and we wish you luck with liberating Lankaran!

Welcome to PDF.

About Russian presence in Armenia...
I do not think that it is someting more than just a warning to Turkey. No offense but in fact, Azerbaijan do not need Turkey to handle Armenia by itself.

 

[Ottoman-Turk]

True , armenia is isolated to the world anyway , they are very poor aswell while azerbaijan is prospering , without Russia , Armenia will be easily handled. Also Russia is way behind their 50+ Year soviet strength , their economy is only 2+ trillion for such a big country and they cant think about militarizing so much with that economy

Welcome to PDF.

About Russian presence in Armenia...
I do not think that it is someting more than just a warning to Turkey. No offense but in fact, Azerbaijan do not need Turkey to handle Armenia by itself.

The only major strength left or Russia today is large nucleur stockpile which can be used as a political tool , otherwise when you take that out they are not in top 3 global players , as they are only left with energy threat after that which can be redeemed by other countries

 

[RazPaK]

Welcome to PDF.

About Russian presence in Armenia...
I do not think that it is someting more than just a warning to Turkey. No offense but in fact, Azerbaijan do not need Turkey to handle Armenia by itself.

 

[Kajutyun]

Thank you for the welcomes.

Russian presence absolutely is more than just a warning. 102nd Russian military base is in Gyumri, and Russia and Armenia have signed a defense pact (stipulating that if territory of Armenia proper is violated Russia will intervene). As a matter of fact, last year Russia has ammassed thousands of troops and tanks on the border with Azerbaijan. The official reason is to fight the Islamists, but everyone knows that this is not true (you don't fight guerrillas with tanks and heavy weaponry). Of course, this does not assure Russian invasion, but it does confirm that Russia has Armenia's back. You and I have no basis for assuming that this is just a bluff.

Turkiye, unlike Russia, is part of an international organization (NATO) and cannot do whatever it wants. I have explained why in previous posts.

Now, I mentioned that Russian-Armenian pact applies only to internationally recognized Armenian land, meaning NK is not covered. That being said, I don't think anyone doubts that Russia will give Armenia some kind of support in the case of Azeri NK invasion.
Lastly, your assumption that Azerbaijan is all powerful is incorrect. Azeri Caspian oil will run out in 10 years, and the country will be left to the mercy of its immediate neighbors. Aliyev, of course, knows this and is thinking of exit plans for himself (hence the many properties he owns in Dubai). Also, like I said, Armenia does not talk about its military potential unlike Azerbaijan. We have no idea what Armenian army is capable of.

Possibilty of Iranian support to Armenia also should not be ignored in case of Azeri invasion of NK.