Analysis: Will India’s S-400 missiles checkmate Pakistan?

[500]

People tend to think that S-400 creates some interpenetrate shield with 400 km radius.But they forget that earth is round and S-400 cant fire beyond the horizon (for low flying target thats about 25 km). Plus there are mountains which are shadowing large zones.

Also ammo of S-400 is limited and super expensive it can be suffocated with cheap false targets.

It needs constantly relocate itself otherwise it will be destroyed by standoff missiles. Since S-400 is huge and on wheels, it cant move offroad and through narrow roads. So places where it can stand can be calculated and attacked in advance.

Definitely its a problem but surely not any checkmate.

2. yes, it is true. turkish F-16 was trying to shoot Israeli F-16 but it was unable to fire on it..

Nonsense.

 

[jammersat]

that's why russian military also has other surface to air measures like the tor and pantsyr and also the BUK which they place on top of the mountains ..

they also have enough to deal with decoys , it's the russian military afterall ..

 

[OrionHunter]

India pretty much dominated the air space during the Kargil War and this was before getting hundreds of Su-30MKI Air-Superiority fighters and now t the S-400

there is pretty much nothing Pakistan can do to beat this conventionally.

This is the precise reason why you have opted for nuclear deterrence as Pakistan can never match India conventionally. But the only drawback would be when fighting conventional LICO (Low Intensity Conflict Ops) like in Kargil.

According to reliable reports, Musharraf did order the arming of nukes when he was facing huge setbacks in Kargil as his ops were not going according to plan. But then due to American pressure he ordered a stand-down. Thus, localized skirmishes are going to be the norm where nukes would never be used. An all-out nuclear war will never take place considering the world's present geopolitical environment. No one is going to allow the nuclear threshold to be crossed.

So it finally boils down to the ability to apply one's conventional combat strength in a particular theater of ops. And by that I mean quantitatively as well as qualitatively. In this scenario, India undoubtedly will always have the edge.

 

[jammersat]

pakistani - indian nuclear standoff reminds me of the american - chinese nuclear dabble , the indian casualties will always be higher in a probable hypothetical thermonuclear war , and india is the one posing to be the anti-muslim and qualitative western power they are , so they will hypothetically lose the nuclear war , victoria's indian husband might die in the blast too

 

[GURU DUTT]

@OrionHunter @GURU DUTT @danger007 @Nimitam @JanjaWeed
@SarthakGanguly Hizbul Mujaheedin commander and a close aide of Burhan Wani surrendered in front of Security Agency.

Tariq Pandith seen in group pictures with Burhan Wani surrenders: Police
HM commander Burhan's close aide Tariq Pandit surrenders

Open a thread please


http://www.kashmirmonitor.in/news-h...lose-aide-tariq-pandit-surrenders-104517.aspx

what has this news got to do with S400

 

[Windows 10]

View attachment 307397
what has this news got to do with S400

I dpnt have rights to create thread so I was looking for a thread where I can find Indians. Actually I want someone to create a thread. I will delete my first post on this thread.

 

[GURU DUTT]

I dpnt have rights to create thread so I was looking for a thread where I can find Indians. Actually I want someone to create a thread. I will delete my first post on this thread.

then better post this link where there is talk about kashmir insuregency or related topics like the one where a RR constable killed 4 terrorists before dying ... cheers mate

 

[Windows 10]

then better post this link where there is talk about kashmir insuregency or related topics like the one where a RR constable killed 4 terrorists before dying ... cheers mate

please do that as MY INTERNET IS ACTING WEIRD.would appreciate, he is a big fish and very close aide of Burhan Wani.

 

[Basel]

I m missing @gambit here

 

[cerberus]

People tend to think that S-400 creates some interpenetrate shield with 400 km radius.But they forget that earth is round and S-400 cant fire beyond the horizon (for low flying target thats about 25 km). Plus there are mountains which are shadowing large zones.

Also ammo of S-400 is limited and super expensive it can be suffocated with cheap false targets.

Since the earth is round, flying "under" the radar is flying beneath the coverage area that the radar can "see" directly from where it is, and the height of radar coverage depends on the distance from the site as well as the terrain.

You Know this Technique is Effective Since WW2 times That being said, there are other types of radar and other ways of utilizing radar that minimize this problem and make it nearly impossible to fly under it.

Tethered Aerostat Radar System (TARS)

This is downward looking radar attached to a 25,000 ft. tether. From 15,000 ft. it can detect aircraft and even vessels all of the way down to the surface of the ocean out to 200 miles.Well India Is Lucky in this Regard
Due to Indo-Israel or Indo-US Relation ship
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EL/M-2083

India has at present the Israeli made EL/M-2083 aerostat radars. It was first inducted six years ago and 11 more are in the process of acquisition.Mostly Inducted By IAF as of 2015

The Israeli aerostat radar that India has acquired has payloads consisting of advanced programmable radar (APR), Electronic Intelligence (ELINT), communication intelligence (COMINT) and VUHF radio telephony equipment and Identification Friend or Foe (IFF). The radar can be integrated with AWACS and ground based surveillance systems.

The DRDO Own Akasdeep Aerostat, having a detection range of 100 nautical miles and endurance of one month, carries an electro-optic and communication intelligence payloads, designed, developed and integrated by the Aerial Delivery Research and Development Establishment (ADRDE), Agra.

The Indian aerostat is equipped with a thermal camera for use at night and in low visibility conditions. The electronic intelligence payload carried a communication intelligence system for capturing and analyzing a variety of communication.


Also India is Buying 8 Additional Aerostat Radar
http://www.tribuneindia.com/news/nation/iaf-to-procure-8-aerostat-radars/191264.html


Another type is Over-The-Horizon Radar which can see further by reflecting radar off of the ionisphere like this:

Full view of the two over-the-horizon radar antennas in the Chernobyl-2 complex. The height of the larger antenna is about 150 m, the smaller one is about 90 m high.


Vladimir Putin held a meeting June 19, 2013 on implementing the 2011–2020 state arms procurement program, focusing on development of the technology base for air and space defence. Putin said "By 2015, our air and space defence troops’ arms must be no less than 50% modernised, and no less than 70% modern by 2020. These plans are being gradually implemented: the potential of the air and space defence forces has been bolstered by the brand new Voronezh-M and Voronezh-DM radar stations; the Pantsir-S anti-aircraft missile system has been adopted for use; S-400 systems are already being serially produced and delivered to troops; tests are underway on the Vityaz aerial defence anti-aircraft missile system, as well as the Konteyner and Nebo-M radar stations; the advanced S-500 system, which is capable of resolving problems even in near space, is under development."

 

[bafxet]

Oh yes S-400 is dam lethal.

We have got to find an answer to this challenge and find it soon.

Secondly, the other thing of equally importance is the anti missile defense shield.

Thirdly, we must stop mourning upon not getting F-16. Agreed that PAF is well equipped with F16's platform, but this argument becomes less meaningful when the other side is having Rafale. F-16's are good but they are not good enough.

Fourthly, we have got to enhance the capability;of Raad Cruise to supersonic in order to bring it at par with Brahamos.

Finally, no matter how low acoustic it may be no diesel power sub can compete with Nuclear powered. We have got have a nuclear submarine.

We are entering into new era, a totally different ball game. Given this scenario, in order to defend our country against an adversary who is/would soon be equipped with the most advance armaments this is what we need.

 

[Falcon26]

Oh yes S-400 is dam lethal.

We have got to find an answer to this challenge and find it soon.

Secondly, the other thing of equally importance is the anti missile defense shield.

Thirdly, we must stop mourning upon not getting F-16. Agreed that PAF is well equipped with F16's platform, but this argument becomes less meaningful when the other side is having Rafale. F-16's are good but they are not good enough.

Fourthly, we have got to enhance the capability;of Raad Cruise to supersonic in order to bring it at par with Brahamos.

Finally, no matter how low acoustic it may be no diesel power sub can compete with Nuclear powered. We have got have a nuclear submarine.

We are entering into new era, a totally different ball game. Given this scenario, in order to defend our country against an adversary who is/would soon be equipped with the most advance armaments this is what we need.

Actually Pakistan doesn't need to make the Ra'ad cruise missiles supersonic. Ground-hugging subsonic cruise missiles are a nightmare to systems like the S-400 and Co. There's a reason the US has always resisted inducting supersonic cruise missiles and instead hedges its bet on Tomahawk Cruise Missiles which are subsonic & hard to detect and target like Ra'ad & Babur cruise missiles. In some ways, these supersonic/hypersonic missiles are relics of Soviet vanity.

Pakistan must consistently improve her subsonic cruise missiles & ensure they are jam resistance and credible through collaborations with Turkey and investments in Satellite communications. It's outrageous that Pakistan has yet to field an indigenous communication satellites.

 

[PAKISTANFOREVER]

This is the precise reason why you have opted for nuclear deterrence as Pakistan can never match India conventionally. But the only drawback would be when fighting conventional LICO (Low Intensity Conflict Ops) like in Kargil.

According to reliable reports, Musharraf did order the arming of nukes when he was facing huge setbacks in Kargil as his ops were not going according to plan. But then due to American pressure he ordered a stand-down. Thus, localized skirmishes are going to be the norm where nukes would never be used. An all-out nuclear war will never take place considering the world's present geopolitical environment. No one is going to allow the nuclear threshold to be crossed.

So it finally boils down to the ability to apply one's conventional combat strength in a particular theater of ops. And by that I mean quantitatively as well as qualitatively. In this scenario, India undoubtedly will always have the edge.

So what happened to this supposed edge over Pakistan after mumbai 26/11/2008?

 

[OrionHunter]

So what happened to this supposed edge over Pakistan after mumbai 26/11/2008?

Our politicians didn't have the balls to do anything then.

 

[GURU DUTT]

So what happened to this supposed edge over Pakistan after mumbai 26/11/2008?

it was UPA and we all know why they were in power ... just like why zardari was in for power get the point ?