A political solution for Kashmir and lasting peace for India and Pakistan

[Naofumi]

..all come through a single method ?

That should be realistic, not castles in the air.

 

[jamahir]

That should be realistic, not castles in the air.

And your realistic method is... ?

 

[Cliftonite]

Jamahir bhai, ye baat mazhab ki hai. Kashmir is a Hindu-Muslim matter and religion will not go for another 60 years from the subcontinent.

Nahi meri jaan. Mazhab cannot be wiped out from our South Asian psyche. Bangladesh jesa mulk bhi waqt ke saath saath aur ziada religious hota ja raha hai.

 

[Naofumi]

And your realistic method is... ?

A joint controlled region would be my best bet.
And no one needs to be a communist to reach a solution.

Nahi meri jaan. Mazhab cannot be wiped out from our South Asian psyche. Bangladesh jesa mulk bhi waqt ke saath saath aur ziada religious hota ja raha hai.

I believe there's a threshold point, a global peak after which it will go downhill.

Otherwise, we will be wiped out by nuclear war(s).

 

[drmeson]

@drmeson your fellow brother in Iranian genetics? enjoy. cheers.

Bo gandeh hich chiz dar morede Iran Namidonan ama dobareh sohbat Mikonad

Ma nabayad be in afrad ro gosh dahim

Please understand what is Iranian genetic composition in 2020 has had liberal epochal infusions of alien blood, Arab, African, Indic, Turkic on 4 broad time period planes.

These are not the same as two genetic pulses detected on Parsis and Irani Zoroastrians.

The older one male and Cypriot, coinciding with Alexander's invasion.

And the more recent one about 44 generations old, female and Indic.

Bottomline, modern day Iranians are mongrelized Persians.

Regardless of crap coming out of your cow shit chewing mouth, It’s a genetically established fact (Peer reviewed Published) that Genetic Continuity of Persian Population of Iran is extremely high (up to 95 %). Its like amusing considering the fact that all other nations around Iran have got mongrelized due to invasions to extremes over the period of time. E.g. Turkey on average is up to 20 % Turkic and 80 % Regional (Anatolian+Iranic+Armenian+Balkan+Levant+Greco). Iraq saw massive Turkoman migration as well. Since this is a Pakistani forum, Pakistanis are like a layer after layer of West Asian Invasions on South Indians (AASI) layered by Iranian neolithic Farmers (INF) (Indus Valley was Iran Farmers + South Indians) + Iranic Aryans (Steppe + BMAC) … but Iranians esp of Persian origin are 95 % pure from Neolithic times.

Here is a PCA plot of autosomal DNA of thousands of people Iranian Persian ethnicity from Central and South Western area which is the heartland of Persian ethnic population. They are like 95 % same as they were in Iron Age times. ROFL. Look at Autosomal proximity of Iranians to their neolithic ancestors. Its amazingly close which shows that Persians of Iran received almost no genetic input from any group. Let alone outsiders like Arabs, Greeks … Persians did not even mix with their own Kurdish, Azeri, Khorosani or Caspian Iranic brothers until recent times (last 50 years). In modern times, such inter-Iranic mixings are happening in large cities like Tehran, Hamedan, Tabriz etc. Azeri-Persian-Kurdish-Caspian admixturing population is increasing in numbers in urban centers and will form the future Iranic identity.

Also, this myth of Arab invasion changed genetics of Iran is as funny is proven wrong many times by unbiased internationally published genetic studies. Arabian haplogroup is J1 which is like not even 3 % among Iranic population if Iran. This J1 is heavy in neighboring Iraq, Syria, Saudi Arabia but almost vanished in Iran which shows that there was no mixing between Arabs and Iranic in 160 years under which we lived under same administration.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iranian_peoples#Genetics

These are extensive international peer reviewed published studies on Iranic population and their haplogroups and they show like 3% at most J1 which is crazy considering that fact Iraq is just next door yet no Iranian group shows Arabian admixing.

https://doi.org/10.1159/000093774

https://doi.org/10.1371/journal.pone.0041252

Fun fact is that Saudi Arabia in return has Iranic R1 haplogroups in its coastline which makes sense as Iranic empires ruled the peninsular areas for centuries. Like I said, I like Arabs and Turks since together we form the West Asian civilization cluster. We are a cradle of civilization and I respect all of these ethnicities as well except that we have no mixing. Not in case with Iranics at-least.

Iran has a history of 10000 years in which Arab rule amounts to 160 years ROFL. Even that rule was like limited to certain parts of South Western Iran only. There has been no genetic mixing between Iranics and Arabs. It’s a genetic fact. Illiterate, cheap clowns on internet can’t change that.

I know what is going on with you being an Parsi man in an Hindu majority country. You want to see yourself as unique and some sort of a long lost Iranian among Ganges Australoid population around you which you deem as inferior since in your brachycephalic head you are some sort of a Royal Shahi Farsi Prince among Indians around you. Truth is you are not. Parsis, by MtDNA are 55 % local coastal Indic. Stop your racism against other Indians. Trolling here won’t change your reality. You are as Indian as it gets. As a matter of fact a Pakistani from western Pakistan is more Iranic than you can ever score on an autosomal testing. Read these papers on your people. 55 % on average mtDNA of Parsis are local Indic.

https://doi.org/10.1086/383236

https://doi.org/10.1186/s13059-017-1244-9

It shows up in Phenotypes as well as Iranic Phenotypes are carriers of Noble Progressive traits. Chiseled, Elongated, Dolichocephalic Skull shape with fairer skin and strong Jawline is the Iranic phenotype and its prevalent in the entire Iranic plateau stretching from Afghanistan to Eastern Turkey. Its not prevalent among Parsis since most are brachycephalic, short skulled like other Indid phenotypes.

Iranid

Indid

The two major compositions of the Iranian dna that came from outside the Iranian plateau are the Turkic and Indic genetic varients.

That’s not Inidc lol. The Indic component which few calculators show is actually Iranian neolithic farmers (IRAN_N) that went to northern part of India and formed Indus Valley civilization there IVC after mixing with Australoid Women. Because that mixing event happened in South Asia hence modern calculators call it Indic otherwise its actually not. An Average Iranian shows something like 4-5 % of this so called Indic component which in itself is actually 70 % Iranian Neolithic farmer who originated in South Western Iran. Then How it is actually Indic ? Its like saying that an average English from the British Isles is 20 % American when in reality that 20 % American itself is like 70 % British. British gave birth to Americans not the reverse pretty similar to How Iranian Farmers gave birth to Indus Valley not the reverse.

There has never been a single hint of Indian migratory event from South Asia to Iranic Plateau post Iranic identity synthesis.

Also the Turkic input is up to 20-25 % on average in Azeris. That falls down to almost none when we go further east from Hamedan. Even today the Turkic Azeris cluster closest to Iranic Kurds and no one else since both groups stem out of Medes Iranic ethnicity.

Actually their are two theories as to what he was


One is that his ancestors were Yazidi Kurds who converted to Islam.


The other is that his ancestors were an Arab tribe who moved to what is now Iranian Azerbaijan and eastern turkey and assimilated into the Kurdish population.


Regardless, he was a great man.

Not a single shred of evidence suggests that Soltan Salah al din Ayyubid was anything else other than what he actually was, an IRANIC KURD. His was a member of Revend Kurdish tribe from Hadhabani Kurdish confederation in Dvin district of Hayastan. No Arab lived there lol, never have and never will. You Pakistanis see Arabs as gods doesn’t mean you can twist history. Anything Arabian just doesn’t exist in this area.

Anti Iranian insecure internet trolls keep manufacturing these stories. Like how Kurdish Shah Ismail Saffavid became Turkic overnight. Truth is West Asia is a Iranic territory and when people say we are grabbing land there do not know that we are actually returning to what was taken from us ...

 

[GDP Adil Khan Niazi]

Most immediately I speak for a drastic reduction of Indian forces in the Kashmir valley.

What compromises do you want India to make ?

Do not make any compromises just ask the people of Jammu Kashmir to chose their future is it that difficult to do?

You've revoked the status of Jammu Kashmir just like "I'm the owner of a house and a third person who is more powerful than me is trying to either own it or sell it without bothering about my opinion."

If you want the same thing to be asked to the people and governments of AJK, We will be glad to do that in front of International media because it's their right to annex themselves with us or to live alone as an independent country.

As far as the number of Indian forces is concerned to me it feels like they're being abducted in their own land !!


Yes, I'm in favor of the kind of relations EU countries are having, People can have e-visa/on arrival visa, can move freely, can enjoy vacations, can meet people across the borders easily without even being spied. Yes, it's a difficult thing to do but one has to take steps, look at the strong bond of trust and togetherness being built by EU countries after beating each other out to deaths multiple times. All these things are allowed at the cost of "No evil eye" ... Who knows what you did to East Pakistan could be done again in terms of Balochistan or GB/AJK.

 

[Syed_45]

Your proposal involves accepting the status quo, which is essentially what India wants.

There is no compromise here on the part of India, so what incentive does Pakistan have to accept such a proposal? You need to provide more details of what either side gains. I see nothing in here for Pakistan.

And the main premise behind this proposal, of some kind of identical 'progressive political system' is a no go in Pakistan for the foreseeable future.

Pakistan is still trying to refine her parliamentary democracy. There are internal debates over provincial autonomy, shifting to a Presidential system and of course the religious right arguing for a Shariah based system. You're never going to have a consensus in Pakistan over this.

In essence, Akhand Bharat.

No.

Everything you proposed involves Pakistan conceding to India, with Indian making ZERO compromises.

I am in favor of open borders, trade, people to people contacts & an economic union down the road, but not unless the dispute of Jammu & Kashmir is resolved by letting the millions of residents vote on their destiny via Plebiscite.

A political solution for Kashmir and lasting peace for India and Pakistan
Written by: Jamahir
Category cloud: Opinion, analysis
​

India and Pakistan need to settle the long, sad but frankly immature dispute over Kashmir once and for all. Peacefully and politically. Both have similar social, economic and political problems so any nuanced and generic solution for one country can also be used by the other country. The prescribed solution by the UNO is impractical. As it involves, as far as I understand, India withdrawing military units stationed in India-administered Kashmir and then arranging for a plebiscite there while also accepting the UNO as a mediator. But the Indian Establishment believes, as also its foreign allies, that India-administered Kashmir is primarily a matter internal to India but since Pakistan cannot be wished away the matter should involve both countries settling the matter between themselves, peacefully and politically. But any such settlement should benefit both the countries immediately and in the long term.

Therefore I present one solution as below. The solution is based on Muammar Gaddafi's solution for Kashmir to which I have added some bits.

1. Both countries should adopt the same Progressive political system. Two separate, independent republics but with the same political system, much like what pre-2003 Iraq and Syria were with their same Ba'athist systems. The Progressive political system can be the Direct Democracy Socialism system that governed Libya until the 2011 war. Readers can refer to these pages to understand how this system works. This system is called the Third Universal Theory aka Jamahiriya theory. In India, a form of Direct Democracy called Swaraj is being implemented in Delhi by the ruling AAP party and is also being forwarded by the Swaraj Abhiyan movement and there is no reason why it cannot be extended to Pakistan as well.

2. Let Indian-administered Kashmir and Pakistani-administered Kashmir remain with their respective countries.

3. Convert the LoC into an International Border that is accessible for trade, tourism and family visits.

All this will make the separatists in India-administered Kashmir to understand that their desire to join Pakistan-administered Kashmir is unnecessary because both countries will have become the same, politically.

Furthermore, with separatist militancy reduced in Indian-administered Kashmir, what will remain is regressive religious militancy or activism which can be controlled and removed with social support by progressives among the local population. The side effect will also be a drastic removal of the current military force which will lead to more goodwill for the peace project.

I speak of the troubles and concerns of Muslims in Indian Kashmir and I will also speak of the troubles and concerns of the Kashmiri Pundit refugees. There must be something like Nelson Mandela's Truth and Reconciliation Commission. I would like the refugee Kashmiri Pandits to be allowed to return back to the Valley.

The next step would be resumption of the Aman Ki Asha peace mission as well as resumption of food and clothing festivals to be organized in both countries.

If not for such a solution, how long would the Establishments of India and Pakistan keep up with this cross-border hate? For another 50 years? 100? Until a reformed UNO decides to send in a military arbitrator force? And would the people of both countries not like the money and other resources spent by their respective militaries in positioning against each other to be spent on making each others countries a welfare state where there are things like high quality free medical system like in Cuba?

An important point is that the given solution will not only benefit the Kashmiri's but also will bring progress to India and Pakistan - socially, economically and politically.

Lastly, to extend a point about direct democracy socialism, It worked in Libya and it is being implemented in Venezuela ( the consejos comunales - communal councils ). Two different kinds of countries, ethnically and geographically. No reason why India and Pakistan cannot adopt the system given the fact that both countries have so much in common. And just Direct Democracy without the socialism part has been the system in Switzerland for long.

_______________________________________________________________________
Disclaimer: The post only represents writer's own point of views. The post do not represent point of views of Pakistan Defence management. Pakistan Defence Team will not be responsible for disagreements.
_______________________________________________________________________
Credits: The post is written by Jamahir, India. The proof reading and some other editing has been done by Think Tank Analyst, Forcetrip. The final formatting, editing and picture uploading is done by Slav Defence., Think Tank Vice Chairman.

Only plausible solution to kashmir issue is to respect the will of people. Let the kashmiri people decide what they want. Any forced solution will only strengthen prevailing Modi-butcher's illegal occupation. Plebiscite is the legitimate option. One can truly find the difference what is happening in Azad jammu and kashmir and Indian occupied Kashmir
https://www.ohchr.org/Documents/Countries/IN/KashmirUpdateReport_8July2019.pdf

 

[GHALIB]

A political solution for Kashmir and lasting peace for India and Pakistan
Written by: Jamahir
Category cloud: Opinion, analysis
​

India and Pakistan need to settle the long, sad but frankly immature dispute over Kashmir once and for all. Peacefully and politically. Both have similar social, economic and political problems so any nuanced and generic solution for one country can also be used by the other country. The prescribed solution by the UNO is impractical. As it involves, as far as I understand, India withdrawing military units stationed in India-administered Kashmir and then arranging for a plebiscite there while also accepting the UNO as a mediator. But the Indian Establishment believes, as also its foreign allies, that India-administered Kashmir is primarily a matter internal to India but since Pakistan cannot be wished away the matter should involve both countries settling the matter between themselves, peacefully and politically. But any such settlement should benefit both the countries immediately and in the long term.

Therefore I present one solution as below. The solution is based on Muammar Gaddafi's solution for Kashmir to which I have added some bits.

1. Both countries should adopt the same Progressive political system. Two separate, independent republics but with the same political system, much like what pre-2003 Iraq and Syria were with their same Ba'athist systems. The Progressive political system can be the Direct Democracy Socialism system that governed Libya until the 2011 war. Readers can refer to these pages to understand how this system works. This system is called the Third Universal Theory aka Jamahiriya theory. In India, a form of Direct Democracy called Swaraj is being implemented in Delhi by the ruling AAP party and is also being forwarded by the Swaraj Abhiyan movement and there is no reason why it cannot be extended to Pakistan as well.

2. Let Indian-administered Kashmir and Pakistani-administered Kashmir remain with their respective countries.

3. Convert the LoC into an International Border that is accessible for trade, tourism and family visits.

All this will make the separatists in India-administered Kashmir to understand that their desire to join Pakistan-administered Kashmir is unnecessary because both countries will have become the same, politically.

Furthermore, with separatist militancy reduced in Indian-administered Kashmir, what will remain is regressive religious militancy or activism which can be controlled and removed with social support by progressives among the local population. The side effect will also be a drastic removal of the current military force which will lead to more goodwill for the peace project.

I speak of the troubles and concerns of Muslims in Indian Kashmir and I will also speak of the troubles and concerns of the Kashmiri Pundit refugees. There must be something like Nelson Mandela's Truth and Reconciliation Commission. I would like the refugee Kashmiri Pandits to be allowed to return back to the Valley.

The next step would be resumption of the Aman Ki Asha peace mission as well as resumption of food and clothing festivals to be organized in both countries.

If not for such a solution, how long would the Establishments of India and Pakistan keep up with this cross-border hate? For another 50 years? 100? Until a reformed UNO decides to send in a military arbitrator force? And would the people of both countries not like the money and other resources spent by their respective militaries in positioning against each other to be spent on making each others countries a welfare state where there are things like high quality free medical system like in Cuba?

An important point is that the given solution will not only benefit the Kashmiri's but also will bring progress to India and Pakistan - socially, economically and politically.

Lastly, to extend a point about direct democracy socialism, It worked in Libya and it is being implemented in Venezuela ( the consejos comunales - communal councils ). Two different kinds of countries, ethnically and geographically. No reason why India and Pakistan cannot adopt the system given the fact that both countries have so much in common. And just Direct Democracy without the socialism part has been the system in Switzerland for long.

_______________________________________________________________________
Disclaimer: The post only represents writer's own point of views. The post do not represent point of views of Pakistan Defence management. Pakistan Defence Team will not be responsible for disagreements.
_______________________________________________________________________
Credits: The post is written by Jamahir, India. The proof reading and some other editing has been done by Think Tank Analyst, Forcetrip. The final formatting, editing and picture uploading is done by Slav Defence., Think Tank Vice Chairman.

very good proposal , but it is viable only if pak army is ready to solve issue in this manner . after kashmir problem is solved pak army will permanently lose control over govt .

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Nahi meri jaan. Mazhab cannot be wiped out from our South Asian psyche. Bangladesh jesa mulk bhi waqt ke saath saath aur ziada religious hota ja raha hai.

Even the US can't even wipe out the influence of religion in domestic politics, and the US has been working on it a lot longer, without the territorial disputes and communal tensions of South Asia.

In Pakistan especially, religion is not going to be pulled out of politics within our or the next few generations. The continuing dispute & tensions with India (and the communal tensions within India) only solidify Pakistan's religious identity. The distinction between Pakistani being a 'homeland for Muslims' vs a theocratic State is increasingly blurred and hard to make. IK has in fact taken an approach that I (despite being agnostic and in favor of a theoretically secular State) have advocated for years - use Islam to push through progressive reforms. Use Islamic principles of ensuring equality and justice for all as the basis for reform, tolerance and respect for everyone in society.

In essence, Imran Khan's vision of 'Riyasat-e-Madina' is Pakistan's only feasible option for progressive reform, whilst still retaining Pakistan's identity as an 'Islamic Republic'. In my view this is one of the reasons why he's opposed by the religious right in Pakistan, and also by the left, who detest the use of religion, even if for progressive purposes.

Asking Pakistan to accept and implement a 'secular' constitution and political system is just asking for conflict and chaos in Pakistan - it's not going to happen, especially not before the J&K dispute with Kashmir is resolved and the two countries start engaging more.

 

[Saahir Malik]

A political solution for Kashmir and lasting peace for India and Pakistan
Written by: Jamahir
Category cloud: Opinion, analysis
​

India and Pakistan need to settle the long, sad but frankly immature dispute over Kashmir once and for all. Peacefully and politically. Both have similar social, economic and political problems so any nuanced and generic solution for one country can also be used by the other country. The prescribed solution by the UNO is impractical. As it involves, as far as I understand, India withdrawing military units stationed in India-administered Kashmir and then arranging for a plebiscite there while also accepting the UNO as a mediator. But the Indian Establishment believes, as also its foreign allies, that India-administered Kashmir is primarily a matter internal to India but since Pakistan cannot be wished away the matter should involve both countries settling the matter between themselves, peacefully and politically. But any such settlement should benefit both the countries immediately and in the long term.

Therefore I present one solution as below. The solution is based on Muammar Gaddafi's solution for Kashmir to which I have added some bits.

1. Both countries should adopt the same Progressive political system. Two separate, independent republics but with the same political system, much like what pre-2003 Iraq and Syria were with their same Ba'athist systems. The Progressive political system can be the Direct Democracy Socialism system that governed Libya until the 2011 war. Readers can refer to these pages to understand how this system works. This system is called the Third Universal Theory aka Jamahiriya theory. In India, a form of Direct Democracy called Swaraj is being implemented in Delhi by the ruling AAP party and is also being forwarded by the Swaraj Abhiyan movement and there is no reason why it cannot be extended to Pakistan as well.

2. Let Indian-administered Kashmir and Pakistani-administered Kashmir remain with their respective countries.

3. Convert the LoC into an International Border that is accessible for trade, tourism and family visits.

All this will make the separatists in India-administered Kashmir to understand that their desire to join Pakistan-administered Kashmir is unnecessary because both countries will have become the same, politically.

Furthermore, with separatist militancy reduced in Indian-administered Kashmir, what will remain is regressive religious militancy or activism which can be controlled and removed with social support by progressives among the local population. The side effect will also be a drastic removal of the current military force which will lead to more goodwill for the peace project.

I speak of the troubles and concerns of Muslims in Indian Kashmir and I will also speak of the troubles and concerns of the Kashmiri Pundit refugees. There must be something like Nelson Mandela's Truth and Reconciliation Commission. I would like the refugee Kashmiri Pandits to be allowed to return back to the Valley.

The next step would be resumption of the Aman Ki Asha peace mission as well as resumption of food and clothing festivals to be organized in both countries.

If not for such a solution, how long would the Establishments of India and Pakistan keep up with this cross-border hate? For another 50 years? 100? Until a reformed UNO decides to send in a military arbitrator force? And would the people of both countries not like the money and other resources spent by their respective militaries in positioning against each other to be spent on making each others countries a welfare state where there are things like high quality free medical system like in Cuba?

An important point is that the given solution will not only benefit the Kashmiri's but also will bring progress to India and Pakistan - socially, economically and politically.

Lastly, to extend a point about direct democracy socialism, It worked in Libya and it is being implemented in Venezuela ( the consejos comunales - communal councils ). Two different kinds of countries, ethnically and geographically. No reason why India and Pakistan cannot adopt the system given the fact that both countries have so much in common. And just Direct Democracy without the socialism part has been the system in Switzerland for long.

_______________________________________________________________________
Disclaimer: The post only represents writer's own point of views. The post do not represent point of views of Pakistan Defence management. Pakistan Defence Team will not be responsible for disagreements.
_______________________________________________________________________
Credits: The post is written by Jamahir, India. The proof reading and some other editing has been done by Think Tank Analyst, Forcetrip. The final formatting, editing and picture uploading is done by Slav Defence., Think Tank Vice Chairman.

DR bro,it seems to be same what mr parvez Musharraf & mr vajpayee tried in 2003 by Agra summit,it didn't work then neither it is going to work now or in future.Try to understand basic thing.why kashmiris mainly muslims hate India why Kashmiri mainly Hindu pandit or dogra hate Pakistan...just answer me that....here lies the solution...be practical...no fairytales....you can think ethical too but in positive manner...plz answer me what makes Kashmiri muslims to hate India &a what makes Kashmiri pandits to hate Pakistan...what is it & why is it ?????????????!?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????

 

[jamahir]

DR bro,it seems to be same what mr parvez Musharraf & mr vajpayee tried in 2003 by Agra summit,it didn't work then neither it is going to work now or in future.

I don't know much about this. By whom was it not accepted ? The Kashmiri people in India ? If so why ?

Try to understand basic thing.why kashmiris mainly muslims hate India

If it is about the occupation force ( Indian armed forces ) then in the OP I have mentioned how to minimize them.

If it is something else please mention.

why Kashmiri mainly Hindu pandit or dogra hate Pakistan...

Why ?

just answer me that....here lies the solution...be practical...no fairytales....you can think ethical too but in positive manner...plz answer me what makes Kashmiri muslims to hate India &a what makes Kashmiri pandits to hate Pakistan...what is it & why is it

In a company I worked in some years ago one of my colleagues was a young man whose father was Kashmiri Muslim and mother was Filipino. This colleague had no special hate for India. His family ran a handicrafts shop in which his cousins from Kashmir worked. As far as I could tell they too didn't harbor any special hate for India.

And in my city there are a few Kashmiri handicrafts / clothing shops. And every year a Kashmiri clothing seller visits my house to try to sell us his wares. They too are Muslim.

I am saying this because things can work out. Take South Africa for example. The Apartheid system was opposed by the Colored people politically and militantly until a combination of international pressure and internal dynamics led to the White government to yield governance to Mandela. So there are other places in the world where conflict has occurred similar to that in Kashmir.

What you can do is take impartial solutions like mine and make them get international publicity.

 

[Saahir Malik]

I don't know much about this. By whom was it not accepted ? The Kashmiri people in India ? If so why ?



If it is about the occupation force ( Indian armed forces ) then in the OP I have mentioned how to minimize them.

If it is something else please mention.



Why ?



In a company I worked in some years ago one of my colleagues was a young man whose father was Kashmiri Muslim and mother was Filipino. This colleague had no special hate for India. His family ran a handicrafts shop in which his cousins from Kashmir worked. As far as I could tell they too didn't harbor any special hate for India.

And in my city there are a few Kashmiri handicrafts / clothing shops. And every year a Kashmiri clothing seller visits my house to try to sell us his wares. They too are Muslim.

I am saying this because things can work out. Take South Africa for example. The Apartheid system was opposed by the Colored people politically and militantly until a combination of international pressure and internal dynamics led to the White government to yield governance to Mandela. So there are other places in the world where conflict has occurred similar to that in Kashmir.

What you can do is take impartial solutions like mine and make them get international publicity.

Well bro I agree with you there are some Kashmiri businessmen doing business mainly Kashmiri handicrafts in different parts of world also in different parts of india,they might be having a positive views about india but at the same time you can't expect anyone to say against your motherland before you,it is obvious no one wants to create any unnecessary trouble,Now coming to mr Mandela you cannot produce such personalities in decades,it comes once in a century,I also agree lack of leadership quality is an issue in Kashmir but it is all around world these days.
Let's come to the main point which you want to hear & interested in.Please listen carefully & don't make any remarks in haste,what I'm going to tell you maybe you won't agree or you don't wanna believe it or hear it or accept it whatever your knowledge or opinion is it may contradict with it,but please make sure you as a good human being are going to RESPECT it,as it is not only my view or opinion or so called solution it is FULL FLEDGED RESEARCH,A COMPAIGN DONE FROM DOOR TO DOOR,Now please hear it calmly.....
KASHMIRI MUSLIM HATE INDIA BECAUSE THEY ARE HINDU,NOW DONT TELL ME INDIA HAS SECOND MOST POPULATION OF MUSLIMS IN THE WORLD,A COMMON KASHMIRI DONT SEE IT LIKE THAT,NOW YOU WILL THINK OF KASHMIRYAT THING WELL THAT LOOKS GOOD ONLY IN BOOKS BOLLYWOOD MOVIES FAIRYTALES NOTHING LIKE THAT ON GROUND.FOR KASHMIRI INDIA WORD ITSELF MEANS HATE.IT IS GROWN HERE SOMETHING YOU FIND IN THE AIR OF KASHMIR,IT IS A PRACTICAL THING YOU WILL HEAR EVER FROM A KASHMIRII MUSLIM BUT IT IS UNIVERSAL TRUTH,NOTHING CAN CHANGE IT,IT IS SORT OF PALESTINE ISRAELI THING OF DIFFERENT LEVEL & DIFFERENT MAGNITUDE.
NOW COMING TO KASHMIRI PANDITS &DOGRAS IT IS VICE VERSA,THEY HATE PAKISTAN BACAUSE THEY ARE MUSLIMS,I CAN ADD THOUSANDS OF EXAMPLES TO PROVE IT...NOW LETS COME TO THE ONLY SOLUTION.
INDEPENDENT KASHMIR IS A MYTH IT IS NEVER GONNA HAPPEN...
DIVIDE JAMMU & KASHMIR ON ETHICAL BASIS,SIMPLY A MUSLIM DOMINATED AREAS SHOULD HELD PAKISTAN & HINDU DOMINATED SHOULD HELD INDIA.
MIGRATION SHOULD BE ALLOWED SAME WAY WHEN BRITISH PARTIONED INDIA & PAKISTAN.BUT WITH A TIGHT GRIP SO NO ETHICAL VOILANCE CAN BE CREATED,SAME WAY WEST GERMANY AND EAST GERMANY WAS CREATED AFTER WORLD WAR TWO,THEN ONLY KASHMIR INDIA & PAKISTAN WILL LIVE IN PEACE,ALL THREE WILL DEVELOP,BUT HAVING SAID THAT IT IS A VERY VERY DIFFICULT TASK,THERE ARE SOME ELEMENTS WITHIN THE THREE NATIONS WHO WILL NEVER ALLOW TO HAPPEN IT EVEN THOUGH THEY KNOW BY ALL MEANS THIS IS THE RIGHT SOLUTION OR MIGHT BE A ONLY SOLUTION TO THIS COMPLEX ISSUE....

 

[jamahir]

Well bro I agree with you there are some Kashmiri businessmen doing business mainly Kashmiri handicrafts in different parts of world also in different parts of india,they might be having a positive views about india but at the same time you can't expect anyone to say against your motherland before you,it is obvious no one wants to create any unnecessary trouble,Now coming to mr Mandela you cannot produce such personalities in decades,it comes once in a century,I also agree lack of leadership quality is an issue in Kashmir but it is all around world these days.
Let's come to the main point which you want to hear & interested in.Please listen carefully & don't make any remarks in haste,what I'm going to tell you maybe you won't agree or you don't wanna believe it or hear it or accept it whatever your knowledge or opinion is it may contradict with it,but please make sure you as a good human being are going to RESPECT it,as it is not only my view or opinion or so called solution it is FULL FLEDGED RESEARCH,A COMPAIGN DONE FROM DOOR TO DOOR,Now please hear it calmly.....
KASHMIRI MUSLIM HATE INDIA BECAUSE THEY ARE HINDU,NOW DONT TELL ME INDIA HAS SECOND MOST POPULATION OF MUSLIMS IN THE WORLD,A COMMON KASHMIRI DONT SEE IT LIKE THAT,NOW YOU WILL THINK OF KASHMIRYAT THING WELL THAT LOOKS GOOD ONLY IN BOOKS BOLLYWOOD MOVIES FAIRYTALES NOTHING LIKE THAT ON GROUND.FOR KASHMIRI INDIA WORD ITSELF MEANS HATE.IT IS GROWN HERE SOMETHING YOU FIND IN THE AIR OF KASHMIR,IT IS A PRACTICAL THING YOU WILL HEAR EVER FROM A KASHMIRII MUSLIM BUT IT IS UNIVERSAL TRUTH,NOTHING CAN CHANGE IT,IT IS SORT OF PALESTINE ISRAELI THING OF DIFFERENT LEVEL & DIFFERENT MAGNITUDE.
NOW COMING TO KASHMIRI PANDITS &DOGRAS IT IS VICE VERSA,THEY HATE PAKISTAN BACAUSE THEY ARE MUSLIMS,I CAN ADD THOUSANDS OF EXAMPLES TO PROVE IT...NOW LETS COME TO THE ONLY SOLUTION.
INDEPENDENT KASHMIR IS A MYTH IT IS NEVER GONNA HAPPEN...
DIVIDE JAMMU & KASHMIR ON ETHICAL BASIS,SIMPLY A MUSLIM DOMINATED AREAS SHOULD HELD PAKISTAN & HINDU DOMINATED SHOULD HELD INDIA.
MIGRATION SHOULD BE ALLOWED SAME WAY WHEN BRITISH PARTIONED INDIA & PAKISTAN.BUT WITH A TIGHT GRIP SO NO ETHICAL VOILANCE CAN BE CREATED,SAME WAY WEST GERMANY AND EAST GERMANY WAS CREATED AFTER WORLD WAR TWO,THEN ONLY KASHMIR INDIA & PAKISTAN WILL LIVE IN PEACE,ALL THREE WILL DEVELOP,BUT HAVING SAID THAT IT IS A VERY VERY DIFFICULT TASK,THERE ARE SOME ELEMENTS WITHIN THE THREE NATIONS WHO WILL NEVER ALLOW TO HAPPEN IT EVEN THOUGH THEY KNOW BY ALL MEANS THIS IS THE RIGHT SOLUTION OR MIGHT BE A ONLY SOLUTION TO THIS COMPLEX ISSUE....

Hello bhai, I read with relief your idea about any ethnic-based migration should be carried out without violence. And I see that the whole issue is an emotional issue for you. It will be that given the three decades of turmoil and injustices.

I myself am a Muslim living in the Deccan region and see with concern what is going on in the rest of India.

I want to ask your opinion about young Kashmiri leaders, especially two, Shah Faesal and Shehla Rashid, who to me have been the voices of Kashmir to the outside world.

 

[Saahir Malik]

Hello bhai, I read with relief your idea about any ethnic-based migration should be carried out without violence. And I see that the whole issue is an emotional issue for you. It will be that given the three decades of turmoil and injustices.

I myself am a Muslim living in the Deccan region and see with concern what is going on in the rest of India.

I want to ask your opinion about young Kashmiri leaders, especially two, Shah Faesal and Shehla Rashid, who to me have been the voices of Kashmir to the outside world.
[/QUOTE
Dr bro,INDIA & PAISTAN GOING TO SOLVE IT.KASHMIRIS ARE NOT QUALIFIED ENOUGH IN THEIR CHARACTERS TO BE PART OF IT.I DONT WANT TO MAKE INDIVIDUAL COMMENTS ABOUT ANY SO CALLED LEADERS.HONESTLY SPEAKING IM NOT PRO PAK OR PRO IND OR AGAINST INDIA OR AGAINST PAKISTAN,EVEN I DIDNT REPLIED YOU AS A PRO KASHMIRI.I JUST SAID WHAT IS GROUND REALITY.

 

[Saahir Malik]

Mere BayI,YOU ARE VERY INONCENT FARE & HONEST,YOU REMIND ME OF MYSELF ONCE I USE TOBE...
KASHMIR HAS BEEN POLITICAL LABORATORY OF INDIAN RAW,PMO,PAKISTAN ISI PAK ARMY EVEN THERE ARE SOME WESTERN POWERS ALSO WHO EXPERIMENTED THEIR POLITICAL IDEAS POLICIES ON KASHMIR
PLZ DONT BE PART OF IT,DONT EVEN SUPPRT IT ,,,IT IS NOT WORTH IT,,,HOPE YOU UNDERSTAND WHAT IM TALKING ABOUT....