A Muslim majority Indus Valley Civilization?

[jbond197]

Why you speaking Urdu then, which is a language from UP?

They should stop eating Lucknai food and Hyderabadi Biryanis as well..

 

[Rusty]

Exactly!

And IVC was Indian phenomena after draught in Indus river Indians went to the banks of Ganges. (Vedic period). Use google and do some research.

Right but on what basis do you claim this?
They didn't speak the same langue, and they didn't have the same religion.

The rest of Bharat only started to share ideals after the Aryans invaded and gave you Sanskrit and the Vedas.

The IVC has nothing to do with modern India.
Thus the only people who can claim it are the people who descended from them and those being the modern day Pakistanis.

 

[p(-)0ENiX]

Majority of us Indian know Sanskrit as it is taught as a compulsory subjects in all school and we have preserved the Sanskrit language. I also know Sanskrit, if you wish I can write few sentences for you in Sanskrit.

There is no need for that, I don't care, & besides I wouldn't understand it anyway. I have personally never met an Indian who could speak Sanskrit.

Really? that's what you think of our father Aadam 3alayhissalaam?

Current Muslims' forefathers would be everything - Mumins (believers), Muslims (loosely part of the believing group, or at least not hostile to it), non-Muslims (well, not Muslim!) (and this is what most people might be in today's world, as possibly in yesterday's), and finally, Kaafirs (who cover up innate human nature and turn away after recognizing the truth).

I never claimed that Adam was a non-Muslim alright? Use your brain for God's sake. Muslims do have some "kafir" ancestors whether you accept or not.

Every other time my niece complains of a pink, invisible, flying hippopotamus living under her bed. It must be true after all.

Belief in a religion is established by confirming the observable or scientific claims of a religion. Mysticism is a part of every religion, whether you choose to believe it is up to you. I am not here to convince you. Even a retard could have come with a better response than what you came up with. Imagining stuff is extremely different from a belief, but I am not going to go in to further details because I am not here to convince you that my beliefs are correct. I simply don't care about you or your beliefs.

If I started giving you examples of Sanskrit words in use in modern day India, whether it be language, locations or Bollywood, I would have to write up[ a 300 page report because there are too many. Sanskrit root words make up languages like Hindi, Bengali, Bhojpuri, Punjabi(Indian), Haryanvi, Marathi, etc.

I already know that there are many Sanskrit root words in Indian languages. The thing is, I don't care.

You accept this....but the majority of the Muslims don't.......so many times I've heard arguments in this forum itself that Islam is the Religion from the beginning of the Earth created by Allah....therefore people believing in any other faith are 'kafirs', 'son of satan' and must be persecuted and killed acc. to the Islamic law for their infidelity.....

Tell me, can you kill your father just because he follows other religion.....you can't....but Islam says you have to.....killing an 'infidel' assures you 72 virgins in Heaven....

This intolerant attitude towards other religions is the main problem......you cannot kill someone and claim his achievements......if you do so....it's called 'SNATCHING' not 'CLAIMING'......

Don't ever bring a member of my family in to your foolish examples, I swear by God if you did that in real life I will make sure you end up in a coma. I was trying to be polite in my previous posts, but you have no idea how offensive your example was, I am serious, don't ever do that again. If you want to discuss be polite & respectful, & I will answer your questions relating to Islam politely.

We never killed our forefathers, had we done that, we wouldn't exist. Go ask your stupid questions to other Muslims who taught you such stupid things.

Oh really!!! then how Urdu is a official language. You guys are talking about Indus civilization, isn't Urdu is the part of Gangetic civilization, why Pakistanis made a Gangetic language as the official language of Pakistan.

Like you are saying Majority of IVC fell into Pakistan, isn't same true for Mughals. You have only Lahore as the heritage of Mughal Empire.

As I already told you majority of Pakistanis have no proudness of IVC(I have read about it at many places), you guys are here to piss off Indians from shared heritage for which you feel no proudness.

What the hell are you talking about it? The Urdu language developed in the Mughal Empire, many people from what is now Pakistan made contributions to that language. We have just as much claim on it as others do.

1) It might not matter to you, but it matters in the context of IVC because you made a nation on your supposed "hate/difference/ dissimilarity/distinctness" to Hindus and now you are trying to claim Hindu civilization. You guys made a nation on pretty much "Hey we are completely different from Hindus", so now stop claiming IVC.

2) Firstly, you seem to be confusing civilization with race. Look up what those two words mean in a dictionary.

No one follows ancient Egyptian civilization today, its extinct. Lets say if not everyone converted to Islam in Egypt, dont you think the Egyptians who did not convert to Islam would have a stronger claim to ancient Egyptian civilization compared to the ones who did convert? That is exactly the case in the IVC context.

Hindus aren't a race, they are a religion. The IVC belongs to us. I am not confusing civilization with race, look it up for yourself instead. All Egyptians whether Muslims or Non-Muslims have an equal claim to the IVC.

So apart from other things, your geography is bad too.. Though the history of the land has no relations with the the politics on the recent times but sill go an check all the IVC sites.

Even if we look with the twisted mindset like yours then also there are sites in UP, Haryana, Gujarat, Maharashtra, Rajasthan, Jammu etc in India Kandhahar, Shortugai in Afghanistan. IVC has more to it then only two sites. There are 1400 sites discovered till date.

It's your mind that is twisted & it's your geography that is retarded, not mine. Take a look at the map of IVC. It centers around the Indus & the Indus is today in modern day Pakistan.

 

[aakash_2410]

Who cares what these "some north indians think" ... would anyone care if i claim im the King of America in exile?NOPE..


Its funny... half ur mates here believe in Aryan invasion... half believe tht Indus civilisation was dravidian? u guys are confused yourself... tell me how can a guy from Bihar claim IVC? when his ancestors probably never even stepped outside of bihar in a thousand years? and ethnically hes a bihari from the bihar region? IVC never spread to Bihar now did it>?

Your first point is not worth arguing.

No one claims it was Dravidian thing? It was Indo-Aryan civilisation. And actually people living on the banks Ganges have more right to IVC because it has been proven that after the draught in Indus residents of IVC (Indians) moved on the banks of Ganges and made their civilisation there. (Vedic period) and hence, Ganges is holy for those residents (Hindus).

I just proved Hindus is a race and IVC is Indian. If you're still not sure use wiki/google.

 

[INDIC]

It was born in the islamic courts... it literally means " lashkari zaban" or military language...

http://www.google.com.pk/url?sa=t&r...6fm9DQ&usg=AFQjCNG06ZT3I8k-9G3VgS25zFP-w45ytA

The language is based on Khadiboli of Uttar Pradesh, not of some dialect of Larkana or Bahawalpur. Actually, Persians was court language Urdu originated with interaction with local population of North-India.

 

[Rusty]

Pakistani cuisine, language spoken were all born in the current lands of India..

That must be why Pakistani cuisine is so full of delicious delicious beef

Man You guys didn't even invent roti
Roti came from Iran.
How can you say such silly thing?
Your indigenous cousin is the one from South Asia, where you eat on Banana leaves.

 

[indian_jigar]

Right but on what basis do you claim this?
They didn't speak the same langue, and they didn't have the same religion.

The rest of Bharat only started to share ideals after the Aryans invaded and gave you Sanskrit and the Vedas.

The IVC has nothing to do with modern India.
Thus the only people who can claim it are the people who descended from them and those being the modern day Pakistanis.

Just like Urdu, Mughals, Tipu Sultan, Ghavnavi, Ghauri, Durrani, Mohammed Bin Qasim has nothing to do with Pakistan?

 

[seethru]

That must be why Pakistani cuisine is so full of delicious delicious beef

Man You guys didn't even invent roti
Roti came from Iran.
How can you say such silly thing?
Your indigenous cousin is the one from South Asia, where you eat on Banana leaves.

Pakistani Cuisine, Pakistani Music, Pakistani Culture!

 

[indian_jigar]

I already know that there are many Sanskrit root words in Indian languages. The thing is, I don't care.



Don't ever bring a member of my family in to your foolish examples, I swear by God if you did that in real life I will make sure you end up in a coma. I was trying to be polite in my previous posts, but you have no idea how offensive your example was, I am serious, don't ever do that again. If you want to discuss be polite & respectful, & I will answer your questions relating to Islam politely.

We never killed our forefathers, had we done that, we wouldn't exist. Go ask your stupid questions to other Muslims who taught you such stupid things.



Hindus aren't a race, they are a religion. The IVC belongs to us. I am not confusing civilization with race, look it up for yourself instead. All Egyptians whether Muslims or Non-Muslims have an equal claim to the IVC.

I have a feeling you are here to troll and dont really care about debating, so I wont waste my time with you no more.

Going by your definition, Urdu, Tipu Sultan, Mughals, Mohammed Bin Qasim, and many others are not Pakistani because geographically they have nothing to do with Pakistan.

Bottom line is stop stealing our civilization, you will have better luck convincing the French that the French language belongs to Pakistan.

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

Hahahahaha! You my mate are funny!

IVC which whole world sees as Indian and you claim IVC? To be honest you can't claim IVC and claim Muhammad bis qasim, or Timur to be your hero. That's contradiction of extreme form.

I dont claim timur or bin qasim... as for IVC... Learnt people dont consider it "indian" as in modern day india... go to ur nearest library or something...

This is an official GoP website:
http://www.google.com.pk/url?sa=t&r...qrG9DQ&usg=AFQjCNH0A9jyxh05DbpxFHziiiMuRUOrvA


extension into a state of india doesnt mean u can claim it as yours?

 

[BelligerentPacifist]

This is the problem with you people. Becoming a salesman of your religion and selling it's truthfulness to one and all..
...
Don't try to force yourself on everyone...

I do have to correct the egregious definition put out by a member that holds the same country's passport as me. There's a difference between forcing myself on others and putting right what some of you believe is one of my own, said.

I do take the words in a book as authority. That has been the norm, books were revealed for human guidance just as they lost the sight of their goal. If you don't take the authority of the book, then the book throws a challenge: create one chapter that matces the smallest of That book, and that's about two lines. If you can't, your heart will realize that one isn't from man, it's from God. I guess you haven't read that book, have you? It will be a unique academic experience for you to go to it after having trown out what stupid Muslims and stupid Pakistanis and stupid Indians say. What I'm reminding you of, is, that we do have the innate ability to recognize beauty and goodness without someone educating you of those, and I do think you'll agree with me on this.

...If there is any god and he created all humanity then he would at least not differentiate it's own creations by calling them Kaafir/Non Kaafir etc. ...

You're going somewhere that will end up in a discussion of pre-destination and determinism and the like. I'll try to steer clear of that, and just say: he created man perfect and let the latter choose to either elevate or denigrate himself. So, in some degree, man is responsible for his binary classification.

Let's be clear on one thing: if i'm Muslim then this mandates me to choose for everybody, Muslim, Non-muslim, expressedly-Kaafir, what I choose for myself; and it also obligates in case of the latter two cases, treat them with extreme gentleness until they move on to the next world and see the truths and the fallacies for themselves. So you don't have to worry about my behaviour toward you - here we both are just presenting two different views in order to explain reality better, doen't mean i'll headbutt you next time we meet!

 

[aakash_2410]

Right but on what basis do you claim this?
They didn't speak the same langue, and they didn't have the same religion.

The rest of Bharat only started to share ideals after the Aryans invaded and gave you Sanskrit and the Vedas.

The IVC has nothing to do with modern India.
Thus the only people who can claim it are the people who descended from them and those being the modern day Pakistanis.

They did have the same religion!

Some Indus valley seals show swastikas, which are found in other religions (worldwide), especially in Indian religions such as Hinduism, Buddhism, and Jainism. The earliest evidence for elements of Hinduism are alleged to have been present before and during the early Harappan period.[59] Phallic symbols interpreted as the much later Hindu Shiva lingam have been found in the Harappan remains.[60][61]

They did have the same religion and languages!

Swastika Seals from the Indus Valley Civilization preserved at the British Museum.
Many Indus valley seals show animals. One motif shows a horned figure seated in a posture reminiscent of the Lotus position and surrounded by animals was named by early excavators Pashupati (lord of cattle), an epithet of the later Hindu gods Shiva and Rudra.

I'm pretty sure these are Hindu deities?

But we are Aryans? (Indo-Aryans?)
You point would be valid for Drividian (South Indian) but 80% Indians are Indo-Aryans!

Indus Valley Civilization - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[INDIC]

There is no need for that, I don't care, & besides I wouldn't understand it anyway. I have personally never met an Indian who could speak Sanskrit.

Many of us Indians study Sanskrit till class 8th or 10th or 12th depending upon the choice.

What the hell are you talking about it? The Urdu language developed in the Mughal Empire, many people from what is now Pakistan made contributions to that language. We have just as much claim on it as others do.

You are talking of Indus valley and Ganga Valley so surely Urdu is from Ganga Valley. Like you have Muhajirs we too have Sindhis and West Punjabis.

 

[indian_jigar]

They did have the same religion!

Some Indus valley seals show swastikas, which are found in other religions (worldwide), especially in Indian religions such as Hinduism, Buddhism, and Jainism. The earliest evidence for elements of Hinduism are alleged to have been present before and during the early Harappan period.[59] Phallic symbols interpreted as the much later Hindu Shiva lingam have been found in the Harappan remains.[60][61]

They did have the same religion and languages!

Swastika Seals from the Indus Valley Civilization preserved at the British Museum.
Many Indus valley seals show animals. One motif shows a horned figure seated in a posture reminiscent of the Lotus position and surrounded by animals was named by early excavators Pashupati (lord of cattle), an epithet of the later Hindu gods Shiva and Rudra.

I'm pretty sure these are Hindu deities?

But we are Aryans? (Indo-Aryans?)
You point would be valid for Drividian (South Indian) but 80% Indians are Indo-Aryans!

Indus Valley Civilization - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

There is no such things as Aryans and Dravidians, it has been scientifically disproven. Stop sprouting BS in a debate.

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

Pakistani cuisine, language spoken were all born in the current lands of India..

Yes Chiken tikka,sajji,peshawari naan,kehva etc all originate from india? mate we dont eat dhoklas,sambar,idli,daal paneer etc.. thts ur food!

Why you speaking Urdu then, which is a language from UP? Geographically, Urdu has nothing to do with Pakistan.

Haha... even urdu is not spoken and discouraged in india... also it was the lingua franca of the mughal courts? so how can u hindi speaking hindus or the luchknow people who literally rape the urdu language claim it?