‘Ghar wapsi’: Politics of conversion!

[Donatello]

You seem to be discharging more methane than usual nowadays. Don't ever compare Pakistan and India. You are conveniently unaware of the violence that's the hallmark of Pak society.

In Pakistan it is about an explosive fusion of Islamist zeal and simmering ethnic tensions that have resulted in conflagrations that have killed untold thousands in Pakistan. Hindus, Christians, Ahmedias and other minorities have either been forcibly converted or killed. The whole world knows it. And you brush it under the carpet?

Practice what you preach. You're not a paragon of virtue - not by a long shot.

Lets talk about current and historical India...

Lets talk about Gujarat.....

Shall we?

You are conveniently unaware of the violence that's the hallmark of Indian society

That's your stupid logic, not mine. The point is tat India offers equal opportunity for everybody, unlike Paksitan. That is why India is a secular democratic republic, that doesn't need to be lectured by the inhabitants of a country that cannot even make a pretence of that.

BTW Sikhs have been a lot of things, not just the PM. Army chief, 5 star Marshal of the air force, constituting 20% of the armed forces, supreme court judges, chainman of the planning commision...the list goes on. In fact Sikhs are one of the most prosperous groups in the country. The point of my post was that in Pak, Sikhs, hindus etc are constitutionally prohibited from becoming PM. How can you let those kafirs rule the great mussalmans, right?

Going on screaming about two riots that happend 12 and 30 years back in India may soothe your ego, but the fact remains that India is a secular republic that gives the same rights to everybody, unlike your country where minorities cannot, by law, hope for equality.

Oh and would you like me to start counting thr number of massacres of non pure sunni mussalmans in your country? Every time that happens, you can talk about '83 or 2002, that's the way to show em!

You missed 1990s completely

As i have said before, fools like you will do anything to drag Pakistan in.

Typical hot air from the backside, with the same buzzwords - oh 1984, oh 2002 riots, oh India not secular. Whereas we take such good care of our minorities, that you won't hear a breath from them.


There you go. And then you have the audacity to question India's secular credentials. This is like a self proclaimed genocidal maniac chiding his neighbour for petty theft.

Yes you take excellent good care of the minorities from razing their mosque down and celebrating to attacking their temples.

Nice.

 

[Echo_419]

Lol noohh
Thats a taunt on all seculars and many like me 're even mugwumps, we dont support any party.

You got any better ideas

 

[janon]

You missed 1990s completely

As i have said before, fools like you will do anything to drag Pakistan in.

You do realize that the article is written by a Pakistani in a Pakistani newspaper for Pakistani connsumption and posted here by a Pakistani member? That might give you an idea why Pakistan is being mentioned. People living in glass houses...

And you might want to dispense with the name calling. I know PDF allows you to do that, but it jusgt makes you look desperate and pathetic.

 

[Donatello]

That's not the narrative that muslims are taught and believe. The mainstream belief is that everybody since the first couple (as if there even was such a thing) were muslims, and then the teaching got corrupted and then Muhammed happened. Such fictitious narratives prevent most of them from making sense of human history, and then people like @Donatello have the nerve to scream about some remarks about airplanes that some idiot made, when his religion's mainstream narrative itself is so ludicrous.

What can i expect from a fool like you, who can put such intelligent people in power:

https://twitter.com/x/status/549500620118319104

 

[janon]

Yes you take excellent good care of the minorities from razing their mosque down and celebrating to attacking their temples.

Nice.

@ Indian members: Let's just tell @Donatello that we agree that India is a putrid hotbead of hindu extremism and hindutva terrorism, and minorities are all fleeing the violence to the paradise next door, while Pakistan is a shining beacon of secularism and protection of minority rights. Maybe he would be satisfied to hear that, and leave the thread for us to discuss our country, without his certificate. I mean, after all the whole world knows how commendably Pakistan treats minority faiths. Every day when there is a terror attack by Pakistani muslims, people like him will crow about Colonel Purohit. Every time a world renowned terrorist is smoked by Americans in Pak, they will talk about Colonel Purohit. (Sometimes Bal Thakerey too.) Every time there is a massacre of shias or ahmedis or christians in Pakistan, they will talk about Gujarat 2002. We cannot help the willfully blind to see reality. So our best course of action is to leave such people in their comforting delusions, and silently smirk at their gullibility and ignorance.

 

[anonymus]

Its a very sensitive topic indeed.
India is a secular country and every religion has right to profess and propogate its teachings and people are free to pursue a religion of their choice, regardless of which religion they were born into.
If you go to Ajmer Sharief, Deva Sharief or Haji Ali Dargah you will find most people going there are Hindus. I know many muslims visiting Tirupati and offering hairs and so many muslims taking their kids to different Dussehra Mela, Durga puja and Ganapati mandaps where idol worship happens. Fortunately or unfortunately I am surrounded by such people of all religions and have very rarely met in person the fanatics i see on internet or read about them. Thats why i am often surprized when people brand a whole community with a particular thought process.
I know many non muslim women who have married muslims and all of them converted to Islam probably because its a requirement but alongwith their new religion they continue to pursue some of their old religious practices like observing fast, karwa chouth, raksha bandhan etc. and never feel comfy observing the rituals of their new faith. Similarly i know many muslim women who married hindus or other non muslims and they never had any issues nor anyone created any issues except the initial heart burn.

So what is ghar wapsi? when did anyone leave his/her ghar? There was no muslim in the world before the Prophet (saw), no christian before Jesus, no buddhist before goutam buddha and no sikh before the 10 Gurus. There is no idol worship in sikhism, there is no mention of God in Jainism and Buddhism says you are your own god. These are different from hindu philosophy so why there is no ghar wapasi for sikhs, jains and buddhists. Why there is Vedic Havan and Puja in India for the well being of Sultan of Oman for his successful surgery? He is an Arab and never a Hindu.
Also, can anyone answer that if a non hindu becomes a hindu which caste he will belong to? which community he should go for marital relations? I think they should first keep their house in order and clean it up before calling anyone home.

Madam, This "Ghar Vapsi" issue is not a religious but Socio-Polititical issue. As another poster @DRAY has pointed it out, it is a tit fot tat response to aggressive well funded Christian evangelism.


What you are seeing here is classical game theory in play. If any participant in a multi player scenario becomes a Hawk, other players have to either become a Hawk or get exterminated.

Evolutionary game theory - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The current surge in Hindu evangelism is in response to threat posed by Christian evangelist flush with foreign funds.Christian church based in USA have been a destabilizing factor as they believe in converting by hook or crook. People who condemn 'ghar vapsi' without condemning missionary activities expect Hinduism to roll over and die without a fight when faced with missionary onslaught having practically infinite resources with which to Bribe.

 

[Echo_419]

What can i expect from a fool like you, who can put such intelligent people in power:

https://twitter.com/x/status/549500620118319104

Let's not go into 'stupid politicians' thing don't forget you have many of them too

 

[janon]

What can i expect from a fool like you, who can put such intelligent people in power:

https://twitter.com/x/status/549500620118319104

Sorry, I'm not interested in tit for tat statements and point scoring. And since you continue to call names, I'm assuming that your capacity for productive discussion is as high as a retarded rat's.

I agree fully that India is the breeding ground of religious extremism and terrorism, not Paksitan. India is in a state of perpetual war against religious terrorism, not Pak. There has never been any untoward incident of violence, state sanctioned or otherwise in Pakistan. In post #80, I've requested other Indians also to agree with you on this. Happy now?

 

[Donatello]

Let's not go into 'stupid politicians' thing don't forget you have many of them too

Who put them in there?

Afterall .....as quoted by your fellow member, India is a secular, democratic republic?
So since India is 100% perfect in every sense, the politicians represent the public?

Hmm....interesting.

Sorry, I'm not interested in tit for tat statements and point scoring.

I agree fully that India is the breeding ground of religious extremism and terrorism, not Paksitan. India is in a state of perpetual war against religious terrorism, not Pak. There has never been any untoward incident of violence, state sanctioned or otherwise in Pakistan. In post #80, I've requested other Indians also to agree with you on this. Happy now?

I don't need some random schmucks on the internet to agree with me.

 

[Levina]

You got any better ideas

of course!!!
Dont bash the seculars every now and then.

 

[Echo_419]

of course!!!
Dont bash the seculars every now and then.

I was asking for ideas for a new name for name calling but yeah your point is also correct

 

[Levina]

I was asking for ideas I. A new name for name calling but yeah your point is also correct

Call 'em congressi Lolz.

 

[Razia Sultana]

That's not the narrative that muslims are taught and believe. The mainstream belief is that everybody since the first couple (as if there even was such a thing) were muslims, and then the teaching got corrupted and then Muhammed happened. Such fictitious narratives prevent most of them from making sense of human history, and then people like @Donatello have the nerve to scream about some remarks about airplanes that some idiot made, when his religion's mainstream narrative itself is so ludicrous.

Can I ask one thing? How many muslims you know personally and out of them how many are taught or believe in fanaticism? I trust you wont find any or perhaps very very few. Such people are a marginalized lot, who have failed to do anything meaningful in life and our media will pick up one such guy and show to the world and say, see what is he talking. Then there will be politicians who will try to incite religious passions which is easily aroused in a negative way, to polarize their vote banks. And then there are us who will at first opportunity try to brand a whole community anti national etc.
What i want to say is that plz dont generalize on the basis of marginalized belief and plz dont call them mainstream.

 

[anonymus]

Call 'em congressi Lolz.

But they are not endemic to Congress. Pretty much every JNUite consider Marxism-Sickularism as his religion and this view find lot of traction in Media houses too.

 

[mooppan]

Recently there was a case against a Christian missionary brother in Kerala.His charity foundation have around 1000crores of western money funding.
Of course we have a secular Congress allied govt in state and so that case is vanished from the limelight once and for all.
This is story of one christian missionaries group.What about hundreds other both large and small?
Doesnt any one have any idea about the enormous set up behind this?
Islamic groups cant move like that way because of the govt stringent law policy.They will always look for Wahabi money and source.
The main targets of both these groups are Hindus .
The author in the article pointed to a fact we dont have any problem with Sikh,Buddh,Jain .Well none of them will try to exploit the poor Hindus for conversion.And they dont have money back up like that of Abrahamic religion.

And now he also take about complete non discriminable attitude of Abrahamic religions.A few weeks ago there was a case in TN where converted low caste people cant visit Churches because upper caste Christians dont like it.
Similarly we can see such a level intolerance among Muslims also.A recent survey also proved that.
In other western nations they have racism and we have casteism.And RSS is the main important front organistation against Casteism.

Agreed,But its not limited to Abrahamic religions..What about the illegal assets of hundreds of Dharmic demigod babas like asaram bapu,amritya mayi etc??
Western funding(largely from NRI's) is there among Dharmic babas too...Amrithanandamayi said to have assets over 1500-2000 crore..Whats the source???...She even have hundreds of mutts and other establishments in many Western nations....