Xinjiang attack masterminded by terrorists trained in Pakistan: China

[Abu Zolfiqar]

Even the ex-Afghanistan spokesman in Kabul in an interview on Indian TV admitted that India is running secret prison cells inside Afghanistan, & using Afghanistan as a proxy land. It is pretty clear that India is creating a lot of problems inside Balochistan.

it's a known fact by now.....india is playing dirty games against Pakistan through its proxies in Afghanistan; however I pray that given our extensive experience in Afghanistan and the ethnic breakup (of at least southern region) we will be able to leverage those and keep the indians in check.

they do play dangerous games on that side, and their (former) defence attache in Kabul learned that Pakistani blood does (at least eventually) have some costs attributed towards it............not that i am owning up to that incident --for the record.

It is best if Pakistan & India can resolve all outstanding issues, but India needs to be cooperative in that, which it hasn't been.

they prefer to see Pakistan isolated....they dont seek friendly ties with Pakistan. Therefore, i dont see them being cooperative anytime soon.

 

[Sinnerman108]

The thread is started and thrashed by Indians.
This is the kind of drama and clever mischief only Indians ( and two other nationalities) are capable of.

The news says the Alleged master mind was trained INSIDE Pakistan, NOT trained BY Pakistan.

There is a world of difference between the two.

People of Pakistan are not very interested in China's province. We are very interested to strike Hindustan.

Thus the difference between the two approaches.

 

[muse]

you are putting all the blame on Pakistan and that is not fair.

The reason it is fair to put all blame on Pakistan, is that it is only Pakistan that is responsible for the existence of such training camps in Pakistan - Pakistan tolerates these camps because like you say, Pakistan has been using Islamism - you justify the use of Islamism - so you must accept responsibility for it being exported from Pakistan.

You can make any claim that Chechans are Russia's problem or jundallah Iran's or LeT Kashmir India's problem and East turkestan China's problem - but you cannot escape that all these groups use Pakistan as their base -- How is this possible without government enabling the terrorists? After all who is teaching bomb making? do people just know bomb making from the womb?? Who is allowing this money to come for the training? How is it that these people are being housed and fed and Pakistan knows or claims to know nothing about it?

Pakistan army takes recruits from all over Pakistan and then INDOCTRINATES them -- all armies do the same thing - but in Pakistan army, the indoctrination is Islamism - I can make this case with proofs but this is not the place for it. The fact is that Pakistan army is, when it comes to promotion of Islamism, a major promoter of this ideology - there can be no denying this. Why no camps in india or Nepal or Uzbekistan or Russia or America or Argentina, why Pakistan??

You speak of the rallies of Islamists in Pakistan - how then can you argue that Pakistan does not promote islamism? After all, simply saying that we do not act against them is an excuse, a kind of plausible deniablity - but the reality is that Islamists flourish in Pakistan.

See AZ, it's not a question of honesty, the fact is that we are naked before the world - some realize it others imagine that if we deny that we are naked, then maybe by a miracle, clothes will appear - Alas.

If Al-Qaida boss was living comfortably in Pakistan, and IMU boss, and the LeT boss and the Jundallah Boss, we must be reasonable, we cannot evade responsibility for their existence of our soil.

 

[IndoCarib]

The thread is started and thrashed by Indians.
This is the kind of drama and clever mischief only Indians ( and two other nationalities) are capable of.

The news says the Alleged master mind was trained INSIDE Pakistan, NOT trained BY Pakistan.

There is a world of difference between the two.

People of Pakistan are not very interested in China's province. We are very interested to strike Hindustan.

Thus the difference between the two approaches.

So the attackers were trained INSIDE Pakistan, not BY Pakistan ! You mean to say non- Pakistanis train terrorists INSIDE Pakistan and Pakistan doesnt even know about it. A poor excuse !

As for your comment on striking India; We are waiting !!!!

 

[53fd]

The reason it is fair to put all blame on Pakistan, is that it is only Pakistan that is responsible for the existence of such training camps in Pakistan - Pakistan tolerates these camps because like you say, Pakistan has been using Islamism - you justify the use of Islamism - so you must accept responsibility for it being exported from Pakistan.

You can make any claim that Chechans are Russia's problem or jundallah Kashmir's problem and East turkestan China's problem - but you cannot escape that all these groups use Pakistan as their base -- How is this possible without government enabling the terrorists? After all who is teaching bomb making? do people just know bomb making from the womb??

Pakistan army takes recruits from all over Pakistan and then INDOCTRINATES them -- all armies do the same thing - but in Pakistan army, the indoctrination is Islamism - I can make this case with proofs but this is not the place for it. The fact is that Pakistan army is, when it comes to promotion of Islamism, a major promoter of this ideology - there can be no denying this. Why no camps in india or Nepal or Uzbekistan or Russia or America or Argentina, why Pakistan??

You speak of the rallies of Islamists in Pakistan - how then can you argue that Pakistan does not promote islamism? After all, simply saying that we do not act against them is an excuse, a kind of plausible deniablity - but the reality is that Islamists flourish in Pakistan.

See AZ, it's not a question of honesty, the fact is that we are naked before the world - some realize it others imagine that if we deny that we are naked, then maybe by a miracle, clothes will appear - Alas.

I don't think it is fair to say that Pakistan tolerates these camps, it has tolerated these camps in the past. International separatist groups from Chechnya, Arabs, Uighurs, Uzbeks do not serve any purpose to Pakistan, but are in fact a huge threat to the Pakistani Establishment & Pakistan. The presence of these groups harm Pakistan in all kinds of ways. But either ways, the international terrorist groups getting safe havens in the FATA need to be eradicated, & there should be no terrorist group operating from Pakistani soil. There is also a huge problem that most terror groups operating from Afghanistan have infiltrated into Pakistan's tribal areas, & something needs to be done to stop these infiltration.

 

[Peshwa]

as for Kashmir -- we didnt need to do much. Most of the fighting against the occupation forces in the Disputed territory was a purely Kashmiri phenomenon. Though it is true we offered moral support to the Kashmiri freedom fighters.
.

Oh please...playing sheep has become far too common for many Pakistanis...

Are we to simply ignore the ton of evidence including your own leaders admitting that terrorism was nurtured in Kashmir (Turning a blind eye to training camps counts.) to further Pakistan's goal ?
Kargil was an indegenous movement as well Im assuming eh? and attacking Mumbai is the way to "fight for Kashmir" right?
LET/JUD calls itself an organization for the liberation of Kashmir, yet its members are hardly indegenous

If terrorism needs to be eliminated from your country, you need to start by using an even approach to terror as opposed to turning a blind or in your case justify terrorism to suit your nations designs...
You certainly cannot expect Indians to feel compassionate for your situation or feel guilty for promoting a negative image of Pakistan internationally since you dont seem to care about what irks us....

 

[muse]

The news says the Alleged master mind was trained INSIDE Pakistan, NOT trained BY Pakistan.

Our own Allies, the Chinese made the charge - now this lawyerly approach asking what the meanikng of "is" is? -- Was he trained in pakistan? Yes, who controls Pakistan? Terrorists??

Some of our Pakistani readers, seem to become irrational in their defense of Islamism - If Pakistan does not control it's territory, then it invites others to do it, right?? Is that what you are asking for??

 

[madooxno9]

The reason it is fair to put all blame on Pakistan, is that it is only Pakistan that is responsible for the existence of such training camps in Pakistan - Pakistan tolerates these camps because like you say, Pakistan has been using Islamism - you justify the use of Islamism - so you must accept responsibility for it being exported from Pakistan.

You can make any claim that Chechans are Russia's problem or jundallah Iran's or LeT Kashmir India's problem and East turkestan China's problem - but you cannot escape that all these groups use Pakistan as their base -- How is this possible without government enabling the terrorists? After all who is teaching bomb making? do people just know bomb making from the womb?? Who is allowing this money to come for the training? How is it that these people are being housed and fed and Pakistan knows or claims to know nothing about it?

Pakistan army takes recruits from all over Pakistan and then INDOCTRINATES them -- all armies do the same thing - but in Pakistan army, the indoctrination is Islamism - I can make this case with proofs but this is not the place for it. The fact is that Pakistan army is, when it comes to promotion of Islamism, a major promoter of this ideology - there can be no denying this. Why no camps in india or Nepal or Uzbekistan or Russia or America or Argentina, why Pakistan??

You speak of the rallies of Islamists in Pakistan - how then can you argue that Pakistan does not promote islamism? After all, simply saying that we do not act against them is an excuse, a kind of plausible deniablity - but the reality is that Islamists flourish in Pakistan.

See AZ, it's not a question of honesty, the fact is that we are naked before the world - some realize it others imagine that if we deny that we are naked, then maybe by a miracle, clothes will appear - Alas.

If Al-Qaida boss was living comfortably in Pakistan, and IMU boss, and the LeT boss and the Jundallah Boss, we must be reasonable, we cannot evade responsibility for their existence of our soil.

I Wonder These days that are you still a Pakistani ?

coz your posts after Opreation geronimo became against Pak Fauj... which is opposite the wave in here.

anyways ...you are only one who says it all loud and clear .

 

[muse]

I don't think it is fair to say that Pakistan tolerates these camps, it has tolerated these camps in the past. ... There is also a huge problem that most terror groups operating from Afghanistan have infiltrated into Pakistan's tribal areas, & something needs to be done to stop these infiltration.

If Pakistan does not tolerate these camps then how come they exist?????????

Either way, who is responsible for Pakistan? If you really want to say that Pakistan is not responsible, then please think over the implications of what you are saying -- Do you really want to invite others to control the territory???

I understand that it hurts persons such as yourself who do not want to be see their country to be seen as a haven for international terrorists - but
the truth is, that it is a haven for international terrorists -- and we must ask ourselves how did this come to be? Who did this to us? How come then cthey can continue to do this to us? Each of the answers will lead you to a single institution and a single ideology. But some will say that the answer is unfair.
t

 

[Safriz]

the problem in pakistan is that people are looking for a solution to their problems...its just that they are looking in the wrong place....
religion is always seen as salvation and a solution to their problems......but pakistans problems are not religious..the problems are economical financial and administerative..
feed thecpeople well..give them shelter and hope for the future anl all problems including terrorism will go away....
until then only a miracle will get us out of this mess.

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

The reason it is fair to put all blame on Pakistan, is that it is only Pakistan that is responsible for the existence of such training camps in Pakistan - Pakistan tolerates these camps because like you say, Pakistan has been using Islamism - you justify the use of Islamism - so you must accept responsibility for it being exported from Pakistan.

i clearly stated that short-sightedness subsequent to the anti-soviet operation is what caused the contents in the pot to over-boil.

those people were abandoned....they should have been rehabilitated that would have been the most ''Islamic'' thing to do

You can make any claim that Chechans are Russia's problem or jundallah Kashmir's problem and East turkestan China's problem

-

they are

but you cannot escape that all these groups use Pakistan as their base -- How is this possible without government enabling the terrorists?

it isnt about ''enabling'' it is just about not being able to contain the threat....when you have a government that is so inept and incompetent, what else can you expect?

You cant pin all hopes and dreams on the Army. ''They are good...but they are not God''

civilian govt. needs to play its role here; and foreign governments should also do their part and stop their bad-apples from coming into our country and making problems. And Pakistan needs to be pro-active at all levels --whether its airport security/immigration office, or the inadequately equipped police guy sitting somewhere in Mohmand or other places.

After all who is teaching bomb making? do people just know bomb making from the womb??

are u kidding me? I can give you a list of materials to get from hardware/botanicals/electric store and you will have ability to make a crude device. The information is even online.

however, some of the very sophisticated IEDs that have been used --some of the know-how was transferred from Iraq theatre; the jihadi types do have access to such information, some of them are tech-savvy and ''well versed'' on such things. They even discuss openly about it on their damned online forums.

quite scary, actually......Pakistanis of all people have had to deal with such threats more than ANY other nation. If you are implying that Pakistan alone is responsible for teaching those people how to build bombs --well, i will take a strong exception to that.

and while I --in public and especially behind closed doors --am very critical about a lot of things Pakistan has done (or NOT done) --- i dont subscribe to the whole thing that Pakistan should pocket all the blame.

I think that's a nonsense.

The fact is that Pakistan army is, when it comes to promotion of Islamism, a major promoter of this ideology - there can be no denying this. Why no camps in india or Nepal or Uzbekistan or Russia or America or Argentina, why Pakistan??

Because Pakistan isnt a dictatorship....ít's an overly ''free'' country where lawlessness exists in certain parts many thanks due to the inept, corrupt, apathetic civilian government in power. One that serves the west more than it serves itself.

in that sense, I thank GOD that we have agencies whose sole job is to keep their eyes open while others are either asleep or permanently comatose.


Uzbekistan?? really dude....do you see how they treat dissent in that country? The policies in Uzbekistan are the reason why their Goddam ''Islamic movement of Uzbekistan'' is driven out like goats, and they take refuge in Pakistan and Afghanistan, often criss-crossing the terrain.

So, should Pakistan become a total police-state like Uzbekistan? Or will you then be vocal about that policy too?

You speak of the rallies of Islamists in Pakistan - how then can you argue that Pakistan does not promote islamism? After all, simply saying that we do not act against them is an excuse, a kind of plausible deniablity - but the reality is that Islamists flourish in Pakistan.

so do a lot of other things, Muse.

corruption, feudalism, not enough opportunities especially in rural areas, poverty/illiteracy is a problem we have not done good job to tackle...these are all inter-linked!

See AZ, it's not a question of honesty, the fact is that we are naked before the world - some realize it others imagine that if we deny that we are naked, then maybe by a miracle, clothes will appear - Alas.

we are born naked and will turn to dust when we die....

as long as we are alive, we should do all in our power to stand by OUR national interests.....Pakistan has been kind, it got screwed over. Pakistan has also been short-sighted, that definitely screwed us over.

but i DARE you to find any instance where Pakistan was ever a villain; or did something in which intention was to be ruthless or of detriment to others.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

If Pakistan does not tolerate these camps then how come they exist?????????

The same reason 'criminals' exist in every society, despite almost every society and government 'not tolerating criminals'.

Do you really think the Mexican and US governments want the drug trade and associated drug lords, criminals and violence to perpetuate? Does the existence of the above indicate that the US and Mexican governments 'tolerate Drug lords and the illegal drug trade'?

Either way, who is responsible for Pakistan? If you really want to say that Pakistan is not responsible, then please think over the implications of what you are saying -- Do you really want to invite others to control the territory???

Pakistan is certainly responsible, as are the US and Mexico in the examples mentioned above, but being 'responsible' in this case means to continue to apply resources and refine/change strategies and policies to deal with a complex problem, and complex problems can take a very long time and many attempts to resolve - 'responsible' does not mean 'complicit'.

 

[53fd]

If Pakistan does not tolerate these camps then how come they exist?????????

They continue to exist because Pakistan has failed to exert its writ in the Tribal Areas, where these groups have found refuge. The current operation is aimed at the Pakistani Establishment winning back the territory from the terrorists, where they have made tribals hostage.

Either way, who is responsible for Pakistan? If you really want to say that Pakistan is not responsible, then please thing over the implications of what you are saying -- Do you really want to invite others to control the territory???

Pakistan/Pakistani Establishment is responsible, no ways about it. Every attack that has an origin from Pakistani soil, whether it is supported by the government or not, is the responsibility of the Pakistan government. Pakistan needs to eliminate all the foreign terrorists getting refuge inside the FATA, as well as the local terrorists that are giving them refuge there. Simple as that.

I understand that it hurts persons such as yourself who do not want to be see their country to be seen as a haven for international terrorists - but
the truth is, that it is a haven for international terrorists -- and we must ask ourselves how did this come to be? Who did this to us? How come then can continue to do this to us? Each of the answers will lead you to a single institution and a single ideology. But some will say that the answer is unfair.
tan

Yes, the FATA (parts of Pakistan) is becoming a safe haven for international terrorists, & it has been the neglect shown by the government, & its failure to establish its writ there. It is the fault of the government that FATA is governed by Pashtunwali & not Pakistani law, it is the fault of the government that some local people in the FATA got brainwashed, fell into the hands of 'local' terrorists (Afghan Taliban), who then gave refuge to international terrorists, & then made the rest of the tribals their hostage. But Pakistan has realized the threat posed by these groups, & the current operations in the FATA are proving that. I hope the drone strikes program in North Waziristan does not stop, as it is proving to be successful in rooting out the terrorists there. All in all, the Pakistan government is winning back land that was in the hands of the terrorists, & that is a good thing.

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

terrorism was nurtured in Kashmir (Turning a blind eye to training camps counts.) to further Pakistan's goal ?

well even if its true, its a good revenge in my opinion -- for india supporting the mukti bahini terrorists

and attacking Mumbai is the way to "fight for Kashmir" right?

mumbai has been attacked several times in the past few decades; none of those attacks had anything to do with Pakistani state; none of those attacks were Kashmir-centric.

LET/JUD calls itself an organization for the liberation of Kashmir, yet its members are hardly indegenous

Kashmir, even Deccan Hyderabad and Gujrat....

LeT is banned, it doesnt even exist.
JuD -- big question mark; but not enough evidence to put their leaders away...provide sufficient proof that implicates them in mumbai thing, and Pakistan would be compelled to act.

prose and words are not evidence

If terrorism needs to be eliminated from your country, you need to start by using an even approach to terror as opposed to turning a blind or in your case justify terrorism to suit your nations designs...

the pot calling the kettle black

You certainly cannot expect Indians to feel compassionate for your situation or feel guilty for promoting a negative image of Pakistan internationally since you dont seem to care about what irks us....

neither country cares about what irks the other.....we dont need indian to feel ''compassionate'' or any of that nonsense. But i do think that since both have suffered casualties, and since both are stakeholders on CERTAIN un-avoidable issues -- makes sense to even out the playing field and confront the issues that prevent the countries from moving forward.

terrorism is a global phenomenon.

Pakistan has done more than its fair share to fight terrorism and extremism. The country has sacrificed a lot, financially and monetarily. It's important you realize that. And if you still have reservations or doubts, that is your own problem. Not mine, not ours.

 

[T-Faz]

@Bilal,

There are more terrorists in Punjab than there are in FATA, when is the state going to control and force its writ in our largest province?