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Why Pakistan Has Not 1 but 3 Chinese-Made Tanks

AZ uses none of those.
View attachment 625126


Here is an old specification sheet:

View attachment 625125

The gun is Pakistani, same one from AK..
View attachment 625127


Maybe for china which has no tankable terrain or enemy that will use tanks against it.

You cant really use tanks against indians in AP/Tibet thus light tanks are good but for Pak its the other way around.


AK is based on Type-90IIM not 88.

The Al Zarrar Turret (Turret only) is actually based on Type 88C later version turret. Of course the Hull is similar to the Type 59 (aka Soviet Type 54B).

The picture I posted earlier with a cast turret was a Type 88 early version (A) which was the last tank in PLA service to see the use of a 105mm gun, later tank versions (even Type 88 later versions, such as Type 88C) all use a 125mm smoothbore gun which was inspired by a foreign design.

Also - Type 88C uses a new welded turret identical to the Al-Zarrar, maybe that was the inspiration for AZ tank turret, as can be seen with the AZ turret minus ERA. Here is the complete writeup from TanknutDave, see where the 125mm has THREE tube sections aft of the fume extractor piece for the Type 88C welded turret, as opposed to the TWO tubes aft of the fume extractor for the 105mm (look at various images below).


The Chinese Type 88 Tank
View Our new and expanded Chinese Type 88 Tank page 0n Fighting-vehicles.com

Type 88 Tank



The Original Type 88 Entered Service with the Peoples Liberation Army in 1988
The Type 88 Description
The Type 88 is the Peoples Liberation Army designation for the Chinese Type 80-II Prototype, that was accepted into service in 1988 with some small modifications, namely a different bank of smoke grenade launchers and different external turret stowage racks. This was done so that ERA (FY Seriesl like that on the Type 59D) could be fitted to the turret front. It was the last tank produced for the PLA that was fitted with a 105mm calibre Main Gun. It has been upgraded several times into new Marks.

The Chinese Type 88 Tank

The Chinese Type 88 Tank – Click to enlarge
The Type 88 uses a 4 man crew, Driver sits front left of the hull, the Gunner is front left of the turret, the Commander sat behind him and the Loader is stationed on the right of the turret. The vehicle originally used the 105mm rifled Type 83 main gun. It could be identified by counting the sections of the thermal sleeve. The Type 83 gun has 2 sections in front of the fume extractor and a further 2 after it. The tank was also fitted by some form of composite armour across its hull front.


The Type 88 & Type 88B Type 83 Main Gun
The Chinese Type 88B Tank
The Chinese Type 88B Tank


The Chinese Type 88B Tank
In terms of tank upgrades, a Mark B would supersede a Mark A. However the Type 88B was implemented first in PLA service. It still retained the Type 83 Main Gun but had an improved Fire Control System (called 212) and could also be recognised by the protective shroud over the Gunners sight.

The Chinese Type 88A Tank

The Chinese Type 88A Tank
The Type 88A was the third upgrade for the vehicle and was most recognisable by its longer 105mm rifled main gun, the Type 83-I aka Type 83 Improved. It could be spotted by the front of the thermal sleeve having 3 sections between the bore and fume extractor.

The increased barrel length, aka calibre Length meant great range and round penetration over the old model as the round had a long distance to travel allowing the energy from the case charge to build up and push the round out harder.

A number of online publications wrongly state that the Type 88A has 12 smoke grenade launchers (6 either side of the turret). All images show that it retains the 2 pairs of banks each with x2 launchers either side of the turret. It was infact the Type 88C that had 12 launchers.

The Chinese Type 88C Tank

The Chinese Type 88C Tank
The Type 88 originated from the Type 80 prototype as did the Type 85. At some point in time all earlier Type 88 were upgraded with a new turret and hull modifications from a later model of the Type 85 Tank. The new turret had a 125mm smoothbore main gun and autoloader reducing the crew to 3. It retained the same Fire Control System as the 88B and later recieved a 1000hp engine.

The Chinese Type 88 Tank Specifications
Crew: 4
Weight: 39.5 tonne
Engine: 730hp 12150L-7BW diesel
Transmission: Mechanical, planetary
Track: Metallic, later variants have RMSh, with rubber-tyred road wheels
Suspension: Torsion bar
Radio: Receive/transmit, telephone
Dimension: Length: 10.65m; Height: 2.3m; Width: 3.3m
Cruising range: 430km , or 600km with external tanks
Speed: Max road 57km/h
Fording depths: N/A
Main gun: 105mm Type 83 or 83-I rifled gun (48 rounds stored)
Rate of fire: 7 rounds/min
Elevation/depression: +18/-4.3 degree
Auxiliary weapon: One coaxial 7.62mm machine gun; one 12.7mm air-defence machine gun
Fire control: (Type 80/88) Type 37A light spot fire control system; or (Type 88A/B) JSFCS-212 ISFCS

Chinese Type 88 Tank Operators
Myanmar – 230+ Type-88B
People’s Republic of China – All secondary role training & reserve units

___________________________________________________________

By the way, as TanknutDave notes, the Type 85 (which was derived from the Type 80 later versions, just like the later type 88 version 88C) also uses a welded turret and the 125 mm smoothbore similar to the Al-Zarrar. You can see that the turret bustle is different than the Al-Zarrar.

I say 'similar' because there will be minor differences based on the hull mating for the smaller Type 59 Hull. Turret to hull traverse mechanism will be different and there will be differences on ammunition storage and electronic/optical components that mount on the much smaller cramped hull for the Type 59.

Type 85 PLA China
Chinese_ZTZ-96_MBT-1.jpg
 
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If Pakistan had acquired M1A1 the day of Zias death, Pakistan armor wouldve been a different beast .. but thats history.. i atill believe Alkahlid wouldve been history .. its better to have indigneous capability than acquired, JF17 is a prime example
 
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The Al Zarrar Turret (Turret only) is actually based on Type 88C later version turret. Of course the Hull is similar to the Type 59 (aka Soviet Type 54B).

The picture I posted earlier with a cast turret was a Type 88 early version (A) which was the last tank in PLA service to see the use of a 105mm gun, later tank versions (even Type 88 later versions, such as Type 88C) all use a 125mm smoothbore gun which was inspired by a foreign design.

Also - Type 88C uses a new welded turret identical to the Al-Zarrar, maybe that was the inspiration for AZ tank turret, as can be seen with the AZ turret minus ERA. Here is the complete writeup from TanknutDave, see where the 125mm has THREE tube sections aft of the fume extractor piece for the Type 88C welded turret, as opposed to the TWO tubes aft of the fume extractor for the 105mm (look at various images below).


The Chinese Type 88 Tank
View Our new and expanded Chinese Type 88 Tank page 0n Fighting-vehicles.com

Type 88 Tank



The Original Type 88 Entered Service with the Peoples Liberation Army in 1988
The Type 88 Description
The Type 88 is the Peoples Liberation Army designation for the Chinese Type 80-II Prototype, that was accepted into service in 1988 with some small modifications, namely a different bank of smoke grenade launchers and different external turret stowage racks. This was done so that ERA (FY Seriesl like that on the Type 59D) could be fitted to the turret front. It was the last tank produced for the PLA that was fitted with a 105mm calibre Main Gun. It has been upgraded several times into new Marks.

The Chinese Type 88 Tank

The Chinese Type 88 Tank – Click to enlarge
The Type 88 uses a 4 man crew, Driver sits front left of the hull, the Gunner is front left of the turret, the Commander sat behind him and the Loader is stationed on the right of the turret. The vehicle originally used the 105mm rifled Type 83 main gun. It could be identified by counting the sections of the thermal sleeve. The Type 83 gun has 2 sections in front of the fume extractor and a further 2 after it. The tank was also fitted by some form of composite armour across its hull front.


The Type 88 & Type 88B Type 83 Main Gun
The Chinese Type 88B Tank
The Chinese Type 88B Tank


The Chinese Type 88B Tank
In terms of tank upgrades, a Mark B would supersede a Mark A. However the Type 88B was implemented first in PLA service. It still retained the Type 83 Main Gun but had an improved Fire Control System (called 212) and could also be recognised by the protective shroud over the Gunners sight.

The Chinese Type 88A Tank

The Chinese Type 88A Tank
The Type 88A was the third upgrade for the vehicle and was most recognisable by its longer 105mm rifled main gun, the Type 83-I aka Type 83 Improved. It could be spotted by the front of the thermal sleeve having 3 sections between the bore and fume extractor.

The increased barrel length, aka calibre Length meant great range and round penetration over the old model as the round had a long distance to travel allowing the energy from the case charge to build up and push the round out harder.

A number of online publications wrongly state that the Type 88A has 12 smoke grenade launchers (6 either side of the turret). All images show that it retains the 2 pairs of banks each with x2 launchers either side of the turret. It was infact the Type 88C that had 12 launchers.

The Chinese Type 88C Tank

The Chinese Type 88C Tank
The Type 88 originated from the Type 80 prototype as did the Type 85. At some point in time all earlier Type 88 were upgraded with a new turret and hull modifications from a later model of the Type 85 Tank. The new turret had a 125mm smoothbore main gun and autoloader reducing the crew to 3. It retained the same Fire Control System as the 88B and later recieved a 1000hp engine.

The Chinese Type 88 Tank Specifications
Crew: 4
Weight: 39.5 tonne
Engine: 730hp 12150L-7BW diesel
Transmission: Mechanical, planetary
Track: Metallic, later variants have RMSh, with rubber-tyred road wheels
Suspension: Torsion bar
Radio: Receive/transmit, telephone
Dimension: Length: 10.65m; Height: 2.3m; Width: 3.3m
Cruising range: 430km , or 600km with external tanks
Speed: Max road 57km/h
Fording depths: N/A
Main gun: 105mm Type 83 or 83-I rifled gun (48 rounds stored)
Rate of fire: 7 rounds/min
Elevation/depression: +18/-4.3 degree
Auxiliary weapon: One coaxial 7.62mm machine gun; one 12.7mm air-defence machine gun
Fire control: (Type 80/88) Type 37A light spot fire control system; or (Type 88A/B) JSFCS-212 ISFCS

Chinese Type 88 Tank Operators
Myanmar – 230+ Type-88B
People’s Republic of China – All secondary role training & reserve units

___________________________________________________________

By the way, as TanknutDave notes, the Type 85 (which was derived from the Type 80 later versions, just like the later type 88 version 88C) also uses a welded turret and the 125 mm smoothbore similar to the Al-Zarrar. You can see that the turret bustle is different than the Al-Zarrar.

I say 'similar' because there will be minor differences based on the hull mating for the smaller Type 59 Hull. Turret to hull traverse mechanism will be different and there will be differences on ammunition storage and electronic/optical components that mount on the much smaller cramped hull for the Type 59.

Type 85 PLA China
Chinese_ZTZ-96_MBT-1.jpg
Again no, the turret remains the same, they only added additional armour.
 
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Have some shame and professional courtesy. We don't tell people off on this thread just because we don't like it. You must be new, maybe learn a thing or two on how things are done on this forum. If you don't have anything constructive to say, then refrain from showing all of us your lack of manners and intellect. This is a forum open to all people, I as a Pakistani don't have more right to post more than an Indian and vise versa
Stop opening threads and posting topics from Indian Websites little indian.
 
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Bangladesh has MBT 2000 in the inventory and VT5 light tank in ordered status.

VT5 light tank
989260f324752c1877794dbde65f7ba5.JPG



What would be the opinion (pluses and minuses) about VT5 (and for that matter VT4, see below) from Pakistani brothers?

VT4 is compared for capability with Russian Armata T-14 as well as US Abrams M1A2 version by Chinese experts but at a lot lower cost. It is the apparent successor to ZTZ-99.

VT4
98eecb24676b1983dc8b3d.jpg


While we're at it, what about the Iranian Karrar? Don't know much about this. Seems to be a T-72 modified hull with a new turret a la Merkava IV...

Karrar_%28Iranian_tank%29_01.jpg
 
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Please ignore that moron.

You and that indian Clown kissing and making out in public - what a great sight. Post a picture next time. :enjoy: Don't stick your nose where it does not belong.

Have some shame and professional courtesy. We don't tell people off on this thread just because we don't like it. You must be new, maybe learn a thing or two on how things are done on this forum. If you don't have anything constructive to say, then refrain from showing all of us your lack of manners and intellect. This is a forum open to all people, I as a Pakistani don't have more right to post more than an Indian and vise versa

Looks like it a national day of Clowns on PDF.
 
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Bangladesh has MBT 2000 in the inventory and VT5 light tank in ordered status.

VT5 light tank
989260f324752c1877794dbde65f7ba5.JPG



What would be the opinion (pluses and minuses) about VT5 (and for that matter VT4, see below) from Pakistani brothers?

VT4 is compared for capability with Russian Armata T-14 as well as US Abrams M1A2 version by Chinese experts but at a lot lower cost. It is the apparent successor to ZTZ-99.

VT4
98eecb24676b1983dc8b3d.jpg


While we're at it, what about the Iranian Karrar? Don't know much about this. Seems to be a T-72 modified hull with a new turret a la Merkava IV...

Karrar_%28Iranian_tank%29_01.jpg

PA used light tanks in Bangladesh/EP.

Your terrain indeed doesnt really warant a medium or heavy tank.

The karrar, we know next to nothing bout iranian frankenstiens. But to he honest I dont trust them when it comes to mil stuff.. too much propaganda.
 
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Maybe for china which has no tankable terrain or enemy that will use tanks against it.

You cant really use tanks against indians in AP/Tibet thus light tanks are good but for Pak its the other way around.
just to clarify a little bit, type 15 is a light weight mbt, It's not like most of the other light tank on market which puts a turret on a self propell gun chassis.
It doesn't come cheap at all, some rumor suggest that It's cost might be on par with type 99A.
they are deployed in Tibet, the main mission is to counter Indian thx to its perfect performances on plateau with its net work centric features, sharing enemy info with all other platform and can fire wvr and bvr ,acted in a way as a tip of the spear in the combined arm battalion.
 
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China has developed a new type of armor-piercing bullet for 105mm rifled gun that helps type 15 can destroy almost all major tanks in the world with one shot. Type 15 compact, flexible and suitable for many different terrain types, outstanding advantages compared to VT-4 and type-99
 
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China has developed a new type of armor-piercing bullet for 105mm rifled gun that helps type 15 can destroy almost all major tanks in the world with one shot
:angel: not sure about that, maybe this is an over statement, it has its own doctrine, not designed to stand still and 1v1 enemy heavy mbt, penetrate or not is another problem.
 
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Well you're certainly acting like a clown on this thread. Or maybe you haven't noticed it yet
You and that indian Clown kissing and making out in public - what a great sight. Post a picture next time. :enjoy: Don't stick your nose where it does not belong.



Looks like it a national day of Clowns on PDF.
 
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just to clarify a little bit, type 15 is a light weight mbt, It's not like most of the other light tank on market which puts a turret on a self propell gun chassis.
It doesn't come cheap at all, some rumor suggest that It's cost might be on par with type 99A.
they are deployed in Tibet, the main mission is to counter Indian thx to its perfect performances on plateau with its net work centric features, sharing enemy info with all other platform and can fire wvr and bvr ,acted in a way as a tip of the spear in the combined arm battalion.
And we took Type-59s/69s to FATA & stationed them on strategic peaks.

96E63168-04FE-4308-934F-CE38D04D4568.jpeg



The issue is Bangladeshi geography and its soil.. its a really really wet place with changing deltas.
We had stationed tanks in East Pak and faced this terrain issues while tanks like PT-76s etc were much better suited.

But again Im not much knowledgeable about the VT5s capability to if its suited for BD terrain.. im no expert.
 
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