Why Pak army not interested in largest wheeled IFV and APC

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@Horus
FNSS report in the clip below states that $500mil deal was signed for over 150 Pars III vehicles to a 'Friend and Brotherly country', that term is commonly used for Turkic countries or Pakistan. I remember you dropped a message last month that Pakistan was interested ?

Is this Pakistan ?

 

[Kompromat]

It sounds a little earlier than I was hoping but let's cross our fingers. From what I heard, the requirement is around 800 vehicles. If it is the same deal than its safe to assume that the manufacturing will even be transferred to HIT Taxila.

@Horus
FNSS report in the clip below states that $500mil deal was signed for over 150 Pars III vehicles to a 'Friend and Brotherly country', that term is commonly used for Turkic countries or Pakistan. I remember you dropped a message last month that Pakistan was interested ?

Is this Pakistan ?

 

[Gryphon]

It sounds a little earlier than I was hoping but let's cross our fingers. From what I heard, the requirement is around 800 vehicles. If it is the same deal than its safe to assume that the manufacturing will even be transferred to HIT Taxila.

Pakistan had to wait a year to arrange a USD 400 million loan for MILGEM corvettes. Where are those millions for Pars coming from ?

Italy donated hundreds of tracked M113 to Pak. I am not optimistic about getting wheeled ACV anytime soon.

 

[Kompromat]

PARS vehicles will be bought over an extended periods of time in order to soften the cost impact. Pakistan is also expected to buy a sizeable inventory of Cesar 155mm howitzers under a similar arrangement.

Pakistan had to wait a year to arrange a USD 400 million loan for MILGEM corvettes. Where are those millions for Pars coming from ?

Italy donated hundreds of tracked M113 to Pak. I am not optimistic about getting wheeled ACV anytime soon.

 

[Muhammad Omar]

We Sure need Pars with 2 Men Turret and 1 man turret

 

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It sounds a little earlier than I was hoping but let's cross our fingers. From what I heard, the requirement is around 800 vehicles. If it is the same deal than its safe to assume that the manufacturing will even be transferred to HIT Taxila.

A working model like FNSS-DefTech's AV-8 would be excellent. A Pakistani variant built, marketed and sold to neighbouring countries. Turkey/FNSS > Africa/Europe . Pakistan/HIT Taxila > Middle East . Malaysia/DefTech > Asia . Dreams

 

[Gryphon]

PARS vehicles will be bought over an extended periods of time in order to soften the cost impact. Pakistan is also expected to buy a sizeable inventory of Cesar 155mm howitzers under a similar arrangement.

According to @Combat-Master, 150 Pars III cost USD 500 million and if PA requirement is 800, this program will not materialize even if the purchases are made in batches (over a decade or more) and local assembly / production, spares and support,etc are included.

Other companies are selling at half the price. Regarding wheeled SPH, Denel and Yugoimport were competing. Care to detail Caesar's entry.

 

[Kompromat]

From what I understand, the Army is familiar with low rate acquisition to soften the cost impact. Just look at Al-Khalid acquisition. I think they might purchase 150 from Turkey and build the rest in Pakistan. The budget is touching 9 billion and is expected to reach double digits in a few years if the economy continues to grow. The Denel vs the Serbian howitzers haven't performed according to the specifications. The later broke down in the field. Army is inviting other manufacturers to bring their offerings including Cesar.

According to @Combat-Master, 150 Pars III cost USD 500 million and if PA requirement is 800, this program will not materialize even if the purchases are made in batches (over a decade or more) and local assembly / production, spares and support,etc are included.

Other companies are selling at half the price. Regarding wheeled SPH, Denel and Yugoimport were competing. Care to detail Caesar's entry.

 

[Bilal Khan (Quwa)]

From what I understand, the Army is familiar with low rate acquisition to soften the cost impact. Just look at Al-Khalid acquisition. I think they might purchase 150 from Turkey and build the rest in Pakistan. The budget is touching 9 billion and is expected to reach double digits in a few years if the economy continues to grow. The Denel vs the Serbian howitzers haven't performed according to the specifications. The later broke down in the field. Army is inviting other manufacturers to bring their offerings including Cesar.

Manufacturing locally enables the Army to engage in low-rate procurement. The likes of HIT and POF aren't businesses, they're not beholden to shareholders seeking positive profit trends. Yes, this has drawbacks in terms of R&D, but when it comes to production output, the Army can modernize itself at a decent pace without busting the wallet. For example, a $250 m production spend per year could get 15,000+ new rifles, 40-50 SPH, 40-50 8x8 AFVs and 20-30 MBTs.

 

[Gryphon]

From what I understand, the Army is familiar with low rate acquisition to soften the cost impact. Just look at Al-Khalid acquisition. I think they might purchase 150 from Turkey and build the rest in Pakistan. The budget is touching 9 billion and is expected to reach double digits in a few years if the economy continues to grow.

Since Musharraf left power, Al-Khalid program is almost stalled (look at the production rate after 2009).

They signed a production agreement with the Chinese in Dec 2012 for AK-1. Five years later, how many has HIT produced ? 21 according to last report, a unit was formed under XXXI Corps.

I will repeat again... the wheeled ACV program is doomed.

 

[Path-Finder]

PARS vehicles will be bought over an extended periods of time in order to soften the cost impact. Pakistan is also expected to buy a sizeable inventory of Cesar 155mm howitzers under a similar arrangement.

Cesar passed the trials? When did it arrive? Seems to be tangible info.

 

[Kompromat]

Not yet.

Cesar passed the trials? When did it arrive? Seems to be tangible info.

Low rate of AK production may have some rationale to it. With new Tanks and other vehicles coming on, the production is likely to increase.

Since Musharraf left power, Al-Khalid program is almost stalled (look at the production rate after 2009).

They signed a production agreement with the Chinese in Dec 2012 for AK-1. Five years later, how many has HIT produced ? 21 according to last report, a unit was formed under XXXI Corps.

I will repeat again... the wheeled ACV program is doomed.

 

[Zarvan]

PARS vehicles will be bought over an extended periods of time in order to soften the cost impact. Pakistan is also expected to buy a sizeable inventory of Cesar 155mm howitzers under a similar arrangement.

And any plans to get MRAP from Turkey with TOT we have Armed Forces and Police to equip when we would wake up on that. Turkey alone offers around 15 different MRAP and number is growing when we would go for at least 3 different MRAP with TOT from Turkey. @Horus

@Horus
FNSS report in the clip below states that $500mil deal was signed for over 150 Pars III vehicles to a 'Friend and Brotherly country', that term is commonly used for Turkic countries or Pakistan. I remember you dropped a message last month that Pakistan was interested ?

Is this Pakistan ?

Well I hope this proves to be the start we also need to get MRAP from Turkey and also IFV like Kaplan 30 and Tulpar. All with TOT we have lost several soldiers due to IED Pakistan needs MRAP for its Armed Forces and Police and in future wars IFV which can carry around 8 to 10 soldiers and can also provide firing cover along with Tanks are the future

 

[Path-Finder]

And any plans to get MRAP from Turkey with TOT we have Armed Forces and Police to equip when we would wake up on that. Turkey alone offers around 15 different MRAP and number is growing when we would go for at least 3 different MRAP with TOT from Turkey. @Horus


Well I hope this proves to be the start we also need to get MRAP from Turkey and also IFV like Kaplan 30 and Tulpar. All with TOT we have lost several soldiers due to IED Pakistan needs MRAP for its Armed Forces and Police and in future wars IFV which can carry around 8 to 10 soldiers and can also provide firing cover along with Tanks are the future

Hazrat there are numerous countries making MRAP and it is not specifically Turkey that makes them. MRAP are expendable so getting expensive ones are not going to be economically feasible! I hope that made sense.

Secondly there is a huge difference between IFV and MRAP. Both serve different purposes. Right Now MRAP are needed to deal with terrorist and patrolling areas. IFV unless we are going to war which is not likely.

 

[Zarvan]

Hazrat there are numerous countries making MRAP and it is not specifically Turkey that makes them. MRAP are expendable so getting expensive ones are not going to be economically feasible! I hope that made sense.

Secondly there is a huge difference between IFV and MRAP. Both serve different purposes. Right Now MRAP are needed to deal with terrorist and patrolling areas. IFV unless we are going to war which is not likely.

Getting from Turkey is the most easy thing for us we can negotiate money better than other countries. Yes MRAP are needed for terrorist areas we are loosing thousands due to use of crap vehicles even firing from AK-47 makes us loose soldiers what the hell is Armed Forces leadership thinking.