Lost opportunities of the Greek Defence Industry

[BHAN85]

Historically,Albania,FYROM and Bulgaria.

But since the end of the Cold War,the only one that we've had problems with is FYROM and only because of the naming dispute and everything that comes with it. Bulgaria has become a friend and neither Albania nor FYROM have an army strong enough to go to war with us.


You actually think nobody has thought about that here? The problem is that you can't spend less,when you have an aggressive neighbor who is stronger than you,arms like crazy and threatens you almost daily in public speeches and interviews.

One nuke, one SSBN, and one SLBM is enough for deterrence.

It works in North Korea to calm down Americans.

Imagine what would do it in Türkiye.

Besides, NATO is always babbling about how united they are, so it's not reason to worry.

Seriously, Iran Deal 2015 proved that money works better than weapons to avoid conflicts.

 

[Foinikas]

One nuke, one SSBN, and one SLBM is enough for deterrence.

It works in North Korea to calm down Americans.

Imagine what would do it in Türkiye.

Besides, NATO is always babbling about how united they are, so it's not reason to worry.

Seriously, Iran Deal 2015 proved that money works better than weapons to avoid conflicts.

Do you even know what's been going on?

 

[BHAN85]

Do you even know what's been going on?

I know threats of Americans against NK are greater than threats of Turkiye against Greece.

And I know one single nuke and ICBM is enough to calm down such potential aggressor.

But develop own nukes/icbm is not useful to bribe corrupt politicians, like buy expensive foreign weapons / pieces with borrowed money, do you even what's been going on about that or you're completely brainwashed by authorities fallacies?

You must be happy as you state and gov steal your people money to buy useless weapons and keep common people in misery.

 

[Foinikas]

You must be happy as you state and gov steal your people money to buy useless weapons and keep common people in misery.

Oh ok,let's just let Erdogan take what he wants. Disarm the country and give half the Aegean to Turkey. No problem.

But develop own nukes/icbm is not useful to bribe corrupt politicians, like buy expensive foreign weapons / pieces with borrowed money, do you even what's been going on about that or you're completely brainwashed by authorities fallacies?

Who the f is gonna develop nukes or who is gonna hand us nukes as if they are candy? You mentioned nukes as if everyone can have them easily.

 

[VCheng]

@Foinikas - not too much on the overall root causes of why the Greek military did not get into overall adoption and why knowing the economic conditions these avenues were not explored further

Agree with the above. Being able to design military platforms is just one step in a whole series of requirements for a viable defense industry, including the economic foundations need to support it all.

 

[PeterboroughAli]

@Foinikas - not too much on the overall root causes of why the Greek military did not get into overall adoption and why knowing the economic conditions these avenues were not explored further

Greece did run into a tricky spot with there economy

 

[Foinikas]

Agree with the above. Being able to design military platforms is just one step in a whole series of requirements for a viable defense industry, including the economic foundations need to support it all.

In the '80s and '90s,there was enough money for at least some of these projects. But there was no political will. Besides,in the late '90s there was a lot of bribing PASOK ministers and government officials by Russian and German companies...

 

[VCheng]

In the '80s and '90s,there was enough money for at least some of these projects. But there was no political will. Besides,in the late '90s there was a lot of bribing PASOK ministers and government officials by Russian and German companies...

Yes, but then again, political will, sustained across changes of government, is one of the necessary ingredients.

 

[BHAN85]

Oh ok,let's just let Erdogan take what he wants. Disarm the country and give half the Aegean to Turkey. No problem.


Who the f is gonna develop nukes or who is gonna hand us nukes as if they are candy? You mentioned nukes as if everyone can have them easily.

I guess North Korea has more means than Greece.



Or maybe their politicians are more sovereign and less corrupts than Greeks.

The same Iran, Iran was almost near an American attack several times, and they tame the American beast with own nuclear developments with nobody help. And those were real threats, it wasn't like Erdogan bluffs.

Western military non-nuclear expensive weapons are just a way to fast easy robbing. And we'll see if it's useful for something when real problems will arrive. Those weapons are designed to attack goatfckers weak shtholes, and maybe it wont have an opportunity against a real well armed enemy.

 

[VCheng]

I guess North Korea has more means than Greece.

But Greeks are not starving. North Korean are. It is just a matter of national priorities.

 

[BHAN85]

But Greeks are not starving. North Korean are. It is just a matter of national priorities.

They are angry, so they must have some reasons.

Former Greek Finance Minister Varoufakis attacked in central Athens

Varoufakis, leader of DiEM25 party, blamed the assault on ‘thugs.’

www.politico.eu

Maybe they should develop ICBM and point it to Frankfurt ECB headquarters instead Türkiye, to remove debts and chains.

 

[Foinikas]

Yes, but then again, political will, sustained across changes of government, is one of the necessary ingredients.

Ah,but we've had PASOK ruling from 1981 until 2004,only with a 2 or 2,5 years break of New Democracy rule. Then 2004-2008 New Democracy rule and as soon as PASOK took power again in 2009,the crisis started. Suddenly,no money.

In the 2010s,army and government declare a contest about a new "national rifle" to replace the G3. A gunsmith's two prototypes come out as the top choices,the contest suddenly freezes,there are no news about it,the Army doesn't say anything. The man has the police come to this store and consficate the rifles. We're back at the G3 and the whole "national rifle" program stops.

They are angry, so they must have some reasons.

Former Greek Finance Minister Varoufakis attacked in central Athens

Varoufakis, leader of DiEM25 party, blamed the assault on ‘thugs.’

www.politico.eu

Maybe they should develop ICBM and point it to Frankfurt ECB headquarters instead Türkiye, to remove debts and chains.

Why are you posting about Varoufakis? I mean,I know you're some leftist liberal guy,but Varoufakis?

 

[VCheng]

They are angry, so they must have some reasons.

There are different ways of setting national priorities. Some use emotions, some use logic.

Ah,but we've had PASOK ruling from 1981 until 2004,only with a 2 or 2,5 years break of New Democracy rule. Then 2004-2008 New Democracy rule and as soon as PASOK took power again in 2009,the crisis started. Suddenly,no money.

In the 2010s,army and government declare a contest about a new "national rifle" to replace the G3. A gunsmith's two prototypes come out as the top choices,the contest suddenly freezes,there are no news about it,the Army doesn't say anything. The man has the police come to this store and consficate the rifles. We're back at the G3 and the whole "national rifle" program stops.

Of course, national integrity above a certain level and corruption below a certain level are also part of the requirements.

 

[Foinikas]

Of course, national integrity above a certain level and corruption below a certain level are also part of the requirements.

Definitely!

 

[Trisolaran]

If Greece had produced its own weapons and was an independent state in the region
I don't think France, Israel and USA would be as pro-Greek states as they are today.
I think Greece sacrificed its defense industry in exchange for the support of international powers.
Turkey was dependent on the West in many areas, especially in the field of defense inustry in the 1990s (of course, we cannot say that we are fully independent today)
And the western states were acting neutral in the Greece-Turkey crisis's, as they made various gains through our country.
As these gains disappear, they became more pro-Greek, and if Greece followed a policy similar to that Turkey followed in 2000s, it could face similar problems in the next decade.