Why Arabs lost all its wars to Israel despite outnumbering Israel in weapons and manpower?

[Beny Karachun]

At that time, the Israeli air force had the capability to attack cairo at will. The Egyptians wanted to be able to attack Tel Aviv. The only soviet aircraft that could do that was the Tu-22. The Russians wouldn't give that, or anything else with that range,

The mig was a sort range interceptor.

A shell fired from a t-62, from Egypt, couldn't reach Tel Aviv.

This lack of assistance from the Soviets was the reason for the cancellation of the Egyptian/Soviet defence treaty.

I am simply stating what were the views, and reasons, of Sadat.

No, it didn't, Israel could reach Cairo as much as the Arabs could, they even could reach Israel in 1948, how come they cant reach us in 1973?

MiG is a fighter, not interceptor.

T62 was a better tank in overall than ours, equipped with more modern technology such as night vision.

the Russians assisted the Egyptians way more.
A Tu16 could easily reach and destroy a large area of Tel Aviv.

 

[Tiger Genie]

That is if you base the rate of success on the ToT they have received since than ..for free, plus money, plus weapons.. I am just saying things like they were in the past and are now..

No I am not basing it on ToT or aid money. Just their own brain work

 

[Ceylal]

No. Sadat addressed this point. He said that Russia's help was conditional, while the US's help was unconditional.

For example, the Egyptians wanted attack aircraft so they could attack Israel just as the Israelis were attacking Egypt pre war. They wanted the tu-22 bomber. The Russians refused, whereas the US had no hesitation in giving Israel similar weapons.

Let be real here..Sadat obtained all the weapons he needed including the Tupolev. The only condition is that Egypt had to pay for it. Algeria pick up the tab and wrote a blank check to the Soviet Union. Yugoslavia sent them 100 tanks fuelled and armed , as well as Lybia who put her entire arsenal at Egypt disposal.
The US has never given Israel bombers, the only thing he gave them was the maverick anti tank,missile that Israel needed badly. Everything the US gave them was equivalent to what the Soviet furnished the Egyptians.

There was a fundamental political difference between Egypt and Russian aims. The Russians were afraid of being dragged into a war with the US, and wanted a peaceful settlement. For Egypt, that meant negotiating from a losers status; a peace deal would give them nothing. To get into a position of strength, they had to change the military situation. This is why Russia would give Egypt defensive weaponry, not offensive. This difference was the reason why Sadat cancelled his defense treaty with Russia before the war.

That is not totally true! Sadat had two military plans. One for his army to execute which was limited in scope, and another he presented to the Arab states for support that comprise the liberation of the Sinai and Palestine. Sadat has never wanted to go further than the Canal of Suez. I am saying that, because from the Algerian officers that participated in the war with Egyptians told in their own words that they waited 48 hrs after their arrival to be authorized to join the front and for the Algerian pilot to fly combat mission. By that time Sharon and his tank brigade were near the deversoir and the 2nd and the 3rd Egyptian armies to be surrendered by the IDF. Sadat was the one who defeated the Egyptian army, not Israel. Israel was running on empty.

Despite the cancellation, Russia still helped Egypt during and after the war, although it had no obligation to do so. The US's help to Israel was a totally different quantum.

I agree with you partially. Israel, despite the US help didn't get anything that tilted the war to their favor. In today's times, the US help is of different quantum, but not then...It was more the French than the US.

 

[Amun]

Let be real here..Sadat obtained all the weapons he needed including the Tupolev. The only condition is that Egypt had to pay for it. Algeria pick up the tab and wrote a blank check to the Soviet Union. Yugoslavia sent them 100 tanks fuelled and armed , as well as Lybia who put her entire arsenal at Egypt disposal.
The US has never given Israel bombers, the only thing he gave them was the maverick anti tank,missile that Israel needed badly. Everything the US gave them was equivalent to what the Soviet furnished the Egyptians.



That is not totally true! Sadat had two military plans. One for his army to execute which was limited in scope, and another he presented to the Arab states for support that comprise the liberation of the Sinai and Palestine. Sadat has never wanted to go further than the Canal of Suez. I am saying that, because from the Algerian officers that participated in the war with Egyptians told in their own words that they waited 48 hrs after their arrival to be authorized to join the front and for the Algerian pilot to fly combat mission. By that time Sharon and his tank brigade were near the deversoir and the 2nd and the 3rd Egyptian armies to be surrendered by the IDF. Sadat was the one who defeated the Egyptian army, not Israel. Israel was running on empty.



I agree with you partially. Israel, despite the US help didn't get anything that tilted the war to their favor. In today's times, the US help is of different quantum, but not then...It was more the French than the US.

Do you ever write something worth reading....

 

[Ceylal]

Do you ever write something worth reading....

I can't write about the Egyptian army and her officers, it's too painful and too embarrassing..".We have a proverb in Algeria, that goes like this...You need to thank the one who took you to the souk and brought you back home so you won't get lost..."

and this fact is true to this day..You have an army of incapables! Look the real fucking soldiers that kept Ariel Sharon from owning your @sses. They travelled 4000 kms , and found your officers working for with the IDF. Despite the honorless officers of your great paper army, they managed to show Ariel who is the big D---K!

I will comeback of field pictures showing Ariel"s tank brigade remnants spread over a wide area near the deversoir..

Bla Bla Bla Bla Bla to you and to the donkey that thanked your post!

 

[MICA]

I can't write about the Egyptian army and her officers, it's too painful and too embarrassing..".We have a proverb in Algeria, that goes like this...You need to thank the one who took you to the souk and brought you back home so you won't get lost..."

and this fact is true to this day..You have an army of incapables! Look the real fucking soldiers that kept Ariel Sharon from owning your @sses. They travelled 4000 kms , and found your officers working for with the IDF. Despite the honorless officers of your great paper army, they managed to show Ariel who is the big D---K!
View attachment 311269 View attachment 311270
I will comeback of field pictures showing Ariel"s tank brigade remnants spread over a wide area near the deversoir..

Bla Bla Bla Bla Bla to you and to the donkey that thanked your post!

you can suck my donkey

 

[Ceylal]

you can suck my donkey

Donkey's are to be mounted..like Israel,the Sauds, and the houthis are mounting you now...

 

[The SC]

I can't write about the Egyptian army and her officers, it's too painful and too embarrassing..".We have a proverb in Algeria, that goes like this...You need to thank the one who took you to the souk and brought you back home so you won't get lost..."

and this fact is true to this day..You have an army of incapables! Look the real fucking soldiers that kept Ariel Sharon from owning your @sses. They travelled 4000 kms , and found your officers working for with the IDF. Despite the honorless officers of your great paper army, they managed to show Ariel who is the big D---K!
View attachment 311269 View attachment 311270
I will comeback of field pictures showing Ariel"s tank brigade remnants spread over a wide area near the deversoir..

Bla Bla Bla Bla Bla to you and to the donkey that thanked your post!

It is true that the Algerian troops and commandos fought valiantely in the deversoir, but How about the Egyptians in Ismaelia, mostly police and civilians!? The Algerian brigade was a support brigade to the Egyptians...
The Second Egyptian army has never been surrounded, actually it has surrounded Sharon brigades who were trying to encircle the 3rd army.. Sharon himself said after the war that he did not now at that time and place who was surrounding whom..

 

[MICA]

It is true that the Algerian troops and commandos fought valiantely in the deversoir, but How about the Egyptians in Ismaelia, mostly police and civilians!? The Algerian brigade was a support brigade to the Egyptians...
The Second Egyptian army has never been surrounded, actually it has surrounded Sharon brigades who were trying to encircle the 3rd army.. Sharon himself said after the war that he did not now at that time and place who was surrounding whom..

Let him write a new and fake history for his army on our shoulders , pretty much all the forum members know this guy on particular write nonsense posts that doesn't worth a minute of reading ..... no hate for algeria though there must be another good guys there indeed

 

[Mahmoud_EGY]

By that time Sharon and his tank brigade were near the deversoir and the 2nd and the 3rd Egyptian armies to be surrendered by the IDF

QUOTE]
at least that is new the 2nd and 3rd armies surrounded ? good one

It is true that the Algerian troops and commandos fought valiantely in the deversoir, but How about the Egyptians in Ismaelia, mostly police and civilians!? The Algerian brigade was a support brigade to the Egyptians...
The Second Egyptian army has never been surrounded, actually it has surrounded Sharon brigades who were trying to encircle the 3rd army.. Sharon himself said after the war that he did not now at that time and place who was surrounding whom..

let him talk he like many algrians want to think they are important they always feel small when they look at Egypt

I said these words many times and I will never get tired of repeating them again
first of all I will speak about the Egyptian front only
most of you know after the 6 days war our army suffered many losses in both manpower and tanks jets etc so under pressure from the people to retake occupied Sinai as fast as they can our armed forces planed for war realistically with what they had we did not at the time have a good enough air force to cover our armies deep into Sinai and no mobile air defense so the plan was to cross the canal destroy the barliv line which they said the strongest in history wait for the isreali counter attack and defend against it inflicting heavy losses on the isrealis until we can retake Sinai by negotiations from a position of power our armed forces did that everything was going according to plan until pressure from Syria and the soviet untion made us advance outside the cover of our air defense to help the Syrians things were not going well there we lost many men and that led to isrealis crossing the canal but they could not do anything after crossing they attacked the city of suez they failed they attacked the city of ismalia they failed time and manpower are on our side by that time isreali losses were so big that they couldn't stand this for long if the continued they could never match our manpower

 

[Archie]

it's mainly due to in adequate training

even today The Arabs might have state of art technology and numerical superiority
but theirs balls are held in American pockets
they can't fight a war against Iran
let alone Israel

 

[jamal18]

I can't write about the Egyptian army and her officers, it's too painful and too embarrassing..".We have a proverb in Algeria, that goes like this...You need to thank the one who took you to the souk and brought you back home so you won't get lost..."

and this fact is true to this day..You have an army of incapables! Look the real fucking soldiers that kept Ariel Sharon from owning your @sses. They travelled 4000 kms , and found your officers working for with the IDF. Despite the honorless officers of your great paper army, they managed to show Ariel who is the big D---K!
View attachment 311269 View attachment 311270
I will comeback of field pictures showing Ariel"s tank brigade remnants spread over a wide area near the deversoir..

Bla Bla Bla Bla Bla to you and to the donkey that thanked your post!

Guys, I don't want to interfere in this rich cultural exchange, but it is simply a matter of fact that the Egyptian army performed with great ability and competence. For example, the British general I mentioned earlier rated Egyptian special forces better then their Israeli counterparts.

As for the figures, I believe the Egyptians beat the Israelis in 1973. What saved the Israelis and turned the tide was endless American support.

I am not a fan of anybody, just stating the facts.

 

[Amun]

it's mainly due to in adequate training

even today The Arabs might have state of art technology and numerical superiority
but theirs balls are held in American pockets
they can't fight a war against Iran
let alone Israel

Do you understand or even read English.....try some pages before in this thread and you will know much more about that.....and if you want your plans don't crash over and over again...you can send some of your technicians to Egypt to know the know how and the discipline required for good maintenance.

Guys, I don't want to interfere in this rich cultural exchange, but it is simply a matter of fact that the Egyptian army performed with great ability and competence. For example, the British general I mentioned earlier rated Egyptian special forces better then their Israeli counterparts.

As for the figures, I believe the Egyptians beat the Israelis in 1973. What saved the Israelis and turned the tide was endless American support.

I am not a fan of anybody, just stating the facts.

That Algerian guy no one in the forum take him seriously .... I'm sure if people try to read more about Ramadan-October-Youm Kepour war they will end with that conclusion or even they will know how much was the Egyptians are capable .

 

[Ceylal]

That Algerian guy no one in the forum take him seriously .... I'm sure if people try to read more about Ramadan-October-Youm Kepour war they will end with that conclusion or even they will know how much was the Egyptians are capable .

It has been 33 years since the October/Yom kippur war, and yet you can't even discuss this subject with objectivity. Nobody denies that crossing the Suez Canal by the Egyptian army was a text book written with indelible ink. We are talking about what matter the most, THE END RESULTS.
Two of your armies were surrounded and supplies were cut off.
Sinai is still out of your reach and escape to any government control, since Israel and the US have to OK any Egyptian troop movements .
Egypt was compensated with $ 1B to be a good submissive child of the middle east
Israel was REWARDED $3B plus , to let Egypt wipe her tears after her behind was ripped off..
Because of Sadat:
Egypt has been handcuffed for eternity, Palestine lost, as well as the Golan for the Syrian.

If you and some of the chiots that thank and follow your postings, think the 73 war was a win for the Egyptian Army, well the exact definition of the verb WIN has changed since the advent of internet and social media.

As for the figures, I believe the Egyptians beat the Israelis in 1973. What saved the Israelis and turned the tide was endless American support.
.

They won a battle, the crossing of the canal, but they lost the war and losses not just to Egypt, but the Palestinien and to the the Syrians. They lied to Syria, they lied to every country who helped them. And Shazly was used as a patsy to get the support that Egypt needed.
It has been 43 years since 73. At least we can talk about it openly and put the real truth forward and learn for the mistakes!

 

[jamal18]

It has been 33 years since the October/Yom kippur war, and yet you can't even discuss this subject with objectivity. Nobody denies that crossing the Suez Canal by the Egyptian army was a text book written with indelible ink. We are talking about what matter the most, THE END RESULTS.
Two of your armies were surrounded and supplies were cut off.
Sinai is still out of your reach and escape to any government control, since Israel and the US have to OK any Egyptian troop movements .
Egypt was compensated with $ 1B to be a good submissive child of the middle east
Israel was REWARDED $3B plus , to let Egypt wipe her tears after her behind was ripped off..
Because of Sadat:
Egypt has been handcuffed for eternity, Palestine lost, as well as the Golan for the Syrian.

If you and some of the chiots that thank and follow your postings, think the 73 war was a win for the Egyptian Army, well the exact definition of the verb WIN has changed since the advent of internet and social media.

My friend, read my post. The war was a win for Egypt but unlimited American support saved Israel. The result was a defeat for Egypt.

Victory is the achievement of the aim. The aim was to reassert Egyptian sovereignty over the Sinai, and this was not achieved; Gamasy himself states that in the book.

The war proved that the US will support Israel unconditionally and with unlimited resources. This makes an Egyptian/Arab victory technically impossible. Sadat realized that Egypt simply had to come to terms with that and effectively abandoned the struggle against Israel. He moved Egypt into the US/Zionist camp, for large amounts of American money. It is America's whore. Where it remains today with the present government. The morsi government would have changed that, this is why the death of democracy in Egypt received no complaints from the 'liberal democratic' west.