Which stop gap fighter would you prefer for TurAF?

[Khagan1923]

- F-15SE is a non-existent project that would cost billions to develop to a finished product and cost a shit ton to produce. There hasn't been any work done on it for over a decade and to finish it would costs dozens of billions. Nor would you get a green light from congress to aquire the project.
- EA-18G Growler is a EW Aircraft meant to be used together with F/A-18s to clear hostile Airspace. It is not meant for Air-Air combat nor Air-Surface combat. Nor does the US sell it to anyone, if Turkey won't get its F-35 neither will it get Growlers.
- Eurofighter has a low readiness rate, is primarly a Air to Air fighter, costs too much for what you get and Germany would block any sale to Turkey just like it is blocking sales to Saudi Arabia and the UAE at the moment.
- F16 Block 70 upgrade packages could be ordered from Lockheed and put together by TAI in Turkey.

Obvious choice here is if we can't get our F-35:

1. F-15EX/Advanced+F-16V Block 70 upgrade packages for part of the F-16 Fleet.
2. Only F-15EX
3. F/A-18 Block III + IF POSSIBLE (very unlikely) E/A-18G
4. F-16V Block 70 upgrade packages.
5. Rafael
6. Eurofighter/Gripen

Just to add, you forgot to add a Klingon Bird of Prey since this one is as realistic for the TAF as the F-15X or Super Hornet.

I guess you work for the State Department? How do you know what is realistic is and what not? Please tell me.


@cabatli_53 bu herif gelip habire yok türkiye bunu yapamaz yok siz manyak siniz diye diye dayak yemeyi cok seviyor herhalde?

 

[Armchair]

Turks are a proud nation. I doubt after the F-35 insult they will run back to the US and ask for F-16s. That would really hurt their national psyche.

Given the present Idlib standoff, I doubt they will go for a Russian fighter.

Given the frosty and outright nasty relations with Europe, one would doubt them going for any Eurocanard, unless its the Gripen, in which case we return back to going back to Uncle Sam. Again a foolish move.

There really only is one realistic and sensible option, that being the JF-17.

 

[Baybars Han]

With Erdoğan we know he will pick the worst option so no need to speculate, getting the s-400 was the worst decision, F-35 is far more capable and more effective, its a force multiplier.

However, the best decision would be to.

- use the s-400 until we manage to make our own air defense and until hisar-a and hisar-o is fully integrated and hisar-u has matured and feasible to use. I would say atleast 5 years.

Don't buy any stop gap plane and put more resources into research subsystems for our MMU and f-16 and increase payloads of drones.

After this point we could find a solution to send s-400 Cyprus or sell it to a third party or something. By that time F-35 will be even more matured and most software problems gone. After we get rid of s-400, USA will have no excuses not to sell F-35. We will work on our MMU at the same time.

 

[Ansu fati]

There’s no need for new fighters it’s better to focus on domestic programs(TF-X Hürjet)
Of all fighters listed only the F-16 is the most logical realistic option because all other platforms would be new for TuAF pilots and it would take a lot of time until they get used to it
Ozgur program could only be applied on F-16 block 30 whereas for F-16 block 50/52 TuAF needs to go to LM for viper upgrade(maybe there could be order for 40 new F-16V that will replace F-4s but personally my opinion is that it won’t be necessary)
Large fleet of Akinci/Aksungur drones are more than enough until TF-X is ready although I think F-35s are coming in 5 years after turkish long range SAM is ready(S400 “issue” will be solved easily)

 

[Bismarck]

No "Other" option, eh?

You seem too biased towards the F-15, a fighter from the 60's that the US keeps repackaging for a quick buck.

We don't need a stop-gap fighter because there's NO GAP.

Our UCAVs like Anka and TB-2 are so successful that they're making headlines all over the world. They've reduced our dependence on the F-16 by a factor of at least 50%. With the introduction of Akinci, Aksungur, MIUS, swarm drones and others that ratio will continue to rise. That said, we're more than capable of modernizing our F-16s with systems like Ozgur and SPEWS and keeping them air-worthy until the Hurjet rolls out and bridges our Air Force on to the TF-X by mid 2030.

No need to buy any foreign fighters when we're getting ready to EXPORT our own!!!

Fighting in Syria a non existing or lets say a broken army, is one thing. Another story is fighting a modern, powerful and intact army.

 

[Ansu fati]

Fighting in Syria a non existing or lets say a broken army, is one thing. Another story is fighting a modern, powerful and intact army.

Egyptian army isn’t modern or powerful army neither is the greek one
Only israel qualifies in your description but they have other things to worry about(iran and its proxies)

 

[Bismarck]

As you can see in S.A, to have modern equipment is not everything. You should know how to handle it.

 

[Bismarck]

Egyptian army isn’t modern or powerful army neither is the greek one
Only israel qualifies in your description but they have other things to worry about(iran and its proxies)

I dont mention Egyptian,but to think they are weak would be a great mistake. Isreal is indeed powerful, also Iran should not be understimate.

 

[cabatli_53]

- F-15SE is a non-existent project that would cost billions to develop to a finished product and cost a shit ton to produce. There hasn't been any work done on it for over a decade and to finish it would costs dozens of billions. Nor would you get a green light from congress to aquire the project.
- EA-18G Growler is a EW Aircraft meant to be used together with F/A-18s to clear hostile Airspace. It is not meant for Air-Air combat nor Air-Surface combat. Nor does the US sell it to anyone, if Turkey won't get its F-35 neither will it get Growlers.
- Eurofighter has a low readiness rate, is primarly a Air to Air fighter, costs too much for what you get and Germany would block any sale to Turkey just like it is blocking sales to Saudi Arabia and the UAE at the moment.
- F16 Block 70 upgrade packages could be ordered from Lockheed and put together by TAI in Turkey.

Obvious choice here is if we can't get our F-35:

1. F-15EX/Advanced+F-16V Block 70 upgrade packages for part of the F-16 Fleet.
2. Only F-15EX
3. F/A-18 Block III + IF POSSIBLE (very unlikely) E/A-18G
4. F-16V Block 70 upgrade packages.
5. Rafael
6. Eurofighter/Gripen



I guess you work for the State Department? How do you know what is realistic is and what not? Please tell me.


@cabatli_53 bu herif gelip habire yok türkiye bunu yapamaz yok siz manyak siniz diye diye dayak yemeyi cok seviyor herhalde?

Feel free to beat him with words bro.

 

[Ansu fati]

I dont mention Egyptian,but to think they are weak would be a great mistake. Isreal is indeed powerful, also Iran should not be understimate.

Iran is frenemy but not a country that would go into war with Turkey(most likely turkish-iranian war won’t happen ever) Israel is frenemy too but they have never seen Turkey as a country whom they would go into war actually Israel still sees Egypt as the most likely candidate for war even though now their relations are extremely well
I am not underestimating Greece(few months ago during navy exercise their frigate/other ship suffered failure such country certainly doesn’t have plans for war in 2018 turkish warship rammed into greek ship and there was no reaction from greeks) but they won’t start war with Turkey because of obvious geographical limitations
armenia is a joke so we can conclude that all of these countries(armenia greece egypt under sisi) who are potential candidates for war are too weak to engage Turkey

 

[Bismarck]

Iran is frenemy but not a country that would go into war with Turkey(most likely turkish-iranian war won’t happen ever) Israel is frenemy too but they have never seen Turkey as a country whom they would go into war actually Israel still sees Egypt as the most likely candidate for war even though now their relations are extremely well
I am not underestimating Greece(few months ago during navy exercise their frigate/other ship suffered failure such country certainly doesn’t have plans for war in 2018 turkish warship rammed into greek ship and there was no reaction from greeks) but they won’t start war with Turkey because of obvious geographical limitations
armenia is a joke so we can conclude that all of these countries(armenia greece egypt under sisi) who are potential candidates for war are too weak to engage Turkey

A modern army should be prepared for all kind of scenarios. Including the unlikly ones.

Your big weakness is (still) your arrogance.

 

[ÇölKaplanı]

Personally I am okay with the cost per hour and maintenance issues of Eurofighter since we wouldn't buy about 100s of those. I don't think F/A-18 E/F and Growler makes sense since TuAF already chose F-16s over F-18s before.
Our choices are:

• Buying about 30-40 second hand Eurofighter tranche 1s or giving new orders for tranche 3s
• F-15EX + ''Özgür'' modernisation of F-16s
• Additional F-16V Block 70 purchase

I think we should all think of the requirements before. TuAF needs an twin-engine air superiority fighter that can also carry heavy weapon loads. Obviously this can give an idea to all of us. So, we either buy F-15s or Eurofighter Tranche 3s.

 

[Avicenna]

Political decision as much as a military one.

Must reduce reliance on the US (although this is difficult considering Uncle Sam's fingerprints on nearly everything)

Eurofighter for a stop gap buy.

This gives some leeway for the TFX to take shape in due time.

The problem is though, no matter the Western source, I doubt any are a well wisher for Turkey.

 

[T-123456]

@Vord old man,if you are such a mature person then,why the provocations?
Why you making fun of people?
Either act like you supposed to be acting or face the same treatment,old man
Since you are such a good chess player,im sure you'll get it.
Btw,i agree with your stance on the subject.

 

[Mithridates]

forget about F-35 and develop the TFX , HUTJET and MIUS


-- 163 CCIP modernized F-16 and 29 F-16 block50+ can be remain in service until 2035
-- Aselsan develops F-16 AESA Radar
-- TURAF can use HURJET also ANKA-S , AKSUNGUR and AKINCI UCAVs ( to carry MAM-L , MIZRAK , KGK , HGK , LGK , TEBER , KUZGUN , SOM , BOZDOGAN , GOKDOGAN )
-- HISAR , SIPER and S400 Air Defense Systems can protect Turkish Airspace against any Fighter Jets in the region

and without F-35 , still Turkish Armed Forces will have great attack capability .... We can use 280-1.000 km KHAN/BORA Ballistic Missiles , 300 km SOM air launched Cruise Missile , and 800 km GEZGIN land/naval based Cruise Missiles against Greece,Egypt,Israel and Iran in the region

until the TFX , Turkish Airforce can survive without F-35s


also We can use MIUS on TCG ANADOLU

lol bruh... you just ruined the existential purpose of the drone. and BTW why the splitter plate designed that way?? it prevents the high pressure air to flow safely beneath inlet without entering in it.