Whats Wrong with ISPR Press release emphasizing "BETTER GOVERNANCE" from Political Leadership

[Paksanity]

That is sadly true, but it is only the consequence of mistakes past. And we are still adamant on continuing to make them.

No sir, it is not the past mistake. It is a mistake which is being committed right now as we speak! NAP was agreed by every single stakeholder. Responsibilities were clearly laid out. What will be done was agreed upon. We swore on the dead bodies of those innocent kids that we will root out terrorism and strike at its roots, its finances, its breeding grounds, just about everything that feeds it. Areas of responsibility were clear. Military will do the fighting. Intelligence will be led by military, shared by civil. Military will provide security while government will rebuild quickly. People of FATA must taste normal life under civillian rule. Government will cut finances of terorrists. Regulate seminaries. Crackdown on hate speech. What happened then? Why fail your soldiers who fought and died for nation? And this is happening right now as we speak. Not a past mistake by any stretch of imagination.

 

[VCheng]

No sir, it is not the past mistake. It is a mistake which is being committed right now as we speak! NAP was agreed by every single stakeholder. Responsibilities were clearly laid out. What will be done was agreed upon. We swore on the dead bodies of those innocent kids that we will root out terrorism and strike at its roots, its finances, its breeding grounds, just about everything that feeds it. Areas of responsibility were clear. Military will do the fighting. Intelligence will be led by military, shared by civil. Military will provide security while government will rebuild quickly. People of FATA must taste normal life under civillian rule. Government will cut finances of terorrists. Regulate seminaries. Crackdown on hate speech. What happened then? Why fail your soldiers who fought and died for nation? And this is happening right now as we speak. Not a past mistake by any stretch of imagination.

The present failures of government, that you correctly point out, have their roots in the past mistakes in the destruction of civil institutions in which the repeated Martial Law impositions had a large role to play.

 

[Paksanity]

Who has stopped them from performing here? May be, just may be, the repeated disruptions of the due process caused by Martial Law had something to do with it? May be?

Err....There has not been any threat of Martial Law for 8 consecutive years now. Military has made it amply clear to everyone. That is a reasonably long time to put country on right track.

 

[saiyan0321]

Until we get a "neutral" party who can come to the rescue whenever shit happens, army is going to do that job...

Just like it is 1st respondent to earthquakes, floods and other atrocities...it also has taken up the role of being 1st respondent to BS people calling themselves leaders!

This..
The common man just wants a solution to his problem. He doesn't give a damn about democracy nor the constitution... The civilian govt is simply unable to aid him due to incompetence. I mean whenever the country suffers from crisis its the army that comes to the rescue.

Remember a few years ago the doctors were at strike against the govt policies and the people were dying and the army came to the rescue as they sent their medical corp to civilian hospitals...

Heck in this factory collapse the govt was helpless and the army was called in where they sent their engineers with equipment to dig the people out. The media is reporting army relief effort in a factory collapse. If the civilian govt can't even handle a factory collapse then perhaps there is no need for them bcz of they fail here then what will they do during more serious crisis.

The common sees the army only and questions the position of the civilian govt and sees them as incompetent and corrupt which you can't believe on the common man. This is how martial law come. In our entire history not eve. Once did a martial law come and the people said we don't want it.. The people always supported it and heck the people were calling fornit during kiyani.

Army will stop interfering if the civilian govt becomes competent bcz the people will start to look at the civilian govt. The civilian govt shows incompetence which prompts the people to ask for check and balance and the army provides that. The nab is corrupt, the courts are corrupt and the process is a failure and those that can solve all this are corrupt so what are the people supposed to do but look at saviours?

The army is on the right here... I am not losing 60000+ people again bcz the civilian administration was too corrupt and incompetent and we should all stay quite bcz its not written in the law for the parliament to be checked....

The constitution can only be amended in the Parliament and why would they make a law that can put check and balance on them... They will much sooner make a law claiming themselves as kings before they make a law that makes them answerable.

 

[VCheng]

Err....There has not been any threat of Martial Law for 8 consecutive years now. Military has made it amply clear to everyone. That is a reasonably long time to put country on right track.

How long ago was the soft coup dharna drama? The same mistakes are being done even now. Clearly.

This..
The common man just wants a solution to his problem. He doesn't give a damn about democracy nor the constitution... The civilian govt is simply unable to aid him due to incompetence. I mean whenever the country suffers from crisis its the army that comes to the rescue.

Remember a few years ago the doctors were at strike against the govt policies and the people were dying and the army came to the rescue as they sent their medical corp to civilian hospitals...

Heck in this factory collapse the govt was helpless and the army was called in where they sent their engineers with equipment to dig the people out. The media is reporting army relief effort in a factory collapse. If the civilian govt can't even handle a factory collapse then perhaps there is no need for them bcz of they fail here then what will they do during more serious crisis.

The common sees the army only and questions the position of the civilian govt and sees them as incompetent and corrupt which you can't believe on the common man. This is how martial law come. In our entire history not eve. Once did a martial law come and the people said we don't want it.. The people always supported it and heck the people were calling fornit during kiyani.

Army will stop interfering if the civilian govt becomes competent bcz the people will start to look at the civilian govt. The civilian govt shows incompetence which prompts the people to ask for check and balance and the army provides that. The nab is corrupt, the courts are corrupt and the process is a failure and those that can solve all this are corrupt so what are the people supposed to do but look at saviours?

The army is on the right here... I am not losing 60000+ people again bcz the civilian administration was too corrupt and incompetent and we should all stay quite bcz its not written in the law for the parliament to be checked....

The constitution can only be amended in the Parliament and why would they make a law that can put check and balance on them... They will much sooner make a law claiming themselves as kings before they make a law that makes them answerable.

To be fair, the Army has been very efficient in destroying any challengers to its authority. Unfortunately, that also means that there is no more any effective civilian institution left standing, by design. Now what?

 

[Paksanity]

Even after taking control of all policy matter and day to day functioning of government, the appetite of generals is asking for more and more.

Questioning the competence of government isnt the domain of men in uniform.

There isn't any day to day interference. Security is the job of military and all their talk has been on security matters. It just so happens that politicians need to do certain things to make sure people of this country can live in security and obviously they are not doing it. There is a reason people celebrate when civillian governments are sacked. Did you ever wonder why?

 

[Mrc]

Speed at which US india all NGOs and some librals rant that pakistan needs to reign in its army shud tell us exactly what to do....

Reign in the politicians....
If u get a true muslim non corrupt patriot into the post .....army will follow....
Any rogue general will be made to follow....

Best example in this regard is that of turkey....

But dont waste time till than.

Army WILL NOT FOLLOW ZAARDARI OR SHARIFS....

U know i as a citizen of pakistan dont want them to...

 

[VCheng]

Army WILL NOT FOLLOW ZAARDARI OR SHARIFS....

Is the Army above the law or not?

 

[Silverblaze]

Another excuse to put blame on Army, all the feudal lords were created by British and most of their heirs are in power so the actual boot lickers were the parents of currently in power feudal lords, truth hurts.

Truth might have hurt you sir. The fact is that no one in pakistan has ever tried to remove this feudalistic system. Army is a status quo power and just went along with them as long they posed no threat to federation, you can see who was with Ayub, Zia, and musharraf.

Politicians are hungry by nature and prepared to take humiliation just for power.

 

[tsinga]

You seem to only love whining sitting at a safe distance.

Your picture above and your comments about Pakistan army are disgusting to say the least.

Pakistan Army is not Musharraf or Zia or Yahya. Pakistan army is those brave boys who give up their lives so the rest can live in peace. You don't have to be Einstein to know that.

So what is it then? some sort of hidden agenda or just a screwed up head?

The Army is what its leaders order them to do. You cannot separate the Army from its own actions. And its actions have been evident to all in Pakistan.

Since the Pakistani Army has gone against the wishes of the people (represented by the Parliament of Pakistan), it comes clearly under the category of treason.

Whether you choose to accept this or not, or find the Army better is a different question altogether..but treason is what it is.

 

[Mrc]

Is the Army above the law or not?

And zardari is within law i persume..

 

[VCheng]

And zardari is within law i persume..

Apparently, he was better at following the law than the Army!

 

[saiyan0321]

To be fair, the Army has been very efficient in destroying any challengers to its authority. Unfortunately, that also means that there is no more any effective civilian institution left standing, by design. Now what?

The civilian administration has been in power for 8 years now yet the people still see the army as saviours do you know why? Bcz the army is always proactive. In these last 8 years the civilian govt has done nothing to ensure a corruption free environment filled with justice, law and order. You can't blame previous martial laws now. The civilian institutions have an uninterrupted run to show what progress they have made... Any crisis that hits the country, the civilian administration is found wanting and almost ignorant to the plea of the innocent sufferers. The IDP issue is a very serious one that can once more create a defeated insurgency yet according to reality the govt is answerable to no one. They become lazy which creates discontent among the IDPs which will lead to anither 60000 civilians and army personal dying while these leaders live in their palaces safe and sound. They need a check on them and the army provides that. We have to look at the reality. I support the dual power system. Our civilian govts are just not competent enough to be given a single power of complete control... The majority support this system.

The civilian govt in these 8 Yeats had a lot of chances to change people perception but they have failed... Whenever a crisis has come they have been absent.. Its the civilian govts own fault.

 

[Mrc]

Apparently, he was better at following the law than the Army!

I give up....

A reptile feeding on $hit in sewer is better than him....
(And his blind supporters)...

 

[VCheng]

I give up....

A reptile feeding on $hit in sewer is better than him....
(And his blind supporters)...

Sir, I respect your personal opinion about him (BTW I agree with you).

However, matters of law are not subject to personal opinions. Therein lies a huge difference.

The civilian administration has been in power for 8 years now yet the people still see the army as saviours do you know why? Bcz the army is always proactive. In these last 8 years the civilian govt has done nothing to ensure a corruption free environment filled with justice, law and order. You can't blame previous martial laws now. The civilian institutions have an uninterrupted run to show what progress they have made... Any crisis that hits the country, the civilian administration is found wanting and almost ignorant to the plea of the innocent sufferers. The IDP issue is a very serious one that can once more create a defeated insurgency yet according to reality the govt is answerable to no one. They become lazy which creates discontent among the IDPs which will lead to anither 60000 civilians and army personal dying while these leaders live in their palaces safe and sound. They need a check on them and the army provides that. We have to look at the reality. I support the dual power system. Our civilian govts are just not competent enough to be given a single power of complete control... The majority support this system.

The civilian govt in these 8 Yeats had a lot of chances to change people perception but they have failed... Whenever a crisis has come they have been absent.. Its the civilian govts own fault.

Sir, the Army just completed a soft coup not that long ago, only a few months ago in fact. Let us not forget that.