What should be done to Increase Religious tolerance in Pakistan/ serious Discussion

[Chronos]

Thank you for mentioning me.

Bro!

I say this with an extreme sense of dejection (so the trollers please forgive me)

If there is a decent contribution to the subject line (negative or positive) I'll be sure to add my voice.



Hope you understand.

I never engage in theological debate because I have an indifference to religion. But when users like Talon, who blatantly misconstrue Hinduism, who conflated Brahmins with gang rapists and then turn around and defend their religion from generalizing, I call hypocrisy.

You will never get an honest debate with them, as they are willing to misrepresent other religions and ask the critics to view their religion through their own interpretation.

 

[KingMamba]

@Azlan Haider I think we are just going in circles, I am reading Ibn Kathir's book and what you stated is exactly in there (even the Abbasid part, everyone who studied Islamic history knows that without the support of those who would become Shias and Zoroastrians the Abbasids would have never come into power) except I will say that yes Omar RA said Abu Bakr RA should be Caliph and made bayah to him but the ansar had to accept it as well or else one person would not have been enough to get Abu Bakr to become caliph, and the ansar did accept it and they accompanied Omar RA to Ali AS house to get him to make bayah. As for why Ali RA waited 6 months to give bayah again it is widely known that Fatima RA and Abu Bakr RA did not speak and so it was out of loyalty to his wife however after he she passed he did give Bayah, the rest of the Hashemites did as well. You seem to forget that maybe Aisha RA had her own bias here considering Abu Bakr was you know, her father. As for the Abbasids they were Hashemites but their grievance started with and was against the Banu Ummayah (of which Usman RA was a family member) which is why they overthrew the Ummayad dynasty so they had no major role in the topic we are speaking about which is the Khalifa Rashidun. So let us just leave it now.

 

[FaujHistorian]

and.....that's where problem lies in Islam.

and btw....same can be said about islamic mullahs...who have "misinterpreted" Quran and made islam lost its "superior" effectiveness on mankind..!

@ FaujHistorian
you see something wrong in his statement?

I personally try to avoid labeling any religion "corrupted" as long they don't use their orthodoxy for continuation of ignorance and arrogance.

@Azlan Haider I think we are just going in circles, I am reading Ibn Kathir's book and what you stated is exactly in there (even the Abbasid part, everyone who studied Islamic history knows that without the support of those who would become Shias and Zoroastrians the Abbasids would have never come into power) except I will say that yes Omar RA said Abu Bakr RA should be Caliph and made bayah to him but the ansar had to accept it as well or else one person would not have been enough to get Abu Bakr to become caliph, and the ansar did accept it and they accompanied Omar RA to Ali AS house to get him to make bayah. As for why Ali RA waited 6 months to give bayah again it is widely known that Fatima RA and Abu Bakr RA did not speak and so it was out of loyalty to his wife however after he she passed he did give Bayah, the rest of the Hashemites did as well. You seem to forget that maybe Aisha RA had her own bias here considering Abu Bakr was you know, her father. As for the Abbasids they were Hashemites but their grievance started with and was against the Banu Ummayah (of which Usman RA was a family member) which is why they overthrew the Ummayad dynasty so they had no major role in the topic we are speaking about which is the Khalifa Rashidun. So let us just leave it now.

The bottom line dear poster is simple.

Khalifa Rashidoon could be good role models for personal behavior (with lots of caveats)

But if someone comes here and tries to sell their system of government as modern in 2014,

then he/she is severely ignorant about that ear and thus mistaken to say the least,


Thank you

 

[KingMamba]

The bottom line dear poster is simple.

Khalifa Rashidoon could be good role models for personal behavior (with lots of caveats)

But if someone comes here and tries to sell their system of government as modern in 2014,

then he/she is severely ignorant about that ear and thus mistaken to say the least,


Thank you

The bottom line is they had nothing to do with the topic until you brought them up in the thread.

 

[PWFI]

Still no answer. Still personal attacks.

Not a personal attack but a refference to the history, Mr "think Tank"

 

[BATMAN]

Khalifa Rashidoon could be good role models for personal behavior (with lots of caveats)
But if someone comes here and tries to sell their system of government as modern in 2014,
then he/she is severely ignorant about that ear and thus mistaken to say the least,

Please, quote the person selling you any thing?
I recommend to adopt any good thing, from any where!
While the Caliphs, did good job in protecting what prophet pbuh passed to them and they did it in style and set an example to follow.

 

[PWFI]

I dont think he called me Moulana! Really are you becoming blind too from soo much hatred? What else does Ukhti mean? You can type it as Ukhti or Oukhti depending which sound you prefer?! @PWFI please put @FaujHistorian 's confusion and obvious lack of knowledge of the Arabic word to ease!

In france arabs from algeria,tunisia, and morroco use the word Oukhti instead of ukhti, wich mean Sister. Fauji "think tank" seem to be mentaly disturb!

 

[FaujHistorian]

In france arabs from algeria,tunisia, and morroco use the word Oukhti instead of ukhti, wich mean Sister. Fauji "think tank" seem to be mentaly disturb!

Ignoring the post

zero contribution

100% personal attacks

 

[PWFI]

Ignoring the post

zero contribution

100% personal attacks

Drink a glass of cold water, that may help you

 

[IamBengali]

Abrahamic religions in its principle intolerant to other faiiths apart from its own. Jews will say Christianity is false, Christians will say same thing about Judaism and Islam. Same with Islam. We can't help it. Pakistan has 98% Muslims. Showing tolerance to non Muslims is non issue in Pakistan. What you guys need to do is show tolerance to Shia sect, Ahmadiya sect and stop referring other sects as Kafirs in your constitution. Don't promote religious violence from highest authority.

First thing amend the constitution and just remove that section which say Ahmadiyas are Kafirs.

 

[BATMAN]

@iam bengali Pakistan does not have 98% Muslims, while you already divide them in various sects.

While the biggest sect in terms of population is Shitte, forming about 30% of population, rest of all other sect have smaller ratio.

 

[Dubious]

In france arabs from algeria,tunisia, and morroco use the word Oukhti instead of ukhti, wich mean Sister. Fauji "think tank" seem to be mentaly disturb!

no just not versed enough in ya akhi...lets keep the topic rolling

 

[M. Sarmad]

@Azlan Haider I think we are just going in circles, I am reading Ibn Kathir's book and what you stated is exactly in there (even the Abbasid part, everyone who studied Islamic history knows that without the support of those who would become Shias and Zoroastrians the Abbasids would have never come into power) except I will say that yes Omar RA said Abu Bakr RA should be Caliph and made bayah to him but the ansar had to accept it as well or else one person would not have been enough to get Abu Bakr to become caliph, and the ansar did accept it and they accompanied Omar RA to Ali AS house to get him to make bayah. As for why Ali RA waited 6 months to give bayah again it is widely known that Fatima RA and Abu Bakr RA did not speak and so it was out of loyalty to his wife however after he she passed he did give Bayah, the rest of the Hashemites did as well. You seem to forget that maybe Aisha RA had her own bias here considering Abu Bakr was you know, her father. As for the Abbasids they were Hashemites but their grievance started with and was against the Banu Ummayah (of which Usman RA was a family member) which is why they overthrew the Ummayad dynasty so they had no major role in the topic we are speaking about which is the Khalifa Rashidun. So let us just leave it now.

What I was trying to point out were a few technical mistakes in Islamic historiography , Anyways there is a separate thread running on this topic , We may discuss history of Ibn e Kathir there :
Islamic History & Archaeology

And Islamic history is relevant . All the sectarianism results from blindly following mullahs without consulting primary history sources

 

[Zarvan]

Already present in the law if it is not being practiced it is not the falt of the law...it is already in the law just problems with reinforcing it...Prob are arising from people not the govt directly...I already quoted how Islam insists this @BATMAN already stated how during the Islamic rules, everyone was protected...Sorry people fail to quote proper history or you dont read that in literature...


I have read the Quran in 3 languages so far they have been same....yes please give me this "scholar's " name


It does...zara ghour say paryeh ga....maybe with some classes in Quranic Arabic to help decipher the words


I rather invest 5 mins in this

No lady no details given in fact neither off zakat and off Salah I read it every day

1)we can start by teaching tolerance in this forum. Have a "every religion, caste, creed, color, race is equal and no one is considered superior or inferior" clause in your terms and conditions
2) Instead of a "thanks" and a "rank up", put a "racist, relgious fundamentalist" tag that keeps increasing everytime a moderator sees a "intolerant" rant
3) Have a permanent link to all rants that the above users were "awarded" the "racist" tag for all members to see and decide for what exactly this guy was awarded such a rating.

have a discourse among members on what is good conduct - make everyone involved in this - from People like @Zarvan to people like @FaujiHistorian because true tolerance isbeing flexible for others views - only not "belittling" each others views.

We don't tolerate when some one tries to change main concepts off Islam

 

[Sliver]

No lady no details given in fact neither off zakat and off Salah I read it every day


We don't tolerate when some one tries to change main concepts off Islam

You have to learn the difference between "accepting" the differences versus "tolerating" the differences. If I do not respect a particular religion, but I do some other, it gives no one an authority to hurt, punish,ridicule me. Just as we understand you are a staunch muslim, you need to understand, we are not. As a muslim has a right to say Allah is the greatest, the non-muslims have the right to say to the contrary.