What does 'Are you a Muslim first or...' mean?

[Lincoln]

Pakistan was not created an 'Islamic Republic', it became one much later.

Doesn't matter. United States isn't a Christian republic but people associate it with the nation, so does their Governments if you read on their history, also why their $1 bill proudly proclaims "In God We Trust".

 

[M. Sarmad]

Doesn't matter. United States isn't a Christian republic but people associate it with the nation, so does their Governments if you read on their history, also why their $1 bill proudly proclaims "In God We Trust".

It does matter in the context of Pakistan history,

During the struggle for the freedom(and even today), the most important issue which concerned Muslim Scholars and political activists was about the national and religious identity of Indian Muslims and their position in the future India ...


Hussain Ahmed Madani (The Rector of Darul Uloom Deoband) and many others advocated "Composite Nationalism", (i.e. despite cultural, linguistic and religious differences, the people of India were but one nation). The proponents of composite nationalism believed/argued that this idea was consistent with the teachings of the Holy Quran and that the Prophet (PBUH) himself had set a practical example of Composite Nationalism when he signed the Constitution of Medina (Meesaq-e-Medina)



Then there were those who advocated the idea of "Muslim Nationalism in India" ... This idea formed the basis of the Two Nation Theory ... This idea/theory implies/implied that We were Muslims before being Indian ... And We were Indian before being (Non-Indian) Muslim ... This theory created and propounded by modernist and reformist Muslims (like Sir Syed) was inspired by Western Political Theories (of John Lock, Thomas Paine, Milton etc.).... It in a way advocated a Pan-Islamism that was restricted by geographical boundaries of the Nation state (of India, and now Pakistan).


And there were others (like Maududi) who were of the view that neither Composite Nationalism nor Muslim Nationalism were Islamic in their orientation, therefore, they warned the Muslims of the sub-continent to be beware of both. Few of them advocated "Pan-Islamism"


I believe the Pakistani nationalist ideology is very unique, and (for the Pakistani Muslims at least) Pakistani Nationalism and Islam are not mutually exclusive ..... I for one do not prioritize a Pakistani identity over Muslim identity (or vice versa). But there are those who claim to be Pakistani First, and then there are those who say that they are Muslim First. Both these claims are consistent with TNT as the TNT has both ingredients; Pan-Islamic and Nationalist. But as it is Pan-Islamism that is restricted by the Nation State boundary (and not the other way around), "Pakistani First", in my opinion, is the more valid and realistic position.

 

[JF-17ThunderBlock3]

Pakistan was not created an 'Islamic Republic', it became one much later.

Sarmad Bhai Chuss mat Maryn please!

 

[Falcon29]

@IbnAbdullah

It's intended to implicate someone as beholden to priorities of his faith rather than country. Or unfit to rule or direct development of the state.

 

[Mujahid Memon]

Salaam

NOTE: This thread is not actually asking this question, rather it is ABOUT the meaning of this question.

Are you a Muslim first or a (insert your choice identity/belief etc)

This question seems to get asked a lot by people. I have heard this question asked on national television of political leader amongst countless other instances.

So what is this question supposed to actually mean? I just wanted to get a clear idea of what it is actually being asked here.

If you ask a person if they are a Muslim first or a Pakistani first - what are you exactly asking them?

Is the question, essentially, meant as a choice between

• Renouncing Allah, His Messenger (pbuh) and the deen of Islam

and,

• Renouncing the state of Pakistan

?

Like if it came down to chosing one or the other, is a person who says Pakistani first (as opposed to Muslim first) saying that they will be willing to abandon Allah, His Messenger and Islam for Pakistan?

Is a person a bad Pakistani if they say they are Muslim first?

What about the opposite of it?


Please treat this as a genuine question and answer accordingly - preferably without name calling and such.



Thank you
...

Its like comparing apples and oranges, one is religion and the other is nationality.

 

[M. Sarmad]

Sarmad Bhai Chuss mat Maryn please!

Bhai, Pakistan came into being on August 14 1947.
Pakistan became an Islamic Republic on 23 March 1956.
We were the first ones in the world to add prefix 'Islamic' to our Republican status. Today there are 4 Islamic Republics in the world.
The Prefix 'Islamic' was dropped (very briefly though) in 1962 and we became 'Republic of Pakistan'
And Islam was adopted as the state religion in 1973 only.
You need to learn our history bhai

 

[B.K.N]

Bhai, Pakistan came into being on August 14 1947.
Pakistan became an Islamic Republic on 23 March 1956.
We were the first ones in the world to add prefix 'Islamic' to our Republican status. Today there are 4 Islamic Republics in the world.
The Prefix 'Islamic' was dropped (very briefly though) in 1962 and we became 'Republic of Pakistan'
And Islam was adopted as the state religion in 1973 only.
You need to learn our history bhai

Op poster was asking what does being Muslim or Pakistani first means not whether Pakistan should be Islamic republic or people's republic

 

[Mutakalim]

So I wanted to get a clear understanding of what is actually being asked with such a question. So, in essence, I am asking ABOUT this question, not asking the question itself.

Salam,

For me the meaning of this question is where your loyalties actually lies. For instance, if you have to chose between Pakistan and Islam, what will you chose. Some people think that nationality based on ethnicity or nation state should be the focus of our loyalties.

Further questions then arise from it, like; whose verdict is supreme? Constitution of state or Quran? If state is openly rejecting verdict of Quran, then whose side will you take? I know its a dangerous path full of ditches, but these are logical questions which arise from the study of nationalism and modern nation state system.

 

[JF-17ThunderBlock3]

I fear Allah more than Constitution of Pakistan.
For me after death I will be asked about my God ( Allah) & name of my Prophet.
Allah is my God and Prophet Mohammed S.A.W.
They won't ask about Nationality.
So put it that way.
I don't want angels to hold me accountable for my statement today and record it.
God forbid. Hence Muslim comes first abiding towheed and other is later
Safety first man... Don't mean to mess this one.

 

[Falcon29]

@IbnAbdullah

I'll give my opinion regarding my stance on the question even though I know you aren't asking about that. But, if my countrymen try to push me away from Allah(SWT), my faith, and decrease influence of my faith in my approach to life/lifestyle/decision making, then I obviously as a Muslim prioritize my creator over the creation. If society goes downhill and people abandon the commandments of Allah(SWT), you pray for them to return on the right path and don't partake in activities our agenda pushing that is anti-Islam.

The Prophet Mohammed(SAW) went into seclusion due to his people abandoning God and monotheism. For a long time he did. He prioritized his Lord, and Allah(SWT) remember him and told him he was on the right path and revealed Islam to him. So I would wish my countrymen the best and hope they return to right path, but will not partake in activities or spreading of anti-Islam agendas.

 

[M. Sarmad]

Op poster was asking what does being Muslim or Pakistani first means not whether Pakistan should be Islamic republic or people's republic

That post was in reply to another member's post.
And no one has argued whether Pakistan should be Islamic republic or people's republic
You seem to have serious comprehension issues.

 

[Mutakalim]

Pakistan was not created an 'Islamic Republic', it became one much later.

Does it matter? It is now an Islamic state. Whether Ghamdi'ism likes it or not.

 

[B.K.N]

That post was in reply to another member's post.
And no one has argued whether Pakistan should be Islamic republic or people's republic
You seem to have serious comprehension issues.

You were arguing about it you seem to have some problem with word islamic

 

[JF-17ThunderBlock3]

Bhai, Pakistan came into being on August 14 1947.
Pakistan became an Islamic Republic on 23 March 1956.
We were the first ones in the world to add prefix 'Islamic' to our Republican status. Today there are 4 Islamic Republics in the world.
The Prefix 'Islamic' was dropped (very briefly though) in 1962 and we became 'Republic of Pakistan'
And Islam was adopted as the state religion in 1973 only.
You need to learn our history bhai

Sir I know 1973 ka aieen. Jnab. I have had posts related to this subject myself
You are talking about technical issue of Constitution.
Existence of Pakistan was based on what?
Islam. People migrated coz of Islamic country.
I remember first two Army chiefs were British as well
One of them didn't send forces for Kashmir etc...

 

[M. Sarmad]

Does it matter?

Yes it does