Western Radar/Grifo-E selected for JF-17?

[AbuzarIlyas]

Long Live ISI. They are helping all institutions to achieve their goals in making Pakistan a great country. The nuclear program, JF-17, Missile Program and now Project AZM would not be possible if our markhors would not be available to get the required data from anywhere in the world.

Manufacturing an AESA radar at home will be very crucial for the development of future projects. Once we put our hands into a business, it gives us freedom of use. Hope that more than a single type of airborne radar are under development right now.

 

[BATMAN]

Long live ISI, long live Pak armed forces, long live Pakistan.
Down with those who smuggle $ and defense technology out of Pakistan.

 

[StormBreaker]

Our esteemed friends needs to remember that self reliance & in-house solution isn't new nor a sudden reaction. Back in days, since 2010, its been on card and PAC remained committed to build Radar by our own with help of China, for many reasons that one can pen down.... Huge step towards independence, self reliance, weapon integration freedom for house & foreign customers and many more plausible reasons that we have Radar Manufacturing facility at PAC.

So, Grifo-E isn't the runner and doesn't seems to be the case at all except that our friend here matched antenna shape etc. One thing is for sure that we are developing AESA by our own for our own use and so can supplement the thought that foreign customers may want western weapons that OEMs may not feel reluctant due to China having product code etc issue.

I really wouldn’t be surprised if we come with an in-house solution for HMD/S. We have heck of an experience using JHCMS. PAC being wise, would definitely make use of that experience. InshaAllah we might hear soon of that as well.

It’s really a common sense to think, when you have a dedicated Avionics Production Factory (APF), why wouldn’t you come out with MAXIMUM in house solutions to give a message to EVERY nation regardless of their relations with us including China that we really are close to achieving self-reliance in coming decade. Powerplant would be the ultimate feat in that timeline, but requires massive investment, but we do have MRF and we play with mirages engines. Wouldnt be tooo hard to start from the scratch as well.

 

[Pakistani Fighter]

Long live ISI, long live Pak armed forces, long live Pakistan.
Down with those who smuggle $ and defense technology out of Pakistan.

Why?

 

[The Eagle]

I really wouldn’t be surprised if we come with an in-house solution for HMD/S. We have heck of an experience using JHCMS. PAC being wise, would definitely make use of that experience. InshaAllah we might hear soon of that as well.

It’s really a common sense to think, when you have a dedicated Avionics Production Factory (APF), why wouldn’t you come out with MAXIMUM in house solutions to give a message to EVERY nation regardless of their relations with us including China that we really are close to achieving self-reliance in coming decade. Powerplant would be the ultimate feat in that timeline, but requires massive investment, but we do have MRF and we play with mirages engines. Wouldnt be tooo hard to start from the scratch as well.

As far as I observe, some of us think that in-house solution means total indigenous product for get go which is not the case for a country like us. In-fact we start with the help of our friends (China at large) like we import few of parts and the rest is being produced at home for the time being so we have the freedom of source codes just so that many OEMs especially Westerners are reluctant to share codes having their reservations due to Chinese involvement. As this one is the first step, and hopefully will reach to maximum potential utilization, we are on the right path. I can't comment on more of what is really going on but there is a lot being happening behind closed doors and it makes perfect sense to keep things out of reach of anyone until & unless the perfect time to reveal.

 

[StormBreaker]

As far as I observe, some of us think that in-house solution means total indigenous product for get go which is not the case for a country like us. In-fact we start with the help of our friends (China at large) like we import few of parts and the rest is being produced at home for the time being so we have the freedom of source codes just so that many OEMs especially Westerners are reluctant to share codes having their reservations due to Chinese involvement. As this one is the first step, and hopefully will reach to maximum potential utilization, we are on the right path. I can't comment on more of what is really going on but there is a lot being happening behind closed doors and it makes perfect sense to keep things out of reach of anyone until & unless the perfect time to reveal.

Yea, definitely, in-house never means 100% indigenous. Even high grade silicon chips are produced by very few countries. So there can never be a 100%, but here ToT and Licensed Production or Buying design rights mean a lot for a country like Pakistan. A wise man can read the device just by assembling it...
As for what’s going on, definitely, never let things out unless institutions want to. It’s a respect to their privacy which is a NATIONAL SECURITY AGENDA. After all, they are doing for us and they are definitely better planners than us.

 

[Akh1112]

What advantage have GaN over GAA?

GaN are far more efficient. Also, components of GaN radars are smaller, therefore taking up less space. However yeah, the main benefit are their efficiency, power can be converted into EM spectrum with alot less waste energy therefore also requiring less cooling power too

 

[Dazzler]

Looks similar to lkf-601

 

[MastanKhan]

I really wouldn’t be surprised if we come with an in-house solution for HMD/S. We have heck of an experience using JHCMS. PAC being wise, would definitely make use of that experience. InshaAllah we might hear soon of that as well.

It’s really a common sense to think, when you have a dedicated Avionics Production Factory (APF), why wouldn’t you come out with MAXIMUM in house solutions to give a message to EVERY nation regardless of their relations with us including China that we really are close to achieving self-reliance in coming decade. Powerplant would be the ultimate feat in that timeline, but requires massive investment, but we do have MRF and we play with mirages engines. Wouldnt be tooo hard to start from the scratch as well.

Hi,

There is a reason no fighter aircraft manufacturer builds its own engines---cost of faiure is extremely high---and the cost of delays is higher---. And if there are problems that keep plaguing the engine after production run---then the failure is all your's to bear---and that is not a good place to be---.

So---Pak is better off with somone else's engine as the rest of fighter aircraft industry is---. Let others fix the headaches---.

 

[Akh1112]

Hi,

There is a reason no fighter aircraft manufacturer builds its own engines---cost of faiure is extremely high---and the cost of delays is higher---. And if there are problems that keep plaguing the engine after production run---then the failure is all your's to bear---and that is not a good place to be---.

So---Pak is better off with somone else's engine as the rest of fighter aircraft industry is---. Let others fix the headaches---.

well said, however we do need to look towards replacing the RD93/33 reasonably quick soon, hopefully the block iii does have a new and better engine. The RD93/33 is a major turn-off for countries, for example Malaysia.

 

[StormBreaker]

Hi,

There is a reason no fighter aircraft manufacturer builds its own engines---cost of faiure is extremely high---and the cost of delays is higher---. And if there are problems that keep plaguing the engine after production run---then the failure is all your's to bear---and that is not a good place to be---.

So---Pak is better off with somone else's engine as the rest of fighter aircraft industry is---. Let others fix the headaches---.

I was talking about long term, EDUCATIONAL research on turbines to eventually one day become an engine exporter if necessary. Not for Thunder, not for AZM but for future. Yesterday Fawad chaudry said “We as a nation failed to make engine but we will make chips (whatever he said, it was chips or something else i forget)” so this means that we did dream to do the thing but never got practical due to lack of skills and funds.

 

[SABRE]

Hi,

There is a reason no fighter aircraft manufacturer builds its own engines---cost of faiure is extremely high---and the cost of delays is higher---. And if there are problems that keep plaguing the engine after production run---then the failure is all your's to bear---and that is not a good place to be---.

So---Pak is better off with somone else's engine as the rest of fighter aircraft industry is---. Let others fix the headaches---.

Correct. Modern aviation companies, but especially Western, do not manufacture all of the components of their aircraft. This is not just limited to engines but radar, avionics, weapons, etc., i.e. Lockheed Martin is prime contractor for F-22, but the aircraft's radar is produced by Northrop Grumman, some EW equipement is acquired from General Electric, engine from Pratt & Whitney, missiles from Raytheon, and so on. This indeed does help avoid problems associated with time and costs, and also provides fail-safe option. If something fails, Pentagon shifts to a different contractor instead of being held hostage by one.

In the American case, this setup is both natural and created. No one company has expertise to develop all aircraft components and the Pentagon does not want to allow one contractor to become hegemonic or monopolistic, as in the past several noted aviation companies were either taken out of business or taken over by companies that dominate US aviation industry right now.

 

[The Accountant]

Dont read too much into it .. THe poster can also be of internet pics

 

[araz]

I was talking about long term, EDUCATIONAL research on turbines to eventually one day become an engine exporter if necessary. Not for Thunder, not for AZM but for future. Yesterday Fawad chaudry said “We as a nation failed to make engine but we will make chips (whatever he said, it was chips or something else i forget)” so this means that we did dream to do the thing but never got practical due to lack of skills and funds.

Our requirements will never be high enough for us to warrant an indegenous engine. It might be wiser to piggy back and do a joint venture with another country or a consortium of countries to build an engine. Turkey Malaysia ands Indonesia come to mind to begin with. I think China will want to remain a supplier rather than a part of a consortium.

 

[denel]

Hi,

There is a reason no fighter aircraft manufacturer builds its own engines---cost of faiure is extremely high---and the cost of delays is higher---. And if there are problems that keep plaguing the engine after production run---then the failure is all your's to bear---and that is not a good place to be---.

So---Pak is better off with somone else's engine as the rest of fighter aircraft industry is---. Let others fix the headaches---.

I concur and let them take baby steps with smaller engines e.g piston/small micro-jets first.