War is not an option,Pakistan ready for ‘conditional’ talks with India says Qureshi

[GumNaam]

But how will this serve US interests against Russia and China?

Or are you saying that the alliance of Russia-China-Pakistan will balkanize India while US will have no option but to quit this game altogether and be a mere spectator?

As I said, the main threat is China...not Russia. With a weak China, Russia is nothing. If the u.s. can't weaken China in Xinjiang through Afghanistan, it'll try to weaken China through the balkanized india in tibet. india is far too scared of China to let america do that now. balkanized indian sato states will readily let the u.s. do whatever the u.s. wants since they will have u.s. military bases much like how nato europe does today. See the picture?

 

[PaulSimon]

As I said, the main threat is China...not Russia. With a weak China, Russia is nothing. If the u.s. can't weaken China in Xinjiang through Afghanistan, it'll try to weaken China through the balkanized india in Tibet. See the picture?

Ah! now I get it but I do not think that would work though.

Both Indians and Tibetans have already been tried and have failed to deliver.

The best bet for the US is to confront China through Xinjiang.

Xinjiang is strategically more important than Tibet as Xinjiang is the Chinese BRI link to Central Asia, Arabian Sea, Russia and Europe.

Both Afghanistan and Kashmir are gateways to Xinjiang.

The US deal with Pakistan/Taliban will ensure that US could confront China from both Afghanistan and Kashmir.

 

[GumNaam]

Ah! now I get it but I do not think that would work though.

Both Indians and Tibetans have already been tried and have failed to deliver.

The best bet for the US is to confront China through Xinjiang.

Xinjiang is strategically more important than Tibet as Xinjiang is the Chinese BRI link to Central Asia, Arabian Sea, Russia and Europe.

Both Afghanistan and Kashmir are gateways to Xinjiang.

The US deal with Pakistan/Taliban will ensure that US could confront China from both Afghanistan and Kashmir.

don't discount american abilities in espionage & creating insurgencies. they don't need to be in Afghanistan to create insurgency in Xinjiang...they can easily create chaos in both tibet and in Xinjiang SIMULTANEOUSLY. they just can't right now because firstly, Pakistan jealously guards anyone's entry into China to foment trouble there (who ever tries to won't know hit em & that's before they even get close to China), secondly Pakistan aggressively asserted itself in Afghanistan by bluntly taking Taliban's side behind closed doors and thirdly, india proved to be a very reluctant strategic partner of the u.s. that would not cooperate with the u.s. in fomenting trouble in Tibet or Xinjiang NOT because of any love for China but out of the sheer fear of China...well, america will have its way with india either way, if not with india's cooperation than over india's dismembered body. there's a reason why kissinger called america's animosity dangerous but it's friendship fatal!

 

[PaulSimon]

don't discount american abilities in espionage & creating insurgencies. they don't need to be in Afghanistan to create insurgency in Xinjiang...they can easily create chaos in both tibet and in Xinjiang SIMULTANEOUSLY. they just can't right now because firstly, Pakistan jealously guards anyone's entry into China to foment trouble there (who ever tries to won't know hit em & that's before they even get close to China), secondly Pakistan aggressively asserted itself in Afghanistan by bluntly taking Taliban's side behind closed doors and thirdly, india proved to be a very reluctant strategic partner of the u.s. that would not cooperate with the u.s. in fomenting trouble in Tibet or Xinjiang NOT because of any love for China but out of the sheer fear of China...well, america will have its way with india either way, if not with india's cooperation than over india's dismembered body. there's a reason why kissinger called america's animosity dangerous but it's friendship fatal!

Everything has a price. Kashmir, GCC Support and US trade. There are simply a lot many carrots for Pakistan/Taliban to do a deal with the US.

Ofcourse, there are FATF and sanctions sticks too.

Why do you think India is not involved in the talks with the Taliban?

Why do you think India went into a tizzy and scrapped Article 370 all of a sudden?

You will see a deal between US and Pakistan/Taliban announced in the next few weeks.

 

[Village life]

This is called diplomacy same used around the world where one is harsh other is open for talk to resolve issue

yes keep it up as you have been very successful with your diplomacy since last 72 years ,out of which for 70 years we were stooges of USA , any example of our successfully diplomacy since our birth please? or name the single diplomatic win of entire Muslim world? this is called cowardness and hiding behind the curtains, or behaving like a ostrich,

 

[GumNaam]

Everything has a price. Kashmir, GCC Support and US trade. There are simply a lot many carrots for Pakistan/Taliban to do a deal with the US.

u.s. has tried all those carrots on both Pakistan & Afghanistan with zero returns.

Ofcourse, there are FATF and sanctions sticks too.

fatf & other sanctions aren't gonna get anything to anyone that carries strategic importance for China. China heads fatf and it has all the intentions of asserting itself.

Why do you think India is not involved in the talks with the Taliban?

Cuz for the Taliban, a good indian is a dead one. well, not indian purse, but hindus.

Why do you think India went into a tizzy and scrapped Article 370 all of a sudden?

Not a tizzy at all. they promised that it'll be first thing they'll do if they are reelected.

You will see a deal between US and Pakistan/Taliban announced in the next few weeks.

next few weeks? khaleelzad has been saying "next few weeks" for a year now. u.s. wants a victory that they can't earn. they want face saving that they don't deserve. they can either face a south vietman like humiliation? or they can have their victory...in india, which frankly will be so grand that the world will basically forget about america's quiet exist from Afghanistan...

 

[Humble Analyst]

Let Pakistan be smart about it

 

[PaulSimon]

u.s. has tried all those carrots on both Pakistan & Afghanistan with zero returns.

Nope. Kashmir was never on the table. Also, trade with the US was never on the table. Only defence deals (Zulu & F-16s) and CSF were offered earlier.

fatf & other sanctions aren't gonna get anything to anyone that carries strategic importance for China. China heads fatf and it has all the intentions of asserting itself.

Yes. China & Turkey would support but when US is serious no other country will support Pakistan. US could unilaterally sanction them and Pakistan like it is doing with Iran & Russia.

Cuz for the Taliban, a good indian is a dead one. well, not indian purse, but hindus.

Of course for Taliban but my question was why is US keeping India out of the Afghan negotiations though India was involved with Afghanistan for more than a decade now with the support of the US?

Not a tizzy at all. they promised that it'll be first thing they'll do if they are reelected.

Of course India did it in a tizzy. Heck, BJP does not even have a simple majority in Rajya Sabha but secured a 2/3rds majority for scrapping Article 370. That was some feet never seen in the history of the Indian politics. The fact is the Indian security establishment sent a strong signal to the political parties to get the amendments passed immediately as they got the intelligence inputs that the deal between US and Pakistan/Taliban was at an advanced stage and would be sealed anytime now.

next few weeks? khaleelzad has been saying "next few weeks" for a year now. u.s. wants a victory that they can't earn. they want face saving that they don't deserve. they can either face a south vietman like humiliation? or they can have their victory...in india, which frankly will be so grand that the world will basically forget about america's quiet exist from Afghanistan...

Just wait and see. The deal between US and Pakistan/Taliban would be announced shortly.

 

[Placemat]

so...what I'm about to tell you, is not just me, it is one of the plans that are being pursued in the power corridors of washington...don't ask me how I know this cuz I'm not gonna disclose that...but read it very carefully.

rest assured, Pakistan is NOT giving up a tried & true brotherly friend like China in exchange for selfish little slut that is the u.s. HOWEVER...there is SOME truth to what you ate saying...the u.s. has miserably failed to keep any tabs on China nor on Russia. this is where the deal between Pakistan & the u.s. comes in. Pakistan won't tolerate u.s. presence in Afghanistan and nor will China nor Russia. yes, rest assured, u.s. will be FORCED out of Afghanistan at the gunpoint of the Russian Spetsnaz if Putin has to. this where dismembering india comes in. yes, DISMEMBERING india...their is a "sato" (south asian treaty organization) in the near making and China knows that is going to be against China. There has been a very blunt and open discussion between Pakistan, China, Russia and America...the americans have openly said that they want to keep an eye on China & Russia along with that the u.s. WILL NOT STOP TRYING! so in the entire equation, the weakest military link that us india (bluntly put) as been made the sacrificial lamb that is to be dismembered into smaller countries that will be totally at america's mercy & command (yes weak as united india is, they never really let america turn them into a true front against China). China knows this, Pakistan knows this, Russia knows this. All the powers involved have agreed that we'll balkanize india and take in loyal, friendly states that will set off a NEW cold war. an america in india far less dangerous than an america in Afghanistan cuz america can directly use Afghanistan to instigate Islam related jihadi trouble from Afghanistan into Xinjiang and central asia. That type of militancy is not found in the muslims of india so...yeah, Pakistan, China & Russia have thrown india under the soon to hit american train in exchange for them leaving Afghanistan. america is STARVING for a "glorious" military victory like that of world war 2 where uncle sam swoops into to a normandy like d-day landing on the shores of mumbai and "saves" the oppressed minorities from the clutches of the nazi like fascist bjp regime & a hitler/mussolini like modi. But at the same time... China (and Pakistan) come in from the north (and the west) to secure their buffers against the american treachery that will soon follow after sato materializes...


Again, WHAT???

Ok year.. tum hi Rakho Kashmir

 

[SQ8]

What seem like mixed messages on the surface reflect the harrowed diplomacy being carried out behind the curtain.

World diplomats are concerned and are pushing for talks, they want to avoid us flaring up Kashmir by turning away from stopping insurgent support as was in the past leading to potential deaths of Indian troopers and their retaliation against us.

On the other hand India’s business partners are varying of instability due to conflict with us and the constant rhetoric which we have dialed up to 10 is starting to have its slow effect.

To the casual observer it would seem SMQ is using appeasing language - to the analyst this is diplomatic signalling.

Some posts here however, are amusing and worth a chuckle or two.

 

[GumNaam]

Nope. Kashmir was never on the table. Also, trade with the US was never on the table. Only defence deals (Zulu & F-16s) and CSF were offered earlier.



Yes. China & Turkey would support but when US is serious no other country will support Pakistan. US could unilaterally sanction them and Pakistan like it is doing with Iran & Russia.



Of course for Taliban but my question was why is US keeping India out of the Afghan negotiations though India was involved with Afghanistan for more than a decade now with the support of the US?



Of course India did it in a tizzy. Heck, BJP does not even have a simple majority in Rajya Sabha but secured a 2/3rds majority for scrapping Article 370. That was some feet never seen in the history of the Indian politics. The fact is the Indian security establishment sent a strong signal to the political parties to get the amendments passed immediately as they got the intelligence inputs that the deal between US and Pakistan/Taliban was at an advanced stage and would be sealed anytime now.



Just wait and see. The deal between US and Pakistan/Taliban would be announced shortly.

the u.s. is just not in a position to negotiate, period. fatf or any other sanctions are a relic of the past now, for the sanctioner would loose a lot more than Pakistan would, hands down. Don't forget that Pakistan sits on hundreds of billions of tons of gold & other natural resources that were can always fall back on for economic custom and it won't take much for us to open the gates for the mujahedeen to pour into Afghanistan...that is just one of the aces in our sleeves that america has no answer for. We will call the shots, that's JUST how it is? think about it as an american? humiliation in Afghanistan & loose the watchful eye over China forever or replace victory in Afghanistan with victory over india that would blind out their defeat in Afghanistan plus falling a foothold near China...there is a reason why the u.s. deep state is pursuing this...

Ok year.. tum hi Rakho Kashmir

We will...not like anyone 8 gonna stop us...

 

[Placemat]

the u.s. is just not in a position to negotiate, period. fatf or any other sanctions are a relic of the past now, for the sanctioner would loose a lot more than Pakistan would, hands down. Don't forget that Pakistan sits on hundreds of billions of tons of gold & other natural resources that were can always fall back on for economic custom and it won't take much for us to open the gates for the mujahedeen to pour into Afghanistan...that is just one of the aces in our sleeves that america has no answer for. We will call the shots, that's JUST how it is? think about it as an american? humiliation in Afghanistan & loose the watchful eye over China forever or replace victory in Afghanistan with victory over india that would blind out their defeat in Afghanistan plus falling a foothold near China...there is a reason why the u.s. deep state is pursuing this...


We will...not like anyone 8 gonna stop us...

Ok fine ...

 

[SIPRA]

In the geopolitics, negotiations and wars, whether under compulsion or by choice, invariably go hand in hand and none can be totally dispensed with, at any time. I don't think that SMQ is saying, what he is saying, on his own. He, in my view, is following the policy laid down by PMIK, in consensus and consultation with COAS. All are on the same page.

Jinnah was probably incorrect as this situation would not have occurred if muslims lived with hindus without the shadow of partition. This was a fait accompli. This situation has come as a result of partition.

Better read some history, from independent sources, before giving such ridiculous statements. The current situation is the result of the dream and fantasy of the elite Hindu of subcontinent to acquire a supremacy and hegemony over the Muslims of this region. The roots of conflict between India and Pakistan lies in that psyche. Kashmir issue is a manifestation of that psyche. And I am sure that you know it.

 

[doorstar]

In the geopolitics, negotiations and wars, whether under compulsion or by choice, invariably go hand in hand and none can be totally dispensed with, at any time. I don't think that SMQ is saying, what he is saying, on his own. He, in my view, is following the policy laid down by PMIK, in consensus and consultation with COAS. All are on the same page.

he is not saying anything wrong or different than the PM, it is just that these here PDF warriors and propagandists are using the injun interpretations of what he said to bash him

what he actually said has no similarity with what is being claimed in bharat or on pdf
https://defence.pk/pdf/posts/11741191/

 

[SIPRA]

he is not saying anything wrong or different than the PM, it is just that these here PDF warriors are using the injun interpretations of what he says to bash him

what he actually said has no similarity with what is being claimed in bharat or on pdf
https://defence.pk/pdf/posts/11741191/

Fully agree with you. Though, I don't like him either as a person or as a politician.