US will forget Vietnam if it attacks 'FATA'

[Battle Axe]

Frustated Sammy is restless too...

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

It looks like saner counsel will prevail and Pakistan will take steps to defuse the situation:

from: Commanders

Pakistan has so far suggested nothing different, even while strongly refuting the latest unsubstantiated US allegations.

However, Pakistan is also, correctly, sticking to its position on not conducting a military operation in North Waziristan at the current time:

Pakistan will not attack Haqqani group, defying U.S.: report | Reuters

The US needs to collect itself and stop throwing temper tantrums and lashing about uncontrollably - that kind of behavior is not going to fix the complex problems in Afghanistan.

 

[DANGER-ZONE]

Over frustration of Super Power results dissolution .... think before taking over so many tensions

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

US wont attack Pakistan... they are too smart for it.

 

[VCheng]

..........................
There is nothing wrong with his post - he is merely articulating his interpretation of VCheng's comments, one that I share - whether that is VCheng's intent or not I cannot say, but his posts strongly imply exactly what the poster said.

Of course you are entitled to your opinion about my posts, just as sur is. I obviously disagree.

Pakistan has so far suggested nothing different, even while strongly refuting the latest unsubstantiated US allegations.

However, Pakistan is also, correctly, sticking to its position on not conducting a military operation in North Waziristan at the current time:

Pakistan will not attack Haqqani group, defying U.S.: report | Reuters

The US needs to collect itself and stop throwing temper tantrums and lashing about uncontrollably - that kind of behavior is not going to fix the complex problems in Afghanistan.

Your comments about perceived behavior notwithstanding, it is good to see that the situation is settling down.

US wont attack Pakistan... they are too smart for it.

The objective is to align goals, that is all. It should not take war to achieve them if sane and calm minds work at the issues from both sides.

 

[Porus]

Political statements and tall claims nothing else. We Pakistani are so gullible that we fall for 'big words' of politicians very easily. This is the ultimate tragedy of this nation.

Imran Khan led dharnas against NATO convoys and release of Raymond Davis miserably failed.

Common people in Pakistan are facing so much hardships that they seldom care about what is happening in Afghanistan and how are Pak-US relations proceeding.

People in many regions of NWFP and Khyber-Pakhtunkhwa are already fed up with WOT. They have faced the wrath of Taliban and then came the barrage of US drone attacks. Many have got displaced in those regions and are living like refugees. I wonder what is the degree of morale in those regions. I feel sorry for the affected people.

People in Sindh and Punjab have literally no idea about suffering of these people. Bunch of keyboard warriors and internet generals. United my ........

Additional US attacks will only increase the suffering of the affected people.

After amreeki attack PTI will plan a dharna in which Immu Bhai aka Dharna khan will be unable to take part because of some unknown reasons, then he will put his new bespoke tailored suit on and take a first class flight to London where he will address the small gatherings of rich Pakistanis in different five star hotels in order to collect money for the war-affected people of FATA.

P.S: My har-aw'wal dasta to defend our beloved mumlikat e khodadad e Pakistan against any Amreeki attack will be commanded by our ablest commanders Gen. Zaid Hamid and Gen. Orya Maqbool Jan. May Allah grant them shahadat. Ameen!

Edit: Damn, how could I forget fateh Jalalabad Gen. Hamid Gul?

 

[LeGenD]

It would be very foolish for the US to engage in full on, overt confrontation with Pakistan. Almost all of the US bases are in Eastern Afghanistan close to the Pakistan border region, Pakistan can easily destroy them in missile strikes, & then cut off the supply route from Pakistan. The US won't be able to launch drones into Pakistan: the bases will be destroyed, & even if there are some that aren't, Pakistan shutting off the supply routes would mean that fuel won't be able to reach Afghanistan to operate these drones. The route through Central Asia is even more dangerous than the Pakistan route, because the IMU's stronghold in Uzbekistan, Tajikistan & Northern Afghanistan (Kunduz, Takhar), as well as various other Al-Qaeda factions. Not to mention that it takes almost twice the time to get the supplies through this route, as well as the much higher costs. The US Forces will be trapped inside Afghanistan.

No need to underestimate the enemy.

US can attack through sea and Afghanistan. Also, northern routes are much safer then Pakistani routes contrary to your belief.

 

[Devil Soul]

US attack on Pakistan will be a catastrophic mistake, says PEW
Submitted 2 hrs 3 mins ago
The Pakistan Economy Watch (PEW) on Monday said a US attack on Pakistan would be a mistake as our country is not as weak as Iraq and Afghanistan and it will not offer easy victories to an over-stretched and dejected army.
Lashing out at old ally Pakistan is known American style to blame others for its humiliating failures, it said.
US took action against Cambodia when it failed to win Vietnam War and now they are planning to repeat the mistake without realising that their troops in Afghanistan are not away from Pakistan, said Dr. Murtaza Mughal, President of the Pakistan Economy Watch.
Talking to former officers of armed forces, he said that the US military has developed habit to attack small, weak nations but the pentagon experts who advocate attacking Pakistan are playing with fire. Such policies have already ruined American economy, he added.
He said that Pakistan can consider abandoning cooperation in war on terror and offer general amnesty to all insurgents to ensure peace.
Dr. Murtaza Mughal said that US is directly involved in recent attacks on Pakistani borders in which many security personnel were killed.
At the occasion, President of Pakistan Ex-Servicemen Society Lt. Gen (retd) Faiz Ali Chishti said that we are responsible for most of the problems.
He said that Pakistan needs a ruthless civilian administrator and a proper accountability system without which Pakistan will continue to suffer.
Other officials including Sq. Ldr. (retd) Liaquat Ansari, Col. (retd) Inam Rahim, Col. (retd) Khalid Mehmood, Col. (retd) Sajjad and others said that Abbottabad operation was a drama that has flopped.
They said that announcing amnesty for warriors is in the national interest. The former military officials said that many service members were awarded illegal punishments during Musharraf’s era and now they should be given a right to challenge sentences in the High Courts.
India had allowed right to appeal to the members of armed forces in 2007 which majority of the countries have done so decades back but Pakistan is yet to move in this direction, they said.
He said that defendants are not provided record of the proceedings which is against fundamental human rights, Constitution, and justice.
US attack on Pakistan will be a catastrophic mistake, says PEW | Pakistan | News | Newspaper | Daily | English | Online

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Fine. If you think Pakistan does not need to change anything since it is "right", then I will accept it, recognizing that being right but dead may not be the correct thing to do in my book.

Being 'right and alive' is even better, and I don't believe Pakistan will have a problem accomplishing that, your exaggerated sense of US capabilities and desire to engage in a war far more expensive and intractable notwithstanding.

What I said was that diplomacy will resolve this matter, and war is diplomacy by other means i.e. war is part of diplomacy. Hence diplomacy WILL resolve the matter, with or without the use of war.

For reasons already pointed out, that you contest in your response below, the US is unlikely to engage in war with Pakistan, and so long as Pakistan calls the current US bluff, the US WILL blink first, barring an isolated face saving 'raid' here or there.

What I said was this: As long as the extremist and terrorist movements exist only locally, with the strategic military resources inoperable, it is only more of a good thing from the US point of view.

In other words, an extremist takeover in Pakistan with access to strategic military resources would be more dangerous than one without those resources. Hence, from the US point of view, local extremist takeover that leads to a protracted localized civil war, without access to strategic military resources may be an acceptable outcome.

Please note that I am NOT making the argument that the absence of the Pakistani military would lessen the chances of terrorist attacks. If you still don't understand my point, please read the above paragraph, again.

There is no threat of an 'Islamist takeover' of Pakistan's nukes as long as the current institutions responsible for Pakistan's strategic programs continue to exist. Given the number of nuclear warheads Pakistan has, the amount of nuclear related infrastructure it has, it would be impossible to guarantee that all of that material could be secured by the US and/or allies in case of an unprovoked war to destroy the Pakistani military and State, which then exponentially increases the risk of extremist and terrorist movements gaining access to those 'strategic resources', compared to the current situation.

So unless you can support your argument of an 'Islamist takeover of Pakistan being likely in the current situation', the US would have no incentive to enter into an unprovoked war with Pakistan at the current time and create a destabilized State where extremist groups would thrive, potentially have access to chemical and nuclear weapons, and collaborate with other groups across South Asia, the Middle East and Central Asia.

---------- Post added at 08:41 AM ---------- Previous post was at 08:39 AM ----------

No need to underestimate the enemy.

US can attack through sea and Afghanistan. Also, northern routes are much safer then Pakistani routes contrary to your belief.

I agree - the US military capabilities cannot be underestimated - what needs to be done is highlight the cost of unprovoked aggression by the US against Pakistan, compared to the status quo, to both the US and the rest of the world, especially Europe, Asia and the Middle East.

 

[DarK-LorD]

US military has no barriers.
They have weapon systems,technology,doctrines which are the most sophisticated in the entire world.Actually they have a bag full of unheard tech as demonstrated by OBL raid.

Forget Pakistan even Russia,China won't be able to stand up to the US in an all out conventional war.ONlY way out for the Pakistan will be to launch a Guerrilla war.Iraq & Afghan war demonstrated that even insurgents can't stand up in front of US for more than 4-5 years.
US lost Vietnam because of never ending supply of arms from USSR.
China won't do USSR here,because it is not at a par with the USSR now.

 

[Black Widow]

Can some one please, provide a post where Mike mullen has advocated for Military attack on Pakistan??? Why Pakistani media is warmongering????

 

[nForce]

If this ever happens then the war will be fought on Pakistani territory and not US territory.
So,I dont know exactly how much of catastrophe it can bring to the US,but it will definitely be devastating for Pakistan.

 

[Mr. Khan]

Pakistan will not attack Haqqani group: Report - Pakistan News - IBNLive

Islamabad: Pakistan's military will not take action against the Haqqani militant group that Washington blames for an attack against its embassy in Kabul, despite mounting American pressure to do so, a Pakistani newspaper reported on Monday.
Army chief General Ashfaq Kayani held a "special" meeting with his top commanders on Sunday to discuss the security situation, the military said, after a week of tension and tit-for-tat rhetoric with the United States.
The United States accuses the Pakistani army's powerful spy agency of supporting the Haqqani militant group, a chief driver of violence in eastern Afghanistan and a serious obstacle to US President Barack Obama's plan to wind down a long war.

In stunningly blunt comments last week, the top US military officer called the Haqqani network a "veritable arm" of the ISI intelligence agency and accused Pakistan of providing support for the September 13 attack on its Kabul mission.
The Pakistani commanders agreed to resist US demands for an army offensive in North Waziristan, where the United States believes the Haqqani network is based, the Express Tribune reported, quoting an unnamed military official.
"We have already conveyed to the US that Pakistan cannot go beyond what it has already done," the official told the newspaper on condition of anonymity.
The unilateral American special forces raid that killed al Qaeda leader Osama bin Laden in a Pakistani town in May heavily strained ties between Washington and Islamabad.
Both sides appeared to be working to repair the damage and then a war of words erupted after the Kabul attack.
Underscoring the magnitude of tensions, Pakistani stocks fell over 2.7 percent on Monday, in part due to concerns about the worsening relations between Islamabad and Washington.
The United States has long pressed ally Pakistan to pursue the Haqqani network, one of the most lethal Taliban-allied Afghan groups fighting Western forces in Afghanistan.
Pakistan denies it supports the Haqqanis and says its army is too stretched battling its own Taliban insurgency to go after the network, which has an estimated 10,000-15,000 fighters.
Analysts say the Pakistani military could suffer heavy casualties if it were to attempt a crackdown on the group, which has developed extensive alliances with other militant organisations in the region, and has mastered the rugged mountain terrain.
Pakistan says Washington overlooks the sacrifices it has made since joining the US "war on terror" launched after the September 11, 2001 attacks on the United States.
Pakistani officials say about 5,000 soldiers and security forces have been killed fighting militants and 30,000 civilians have died.
Widespread anti-American sentiment in Pakistan also makes it difficult for the army to cave in to US pressure.
"Are we responsible for the attacks that Taliban do throughout the country. It was a big mistake of our rulers that they supported Americans," said Khan Alam Marwat, 40, a car salesman in Islamabad.
Sirajuddin Haqqani, who heads the Haqqani network, says the group no longer needs sanctuaries in Pakistan, and it feels safe operating in Afghanistan.
Two weeks ago, militants launched an assault against the US embassy and NATO headquarters in Kabul. US officials blamed those attacks on the Haqqani network.
US officials said there was intelligence, including intercepted phone calls, suggesting those attackers were in communication with people connected to Pakistan's principal spy agency, the Inter-Services Intelligence (ISI) directorate.
The Pakistan government and army have rejected the US allegations. On Saturday, Prime Minister Yusuf Raza Gilani rejected the charges as a sign of American "confusion and policy disarray".

Now face the consequences Pakistan...

 

[Donatello]

Pakistan will not attack Haqqani group: Report - Pakistan News - IBNLive

Islamabad: Pakistan's military will not take action against the Haqqani militant group that Washington blames for an attack against its embassy in Kabul, despite mounting American pressure to do so, a Pakistani newspaper reported on Monday.
Army chief General Ashfaq Kayani held a "special" meeting with his top commanders on Sunday to discuss the security situation, the military said, after a week of tension and tit-for-tat rhetoric with the United States.
The United States accuses the Pakistani army's powerful spy agency of supporting the Haqqani militant group, a chief driver of violence in eastern Afghanistan and a serious obstacle to US President Barack Obama's plan to wind down a long war.

In stunningly blunt comments last week, the top US military officer called the Haqqani network a "veritable arm" of the ISI intelligence agency and accused Pakistan of providing support for the September 13 attack on its Kabul mission.
The Pakistani commanders agreed to resist US demands for an army offensive in North Waziristan, where the United States believes the Haqqani network is based, the Express Tribune reported, quoting an unnamed military official.
"We have already conveyed to the US that Pakistan cannot go beyond what it has already done," the official told the newspaper on condition of anonymity.
The unilateral American special forces raid that killed al Qaeda leader Osama bin Laden in a Pakistani town in May heavily strained ties between Washington and Islamabad.
Both sides appeared to be working to repair the damage and then a war of words erupted after the Kabul attack.
Underscoring the magnitude of tensions, Pakistani stocks fell over 2.7 percent on Monday, in part due to concerns about the worsening relations between Islamabad and Washington.
The United States has long pressed ally Pakistan to pursue the Haqqani network, one of the most lethal Taliban-allied Afghan groups fighting Western forces in Afghanistan.
Pakistan denies it supports the Haqqanis and says its army is too stretched battling its own Taliban insurgency to go after the network, which has an estimated 10,000-15,000 fighters.
Analysts say the Pakistani military could suffer heavy casualties if it were to attempt a crackdown on the group, which has developed extensive alliances with other militant organisations in the region, and has mastered the rugged mountain terrain.
Pakistan says Washington overlooks the sacrifices it has made since joining the US "war on terror" launched after the September 11, 2001 attacks on the United States.
Pakistani officials say about 5,000 soldiers and security forces have been killed fighting militants and 30,000 civilians have died.
Widespread anti-American sentiment in Pakistan also makes it difficult for the army to cave in to US pressure.
"Are we responsible for the attacks that Taliban do throughout the country. It was a big mistake of our rulers that they supported Americans," said Khan Alam Marwat, 40, a car salesman in Islamabad.
Sirajuddin Haqqani, who heads the Haqqani network, says the group no longer needs sanctuaries in Pakistan, and it feels safe operating in Afghanistan.
Two weeks ago, militants launched an assault against the US embassy and NATO headquarters in Kabul. US officials blamed those attacks on the Haqqani network.
US officials said there was intelligence, including intercepted phone calls, suggesting those attackers were in communication with people connected to Pakistan's principal spy agency, the Inter-Services Intelligence (ISI) directorate.
The Pakistan government and army have rejected the US allegations. On Saturday, Prime Minister Yusuf Raza Gilani rejected the charges as a sign of American "confusion and policy disarray".

Now face the consequences Pakistan...

Indians are more worried about Pakistan than us......Schizophrenia at it's best.

 

[VCheng]

AM: So what is it - Are US capabilities exaggerated, or they cannot be underestimated? Obviously, it would be a good srategy on your part to exaggerate Pakistan's abilities to increase the cost to the US, but will that be effective or indded prohibitive. I think not, and I know you will differ with that.