US okays sale of 8 Global Response Cutters to Pakistan

[Secur]

R&D is an expensive endeavor without immediate dividends. Pakistan has chosen to spend its resources on applied technologies with direct benefits.

Its not a broad-spectrum cure, as Pakistanis seem to think. Not every technology is available for sale, sooner or later you will have to revert to R&D. This is a short-term solution.

Are you for real?

Oh of course, all the Pakistani projects and acquistions, are being funded, since time immemorial, by the Arabs or at least thats what the naive Pakistanis would like to believe

 

[VCheng]

Its not a broad-spectrum cure, as Pakistanis seem to think. Not every technology is available for sale, sooner or later you will have to revert to R&D. This is a short-term solution.

You are correct Sir, but as long as there is a shortage of funds due to a weak economy, short-term solutions are all that are possible.

 

[Donatello]

Oh so you were trolling as always by making off topic posts. I should not have responsed to such rubbish in that case. Go on.

Off topic?

What are Indians doing in this thread anyway? Other than BS-ing?

 

[C130]

8 ships for $350mil plus weapons and training I suppose.
doesn't sound that bad, but this is coming from a guy who sees his government waste billions on duds.

 

[surya kiran]

I won't get into your ejection seat theory, since an ejection seat is part of a system and under no law should it be allowed to make a decision by itself. If it is so, it is flawed design. It is the FCS that controls everything.

Now, to your second reply, there is this Australian company called 'Austal', which was founded in 1988 and had hardly 2000 employees, they are primary high speed craft makers in the luxury market segment (like yachts) , and yet they were able to secure the order for the 1st LCS of the USN i.e USS Independence, a much more complex undertaking than they had ever taken before. Does that mean a 'yacht' maker cannot foray into Major combat naval systems? Since, as a i am Think Tank and hence can use my brain, i would suggest, building that coast guard cutter is much simpler than building a 2000+ ton warship for the premier navy of the world.

The GRC43s were chosen by US Coast Guard as the company promised and delivered a product they wanted, and then later changed their requirements. So they were free to float the design on the market.

In case of Austal, they had experience in building aluminum hulls for catamarans/trimaran, and so USN was confident that they can transfer that experience into something bigger, more bad a** and they are now going to build the Spearhead class transporters as well.

So yea, the burden of stupidity and ignorance, is solely on you.

About your highlighted part, apparently the US Navy thinks that a yacht/cruise-liner maker can make their future combat vessels, more than an ignorant troll on internet.


Sheesh!

Since, you brought up the topic...was the littoral class combat ship bought without competition? Which companies were invited and with whom did Austal partner? Want to know which? General Dynamics. Three companies were invited for the initial design. You know what this means? Competition. To dumb it down for you further, they selected 2 of 3 designs. So there goes your logic of the LCS out of the window. But, then you already knew that and were just testing me right?

Now, since you agree that you are a TT, I would expect a bit of common sense also. Now, you can keep harping about how great it is that you just handed over a direct sale to a first time builder or go for the the competitive route and get a good bang for your buck.

BUt, then I am an ignorant troll who says compare designs instead of buying an unproven ship off the shelf! Think tanks, I say!

Off topic?

What are Indians doing in this thread anyway? Other than BS-ing?

Indians were saying go for more options. Instead of buying a ship which is not in service from a vendor who has never built defense ships for defense purposes! OOOO.....Indians are trolling!

 

[Cheetah786]

Yes man do you really believe the projects which are running right now from Textron to new Tanks to Fighter Jets to Ships and soon going for Submarines now cutters and many more things that we are doing in our short 8 billion dollar budget if you think so than you need to use brain some one is funding most of these projects and it can no one else than Arabs

Clearly, Zarvan i am the one in need of brain and its usage.

 

[My-Analogous]

 

[MilSpec]

Ships bigger and more complex than these can already be built in Pakistan. But these are Fiber Glass hulls, a new product. So it might be good idea to get some ToT, so similar, small designs can be built in house when the demands arise.

It's actually quite simpler and also cost effective measure...although you will need some big ovens to cure the hulls from mold and some good quality vartm rigs.

 

[Donatello]

It's actually quite simpler and also cost effective measure...although you will need some big ovens to cure the hulls from mold and some good quality vartm rigs.

Yup, but nothing that cannot be done, but if KSEW does venture into it, any investment would come from Government, so they better have plan to make $$$. Perhaps as CG and MSA replace older boats, new ones can be fiber glass hulls.15-100 ton range.

 

[MilSpec]

Yup, but nothing that cannot be done, but if KSEW does venture into it, any investment would come from Government, so they better have plan to make $$$. Perhaps as CG and MSA replace older boats, new ones can be fiber glass hulls.15-100 ton range.

The only issue with glass reinforced fiber composites is repairs, If the ship runs aground, or has any impact damage repair will be a big problem, Metal hulls are easy to repair some of them can also be repaired under water. For GRFC composites, it involves cutting windows in affected areas, contour matching and wet laminating with Biax fabric and marine resins, and the repair zones have never the uniform structural integrity compared to the rest of the structure due to compromised grain directions, whereas repaired zoned conventional metal hulls actually surpass the structural integrity of the rest of the hull....

 

[Burhan Wani]

View attachment 139241


GRC43M cutters are made of glass-reinforced plastic. (Westport Shipyards photo)


WASHINGTON, Oct 30, 2014 – The State Department has made a determination approving a possible Foreign Military Sale to Pakistan for GRC43M Cutters and associated equipment, parts, training and logistical support for an estimated cost of $350 million. The Defense Security Cooperation Agency delivered the required certification notifying Congress of this possible sale today.

The Government of Pakistan has requested the purchase of 8 43-meter Global Response Cutters (GRC43M). Each Cutter will be a mono-hull design made of Glass Reinforced Plastic (GRP). Also included in this sale: outfitted 8 25mm or 30mm Naval Gun Systems, 32 M2-HB .50 caliber machine guns, 32 7.62mm guns, 8 8- meter Rigid Inflatable Boats, ballistic/armor protection of critical spaces, command and control equipment, communication equipment, navigation equipment, support equipment, spare and repair parts, tools and test equipment, technical data and publications, personnel training, U.S. government and contractor engineering, technical, and logistics support services, and other related elements of logistics and program support. The total estimated cost is $350 million.

This proposed sale will contribute to the foreign policy and national security of the United States by helping to improve the security of a country vital to U.S. foreign policy and national security goals in South Asia.

This sale will enhance Pakistan’s ability to enforce the rule of law over its coastal areas to safeguard seaborne energy corridors, deter the outbreak of piracy along the north Arabian Sea, and curtail the trafficking of narcotics and other illicit goods. These vessels provide the Pakistan Navy with the capability for medium to long endurance coverage of its 660 miles of coastline. Pakistan will have no difficulty absorbing GRC43M Cutters into its armed forces.

This sale will not alter the basic military balance in the region.

The principal contractor will be WSY, Inc. in Port Angeles, Washington. There are no known offset agreements proposed in conjunction with this potential sale.

Implementation of this proposed sale will require multiple trips by U.S. Government and contractor representatives to participate in program and technical reviews plus training and maintenance support in country, on a short-term temporary basis, for a period of no more than 60 months or until the last Cutter is delivered to Pakistan and integrated into their operating forces.

There will be no adverse impact on U.S. defense readiness as a result of this proposed sale.

This notice of a potential sale is required by law and does not mean the sale has been concluded.

All questions regarding this proposed Foreign Military Sale should be directed to the State Department's Bureau of Political Military Affairs, Office of Congressional and Public Affairs, pm-cpa@state.gov



Pakistan – GRC43M Cutters | The Official Home of the Defense Security Cooperation Agency

Can you please mention about mounted radar system ...?

 

[HRK]

Courtesy of US taxpayers.

No, the cutters are being financed by USA to support its valuable ally Pakistan.

do you have any official 'link or source document' specifically related to this deal, to support both of your above quoted posts ....

 

[Donatello]

The only issue with glass reinforced fiber composites is repairs, If the ship runs aground, or has any impact damage repair will be a big problem, Metal hulls are easy to repair some of them can also be repaired under water. For GRFC composites, it involves cutting windows in affected areas, contour matching and wet laminating with Biax fabric and marine resins, and the repair zones have never the uniform structural integrity compared to the rest of the structure due to compromised grain directions, whereas repaired zoned conventional metal hulls actually surpass the structural integrity of the rest of the hull....

What you mentioned there is also a problem with metal hulls. It's not as easy as denting out a bump on your car (actually, even then, beyond a certain damage, you write the vehicle off) You need to make sure the strength of the metal repair/weld is equal or better than the previous one. That is why a lot of the ships that hit the reef/rocks are nothing but write offs. I agree, fiber glass isn't conventional, but hey, those who make these know how to fix them. Just like Carbon fiber based motor vehicles.

Lots of glue, plastics etc instead of metal sheets and welds.

 

[MilSpec]

What you mentioned there is also a problem with metal hulls. It's not as easy as denting out a bump on your car (actually, even then, beyond a certain damage, you write the vehicle off) You need to make sure the strength of the metal repair/weld is equal or better than the previous one. That is why a lot of the ships that hit the reef/rocks are nothing but write offs. I agree, fiber glass isn't conventional, but hey, those who make these know how to fix them. Just like Carbon fiber based motor vehicles.

Lots of glue, plastics etc instead of metal sheets and welds.

There are two basic reasons for that.
The hulls you are referring to are limited to large ships with denser hulls with brittle treated steel, The major reason is the cost of dry docking the ship, refit , testing and NDT for a large ship is very expensive proposition

next is allotropic polymorphism of grain structure during recrystalization of iron alloys with high carbon content , it is always difficult to match the same, but still as long as weldment process was adhered to as specified by the manufacturer, the repairs can be done.

My post was with reference to smaller ships, where steel/alloy/AL have the advantage in quick repair, especially if the application is in shallow water.

Additional fun fact is metal hull temporary repairs can be made at sea, I highly doubt that for composite materials, resins and hardeners do not stand any contamination or moisture.

 

[Arya Desa]

Where is pakistan getting the money to pay for this?