Ummah Yearnings

[SQ8]

Somebody has to take a start muse..
Its that "do or be killed" ideals that must be countered.

off topicish.. and not.
Interestingly, where it comes to research .. one of the earliest foundations for through research was layed when the hadiath were being collected.
The procedure followed, facts and figures checked...down to the minutest details.. would meet the toughest standards of research and critical reasoning today...

 

[TheStrantrunCurve]

Wheres the proof King Porus was a hindu? There is no proof he was a hindu. Stop claiming as if everything belongs to hindus.

We want Pakistanis to take pride in their actual history and civlization. We dont want your hindutva version of history. So no thank you. Keep your advice to yourself.

Do you really think you can convince Hindus that their religion was created by Britons who grouped all the thousands of cults together, Do you know why there is no founding father of Hinduism because brits are the real founding fathers, Hinduism became world religion in 19 century, The term hind was only used for geographic location not for any religion, This religion was created for their divide and rule policy, play one religion against the another and it will be easier to control people. We do not find the word “Hindu” in any ancient Hindu (Aryan) literature. The very term Hinduism was coined by brits in 18 century, Santana dharma another term created to replace the word Hindu by given by Muslim invaders.

Whenever the question is asked who the Hindus are, the familiar reply is the Hindus are none other than the Aryans. If asked what is the evidence to claim that they are Aryans, then they will produce their Rig-Veda to prove that they are Aryans.

Now the question is, do Hindus look like Aryans? We know Rig Veda hymns delineate the Indus and its tributaries from Punjab in the east to Afghanistan in the west. The river to which all these rivers hasten – ‘like mothers crying to their sons’ is the Sindhu (Indus). Rig Veda is about Punjab, principally; its vision also encompasses what is now eastern Afghanistan and North West Pakistan. Sind and peninsular India are unknown. There are rare mentions of rivers in the east (Bharti Rivers). The Yumna which runs through Delhi is invoked a handful times, The Ganges no more than twice at the most and the Saraswati, a fabled eastern river that dried up around 1000 BCE is only praised in later layers of text. To the sorrow of the Hindus, The Rig Veda has its heartland in Pakistan.

So the heartland of Rig Vedic Aryan is Eastern Afghanistan, NW Pakistan and Punjab, We can see Pushtun of eastern Afghanistan and north west Pakistan can be classified as Aryans and also some Punjabis but that cannot be said about Hindus of Bharat who are all Dravidian no matter how much they deny of their race.

Another question is, did the Rig Vedic Aryans worship idols? No they did not, in fact they denounced idol worshipping, Idol worshipping is a Dravidian religion not an Aryan religion and it is indigenous only to Bharat. The Rig-Veda consists of 1028 hymns. The 1028 hymns are arranged in ten books or mandalas, are a paen to the mystifying power of Nature. Rig Vedic Aryans were nature worshippers. The gods of Hinduism are consolingly anthropomorphic; but those in the Rig Veda are natural phenomena: Agni (fire), Aditi (dawn), Indra (thunder) and Sindhu. Bhartis should change the names of their missiles which they named after ancient Pakistani gods. Those Aryans who migrated to Ganges valley later denounced the Aryans of Indus valley. Mountains and deserts of Indus valley even the lush Punjab were vilified fit only for Mlecchas. Now why should I accept my ancestors were Hindus when the very religion they hated was the idol worshipping, I have no doubt that Porus was not a Hindu, he must a nature worshipper.

Where those five rivers flow.......which have Sindhu for their sixth............those regions are without virtue and religion. No one should go hither

When NW Pakistan and Punjab was made part of Pakistan fake archaeological material was concocted to prove Rig Vedic had its heartland in Ganges Valley which was a much later phenomena just as all the major cities of Indus Valley civilization came in Pakistan, The sad Hindus of Bharat concocted fake archaeological materials in Gujarat, Khalistan and Rajasthan but still most of historian to come to Pakistan for archaeological evidence this is why the name of civilization is INDUS VALLEY NOT BHARTA VALLEY.

Bharat has started a campaign of renaming cities back to the local name from an English/Persian/Arabic names, They have changed names of Bombay, Calcutta, Bangalore, Chennai, dozen others and dozens of other cities names are about be changed Ahmadabad to Karnavati.

But these bigots won’t change the name of India because when they do that they would also lose their stolen history hijacked from Pakistan

 

[muse]

To all friends - Please read "The Horse, The Wheel and Language" -- If you are interested in the archeological record , if you have wondered about how the Horse, the Wheel and the so called Aryan and proto aryan may have sounded like and how a dead language may be recreated, if you are fascinated that the Vedas reference events and locations now identified as a area of modern day Syria and if you wish to conduct a search on the internet with regard to studies the genealogical origins of the Pakistanis population (Punjab being the majority and an interesting correlation with Modern day Syrian population groups)

Anyways. Read it - debate, I think you'll really enjoy it.

 

[Moorkh]

Do you really think you can convince Hindus that their religion was created by Britons who grouped all the thousands of cults together, Do you know why there is no founding father of Hinduism because brits are the real founding fathers, Hinduism became world religion in 19 century, The term hind was only used for geographic location not for any religion, This religion was created for their divide and rule policy, play one religion against the another and it will be easier to control people. We do not find the word “Hindu” in any ancient Hindu (Aryan) literature. The very term Hinduism was coined by brits in 18 century, Santana dharma another term created to replace the word Hindu by given by Muslim invaders.

Whenever the question is asked who the Hindus are, the familiar reply is the Hindus are none other than the Aryans. If asked what is the evidence to claim that they are Aryans, then they will produce their Rig-Veda to prove that they are Aryans.

Now the question is, do Hindus look like Aryans? We know Rig Veda hymns delineate the Indus and its tributaries from Punjab in the east to Afghanistan in the west. The river to which all these rivers hasten – ‘like mothers crying to their sons’ is the Sindhu (Indus). Rig Veda is about Punjab, principally; its vision also encompasses what is now eastern Afghanistan and North West Pakistan. Sind and peninsular India are unknown. There are rare mentions of rivers in the east (Bharti Rivers). The Yumna which runs through Delhi is invoked a handful times, The Ganges no more than twice at the most and the Saraswati, a fabled eastern river that dried up around 1000 BCE is only praised in later layers of text. To the sorrow of the Hindus, The Rig Veda has its heartland in Pakistan.

So the heartland of Rig Vedic Aryan is Eastern Afghanistan, NW Pakistan and Punjab, We can see Pushtun of eastern Afghanistan and north west Pakistan can be classified as Aryans and also some Punjabis but that cannot be said about Hindus of Bharat who are all Dravidian no matter how much they deny of their race.

Another question is, did the Rig Vedic Aryans worship idols? No they did not, in fact they denounced idol worshipping, Idol worshipping is a Dravidian religion not an Aryan religion and it is indigenous only to Bharat. The Rig-Veda consists of 1028 hymns. The 1028 hymns are arranged in ten books or mandalas, are a paen to the mystifying power of Nature. Rig Vedic Aryans were nature worshippers. The gods of Hinduism are consolingly anthropomorphic; but those in the Rig Veda are natural phenomena: Agni (fire), Aditi (dawn), Indra (thunder) and Sindhu. Bhartis should change the names of their missiles which they named after ancient Pakistani gods. Those Aryans who migrated to Ganges valley later denounced the Aryans of Indus valley. Mountains and deserts of Indus valley even the lush Punjab were vilified fit only for Mlecchas. Now why should I accept my ancestors were Hindus when the very religion they hated was the idol worshipping, I have no doubt that Porus was not a Hindu, he must a nature worshipper.

Where those five rivers flow.......which have Sindhu for their sixth............those regions are without virtue and religion. No one should go hither

When NW Pakistan and Punjab was made part of Pakistan fake archaeological material was concocted to prove Rig Vedic had its heartland in Ganges Valley which was a much later phenomena just as all the major cities of Indus Valley civilization came in Pakistan, The sad Hindus of Bharat concocted fake archaeological materials in Gujarat, Khalistan and Rajasthan but still most of historian to come to Pakistan for archaeological evidence this is why the name of civilization is INDUS VALLEY NOT BHARTA VALLEY.

Bharat has started a campaign of renaming cities back to the local name from an English/Persian/Arabic names, They have changed names of Bombay, Calcutta, Bangalore, Chennai, dozen others and dozens of other cities names are about be changed Ahmadabad to Karnavati.

But these bigots won’t change the name of India because when they do that they would also lose their stolen history hijacked from Pakistan

i would be glad to discuss all this with you and there is a thread on the same on PDF. Look it up. However this thread isnt about who is an aryan or India stealing Pakistani heritage. This thread is about the concept of Ummah.

Lets not derail it any further.

 

[justanobserver]

Pure Aryans on the prowl !

 

[Truth Teller]

i would be glad to discuss all this with you and there is a thread on the same on PDF. Look it up. However this thread isnt about who is an aryan or India stealing Pakistani heritage. This thread is about the concept of Ummah.

Lets not derail it any further.

Because you dont have a proper reply.

 

[Truth Teller]

Bengal was also divided. So you are factually wrong.

You are factually wrong yourself.

Bengal was not partitioned in 1947. Bengal was partitioned in 1905.

Anyway, I am from a part of India that was part of the united Punjab. My grandparents saw the partition violence, we have had neighbors who lost all in the violence and came empty handed from West Punjab.

I doubt that.

 

[PlanetWarrior]

Do you really think you can convince Hindus that their religion was created by Britons who grouped all the thousands of cults together, Do you know why there is no founding father of Hinduism because brits are the real founding fathers, Hinduism became world religion in 19 century, The term hind was only used for geographic location not for any religion, This religion was created for their divide and rule policy, play one religion against the another and it will be easier to control people. We do not find the word “Hindu” in any ancient Hindu (Aryan) literature. The very term Hinduism was coined by brits in 18 century, Santana dharma another term created to replace the word Hindu by given by Muslim invaders.

Whenever the question is asked who the Hindus are, the familiar reply is the Hindus are none other than the Aryans. If asked what is the evidence to claim that they are Aryans, then they will produce their Rig-Veda to prove that they are Aryans.

Now the question is, do Hindus look like Aryans? We know Rig Veda hymns delineate the Indus and its tributaries from Punjab in the east to Afghanistan in the west. The river to which all these rivers hasten – ‘like mothers crying to their sons’ is the Sindhu (Indus). Rig Veda is about Punjab, principally; its vision also encompasses what is now eastern Afghanistan and North West Pakistan. Sind and peninsular India are unknown. There are rare mentions of rivers in the east (Bharti Rivers). The Yumna which runs through Delhi is invoked a handful times, The Ganges no more than twice at the most and the Saraswati, a fabled eastern river that dried up around 1000 BCE is only praised in later layers of text. To the sorrow of the Hindus, The Rig Veda has its heartland in Pakistan.

So the heartland of Rig Vedic Aryan is Eastern Afghanistan, NW Pakistan and Punjab, We can see Pushtun of eastern Afghanistan and north west Pakistan can be classified as Aryans and also some Punjabis but that cannot be said about Hindus of Bharat who are all Dravidian no matter how much they deny of their race.

Another question is, did the Rig Vedic Aryans worship idols? No they did not, in fact they denounced idol worshipping, Idol worshipping is a Dravidian religion not an Aryan religion and it is indigenous only to Bharat. The Rig-Veda consists of 1028 hymns. The 1028 hymns are arranged in ten books or mandalas, are a paen to the mystifying power of Nature. Rig Vedic Aryans were nature worshippers. The gods of Hinduism are consolingly anthropomorphic; but those in the Rig Veda are natural phenomena: Agni (fire), Aditi (dawn), Indra (thunder) and Sindhu. Bhartis should change the names of their missiles which they named after ancient Pakistani gods. Those Aryans who migrated to Ganges valley later denounced the Aryans of Indus valley. Mountains and deserts of Indus valley even the lush Punjab were vilified fit only for Mlecchas. Now why should I accept my ancestors were Hindus when the very religion they hated was the idol worshipping, I have no doubt that Porus was not a Hindu, he must a nature worshipper.

Where those five rivers flow.......which have Sindhu for their sixth............those regions are without virtue and religion. No one should go hither

When NW Pakistan and Punjab was made part of Pakistan fake archaeological material was concocted to prove Rig Vedic had its heartland in Ganges Valley which was a much later phenomena just as all the major cities of Indus Valley civilization came in Pakistan, The sad Hindus of Bharat concocted fake archaeological materials in Gujarat, Khalistan and Rajasthan but still most of historian to come to Pakistan for archaeological evidence this is why the name of civilization is INDUS VALLEY NOT BHARTA VALLEY.

Bharat has started a campaign of renaming cities back to the local name from an English/Persian/Arabic names, They have changed names of Bombay, Calcutta, Bangalore, Chennai, dozen others and dozens of other cities names are about be changed Ahmadabad to Karnavati.

But these bigots won’t change the name of India because when they do that they would also lose their stolen history hijacked from Pakistan

I just glanced through your submissions and note that where acheology goes against your presumptions you are then quick to label it "concocted fake archeological material." Just on a quick response to your view ... hypothetically , if Saudi Arabia falls to Christian occupation is it then your view that Islam as a religion should cease to exist and that any person who continues with the practice of Islam are wasting their time? In fact the heartland of Christianity being Jeruslam is now in the hands of the Jews, so by your logic Christians who practice their faith internationally are fooling themselves. We don't care if you as a Muslim majority population were given the heart of the Rig Vedas or the territory which was once ruled by Maharaj Porus. The fact of the matter is whether the Rig Veda is the foundation of or the authority of what is now the practice of Hinduism is immaterial (Sanathan Dharma was termed by invading Muslims ??). In that statement lies evidence of your distortion of history to suit your agenda. "Hinduism" was a term coined by the Persians who came into contact with "those who live across the Sindhu River". Initially the term was "Sindhus" and was changed to "Hindus" by the Persians over the years to describe the brownies (yup including you Pakistanis) living across the Sindhu River.By the time of the arrival of the Brits, this was a well established term. Sanathan Dharma was the term coined by the so-called Hindus who resented the term Hindu to describe their way of life and their ideologies. Please stop distorting terms and origins to pacify your biased religious ego. Join the Ummah if you feel that you can convince the remaining Islamic world that you are fit to be part of an Ummah. Claim the Rig Veda and other Hindu kings as part of Pakistani history if it indeed belongs to your country. You may have to deal with a flood of Hindu pilgrams but that will benefit your tourist industry so why complain. Just back off proclaiming yourself to be an expert on a subject matter which you have no knowledge about. Also please stop playing the British distorted version of Indian sub-continent history by discussing Aryans and Dravidians like there was some Aryan invasion of the Indian sub-continent. I find it hillarious when I hear misinformed Muslims of the sub-continent talking about that theory in the zeal to demonstrate that they are a superior religion. In fact one individual went so far as to claim that all Muslims including the converted folks of Southern India are Aryans whilst folks of other religions in the Indian sub-continent are Dravidians. I guess that will be taught in Pakistani school text books in 20 years time

 

[T-Faz]

we actually do claim every civilization since and including the IVC. while our claim to the IVC might be weak, we do have a strong right to the vedic civilization and the ones after that. after all we inherited the culture.

Your claim is weak and we as a people of this land strongly identify it as a precursor to our culture.

 

[PlanetWarrior]

Your claim is weak and we as a people of this land strongly identify it as a precursor to our culture.

Indeed. It is precursor to your culture which many Pakistanis on this forum deny. It is however a precursor to the Hindu religion. Therefore facts should not be denied or distorted to suit egos

 

[T-Faz]

Indeed. It is precursor to your culture which many Pakistanis on this forum deny. It is however a precursor to the Hindu religion. Therefore facts should not be denied or distorted to suit egos

Barelvi Islam is very much influenced by Hindu customs and rituals.

It was and still is the majority followed sect in Pakistan.

Odd isn't it, the one sect that is dominant in Pakistan is influenced by Hinduism while the one which originated in India, Deobandi, is very rigid and aggressively opposed to Hinduism.

 

[muse]

Indeed. It is precursor to your culture which many Pakistanis on this forum deny. It is however a precursor to the Hindu religion. Therefore facts should not be denied or distorted to suit egos

Just easy just take it nice and easy -- histories are complicated creations it doesn't do to get dogmatic - understand? All of these CREATIONS deserve to be respected for what they are - there is no point to imbuing any of them with "the truth"

 

[PlanetWarrior]

Just easy just take it nice and easy -- histories are complicated creations it doesn't do to get dogmatic - understand? All of these CREATIONS deserve to be respected for what they are - there is no point to imbuing any of them with "the truth"

The "truth" depends on one's opinion. The facts however must be proven. Example. Hence I find it puzzling when Indians claim King Porus as their hero whilst Pakistanis seem oblivious to his historical feat of taking on the world's then most powerful army. The fact of the matter is that King Porus was ruler of territory which is now incorporated into Pakistan. That is clearly not dogmatic but purely an indisputable fact.

 

[Vinod2070]

You are factually wrong yourself.

Bengal was not partitioned in 1947. Bengal was partitioned in 1905.

What was East Pakistan (Bangladesh now)?

Do you know that the 1905 partition was reversed? You need to know basic facts first.

I doubt that.

I couldn't care less.

 

[Muhammad-Bin-Qasim]

We grow up with this nonsense about Bin Qasim being our hero, how shameful to have a hero who was killed brutally just because he did not send some slave girl to Arabia for the kings pleasure.

I would never want a hero like this so called man whose goal was to capture and send a beautiful girl to the king for gratification.

In reality when the Arabs first came to this region, they were heavily defeated at Makran by the local people.

Raja Dahir is our hero, he gave shelter to the family of Mohammed (SAW) when they were being hunted down, he fought bravely.

Even though his later life is controversial, he made this region proud, the arabs won later only because the locals supported them.

But alas, they were kicked out again.

I have only recently started reading and learning about history, we are a people of a great civilization and we have a great past.

We do not need to borrow a shameful history of another people, we have our own.

what a joke... why not we all become a Hindu...

and TFaz... heres a sincere warning... be very very careful when you approach History... You ll find it full of lies and propaganda... I am only saying this because I know how history is used by opposing forces...

Raja Dahir was our hero... gimme a break...