U.S. to give Pakistan 12 Shadow Drones

[illuminatus]

You have clearly portrayed yourself and your intentions.. which is to troll with your english book worm skills.. i will give you a thumbs up for that but thumbs down to your BS analogy.

The feeling is mutual king of BS. You're a pathetic being that resorts to insults when unable to rationally counter sane arguments. You accuse people and insult them when they confront you with facts. Your personality is full of arrogance and anger. You need to change your frustrating behaviour.

Man what the hell what the F are you even arguing about in the first place? Do you just like to argue for the sake of it? As far as i understand your argument started that US wants to destroy pakistan and by giving 12 Shadow drones they will demand us to do more and probably start a new front in Baluchistan! You are seriously a nerd dumb@ss. Rest of your post is just BULLSH!T. I am allergic to it.

Arguing? Are you bloody kidding me?! I'm just answering your accusation levelled against me. When did I say that the US wants to destroy Pakistan? Again, quote me and provide me with proof where I claimed all this nonsense. Yes, the Americans will demand to extend the WoT in other parts of Pakistan. Why are you making such a fuss about this issue? Is it a secret to you that the Americans want to open another front in Quetta which is part of Baluchistan? Have you already forgotten the words of the American diplomat that claimed that there exists a Quetta Shura which is high on the US list? I always backup my claims. Read the following: DAWN.COM | World | Patterson says Quetta Shura high on US list You're full of nonsensical crap and I owned you in every way possible. You're allergic to my posts because you're unable to counter my facts.

This is not called "strings" attached! Chinese French Ameraicans have been doing this ever since PAF bought any aircrafts. Do you think China is just gonna sit quite if USAF personals inspect latest Chinese equipments? But again its too hard for your nerd brain to comprehend this so all you are gonna do is come up with another BS lengthy argument. Every country that feels any threat of their equipments being leaked to other unwanted country they have the right to do so. We all like to talk about sending this and that US equipments to Chinese lab for revers-engineering and you expect US to keep quite and keep supplying us with latest technologies?

Conditions have never before been so intrusive and stringent. Certainly, every country has some level of conditionality attached to their hardware. However, end monitoring of hardware in such an intrusive manner is something very unacceptable for a sovereign nation. Under such rigid and ridiculous conditionality the F-16s are only allowed to be used when the US allows them to be used. The conditions also take Indian perspective into consideration which is repugnant to say the least. The US senate has debated and demanded such invasive conditions because they don't trust Pakistan and China as you rightly point out. However, Pakistan understands US concerns which are very legitimate. Pakistan has given assurances to the US that China will not be allowed near the F-16s. Circumstances since the embargo have changed dramatically. The US needs Pakistan and vice versa to a certain extent.

Kid the thing is you do not know anything regarding military requirements. You are nothing but a conspiracy theorist.

Puttar, the thing is that you're full of crap and know nothing about military requirements yourself. You're an angry and frustrated being filled with hot air. That's your reality. You get angry and abusive when people confront you with facts and are unable to provide answers. Keep it up beta.

PAF aint gonna waist 4+ billion dollars on just "training" learning platform?... oh god that is just to dumb to read... it almost made me barf. yeekkk..
ya leave that topic for someone else with better knowledge meanwhile you keep wasting this forum bandwidth with your useless conspiracy theories.. and the same time i havent seen a bigger self contradictory then you.

Puttar, training is part of the deal. How else is PAF supposed to fly these machines effectively without any proper training? These are advanced machines with new capabilities for PAF! Are you going to fly them for PAF? Also, learn to spell properly. Learn some proper grammar before barking like an emotional idiot. Again, resorting to barking and insults. We can expect that from someone like you. Someone that has learnt no manners. Someone that lacks self-respect and only knows how to abuse.

First claiming that US will provide pakistan with 12 shadow drones to meet their demands which is for self destruction? Then crying that US should supply pakistan with UCAV? what do you want with this country man? do you want it to be wiped out?

PS: if you again post a lengthy BS conspiracy post i am simply gonna ignore it and dont care what ever impression you have that you have won the argument. ya go on nerd.

Puttar, you're confused and fabricating all kinds of nonsensical lies. I've never claimed that Pakistan will be destroyed by the US! I've only claimed that by providing the UAVs the US will start pressuring Pakistan to do more. By the way, a deal which amounts to peanuts and doesn't solve the urgent need for UCAVs. They will ask Pakistan to extend the WoT to other parts of Pakistan. I'm not the only one demanding for UCAVs. So are the PA and the GoP demanding UCAVs. Get your facts straight you silly being. I want Pakistan to be sovereign! I want Pakistan to say no when it's justified to disagree. I want the PA to carry out drone attacks instead of CIA agents showing no regard and remorse by massacring innocent civilians. I don't want Pakistan to bow under pressure like you. That's what I want! You coward, claim your legitimate right.

PS. Don't threaten me with BS. I'll write lengthy posts if it pleases me. Also, there is no way round countering your moronic BS in detail. You leave me with no choice, but I don't bow when abused with hotheaded rhetoric. At least, that will also keep you shut. Your inability to fully counter and answer my arguments also vindicates me! Now, choke on that!

 

[SekrutYakhni]

Good job. Now that you have obeyed my orders (DO NOT POST BS CONSPIRACY) I will love to burst your bubble again.
DUDE you did not prove anything wrong. PA is just too embarrassed to except these 12 shadows because it is simply not enough to combat terrorism, not that US will demand PA to destroy half of pakistan. PA needs AH-1Z and UCAV and thats what they are asking for.

So you think UCAV's will play cricket with us?
They are meant to kill people and they will. Can't you listen to the echos of Balochistan operation by the U.S.? They want us to go everywhere its all over the media. They gave us Cobras not to play with them instead to shoot. They will give more weapons if we resist and they want us to expand. Half of Pakistan means to go everywhere they want us to go.

 

[illuminatus]

Good job. Now that you have obeyed my orders (DO NOT POST BS CONSPIRACY) I will love to burst your bubble again.
DUDE you did not prove anything wrong. PA is just too embarrassed to except these 12 shadows because it is simply not enough to combat terrorism, not that US will demand PA to destroy half of pakistan. PA needs AH-1Z and UCAV and thats what they are asking for.

Read my previous post you spineless coward. I've brought you to your knees. You're unable to counter my arguments and are only showing your cowardly face to everyone on this forum. Your kind are willing to sell Pakistan for a nickel and dime. Scared of confronting the US even when it's your God given right to do so. Now, you're blaming the PA! Look at this moron! First he accuses me that I pretend to know things better than the PA and PAF. Now, he himself is accusing the PA of being embarrassed. Talking about applying double standards. OMG you're confused and contradicting yourself!

PS. Keep on humiliating yourself. The key is in your hand. Just give up or be ready to be humiliated even more. I'll not pity you any more.

 

[Imran Khan]

Good job. Now that you have obeyed my orders (DO NOT POST BS CONSPIRACY) I will love to burst your bubble again.
DUDE you did not prove anything wrong. PA is just too embarrassed to except these 12 shadows because it is simply not enough to combat terrorism, not that US will demand PA to destroy half of pakistan. PA needs AH-1Z and UCAV and thats what they are asking for.

growler my dear brother

don't be stuber on this issue .beleve me its junk junk junk.we have much much super systems then this .snd you knoe we have to make our value you agree on less you can't get much ever.i think we have to kick them they will offer soon good equpment which can load waipons also.you pushing on same word again and again open your eyes and analize all of top bross genrals which are 3 time old then us which have 40 years militry experince they are says its junk.sorry i beleve them not you.

 

[illuminatus]

^^ Everyone disagrees with the deal. He only attacks and abuses me in this thread. Perhaps he thought that he can take on this new rookie with just 400+ posts. Too bad for him that he has chosen the wrong person.

 

[Imran Khan]

^^ Everyone disagrees with the deal. He only attacks and abuses me in this thread. Perhaps he thought that he can take on this new rookie with just 400+ posts. Too bad for him that he has chosen the wrong person.

even disagree be united its our basic need of today. and respect is important also.

 

[illuminatus]

even disagree be united its our basic need of today. and respect is important also.

I agree. I've never abused him yet countered his arguments rationally. The posts are there to be read by everyone. He thought that I was an easy prey.

PS. United we shall remain despite our disagreements.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Everyone calm down now.

Disagreements can be handled with civility, and even if the other side is uncivil, no need to resort to the same yourselves and trash the entire thread.

 

[PAFAce]

Pakistan never asked for the Shadow drone, and the Americans are well aware that we have something as capable. That makes me wonder, why would Mr. Gates stick out his neck by openly offering the Shadow UAV?

My guess is that the Americans were given the false impression by someone in the Pakistani government that the Army would settle for such an offer. I won't put it past Mr. Haqqani or Mr. Malik to try something like this, they would love to pacify the Army, even if it means compromising on a serious requirement.

Really, this entire thing reeks of politics, it just doesn't make sense for someone as knowledgeable as Gates to say what he did without being confident he wouldn't be snubbed.

Everyone calm down now.

Disagreements can be handled with civility, and even if the other side is uncivil, no need to resort to the same yourselves and trash the entire thread.

Thank you, AgNoStIc. Please keep a close eye, certain members love to get into mud-slinging contests.

when DG ISPR Major General Athar Abbas was asked about the overall weapons being provided to Pakistan for counterinsurgency and other military supplies, he remarked, “Too little, too late”.

I was not aware of this comment by the ISPR. Seems the members of this board had it right all along. I believe the Army is now taking a much awaited stance against the less-than-encouraging US attitude. About damn time.

As if on cue, the Pakistan military’s announcement that it could not overstretch itself in fresh areas of operation also saw Gates admitting to a query that a ‘trust deficit’ existed. “There is responsibility on both sides. From the US side, we turned away from Afghanistan in 1989. We could have remained engaged but we did not even try. Then the Pressler Amendment brought an end to military-to-military conversation for 12 years when we had no contacts. We cannot rebuild trust through rhetoric,” he said.

Hear, hear. First Hillary Clinton and now Gates have admitted to the sins of the past. I only hope certain American members on this board would do the same, and we can hopefully start discussing reconciliation. It's difficult to come to an agreement when one party refuses to face its deamons.

He said he was unaware that at the forthcoming London conference, a formal role would be offered to India. But he acknowledged that India had significant development programmes.

Let's keep a close eye on this. This could very well let us know where the US presently stands in terms of the Pakistan-India issue.

Calling al-Qaeda a cancer, Gates did not mince his words when he said: “They are all bad”. Refusing to distinguish between the Pakistani Taliban, Afghan Taliban, al-Qaeda, Haqqani network and the various Lashkars, he said it would be a mistake to look at them individually.

If it's okay to differentiate between the "low-level" Taliban, or the foot-soldiers, and the "high-level" Taliban, then it seems reasonable to me to identify the Taliban according to their different objectives. You can't bundle them all into one and deny the differences outright. They all pose a threat to the region, no doubt, but some can be made to surrender, others controlled and others must be destroyed. Why is it okay to negoatiate with a certain level of Afghan Taliban and still consider them all one big entity. Seems self contradictory to me, or at the very least, seems like Mr. Gates doesn't want Pakistan to engage in negotiations while the Americans and Afghans do the very same across the border.

 

[TaimiKhan]

PAFAce Sir, this is a one sided offer only, PA or the govt did not even hint or asked for this drone. Have you seen its size. Same or better drones are already being utilized by PA & superior ones by PAF. And what will 12 drones make a difference ??? NIL. We already have dozens of superior capability drones flying daily inside the country and across the border.

Basically gates, for his stupid remarks in India, knew will face the fire from Pakistani audience, so to cool things down, he made the stupid offer, which backfired, it was to basically from the start.

 

[illuminatus]

If it's okay to differentiate between the "low-level" Taliban, or the foot-soldiers, and the "high-level" Taliban, then it seems reasonable to me to identify the Taliban according to their different objectives. You can't bundle them all into one and deny the differences outright. They all pose a threat to the region, no doubt, but some can be made to surrender, others controlled and others must be destroyed. Why is it okay to negoatiate with a certain level of Afghan Taliban and still consider them all one big entity. Seems self contradictory to me, or at the very least, seems like Mr. Gates doesn't want Pakistan to engage in negotiations while the Americans and Afghans do the very same across the border.

Very well pointed out. The Americans have a habit of applying double standards. We can safely assume that the US wants to use the PA as their proxy pawn in the fight against insurgents. They don't care about the deteriorating security situation in Pakistan. Would I be wrong to assume that the Americans actually wish to see the security situation deteriorate in Pakistan? At the same time, the Americans have the audacity to negotiate and differentiate between low and high level Taliban. Who are they kidding here? When Pakistan negotiates with miscreants the Americans accuse us of differentiating between the bad guys. Yet, when they resort to same tactics it's hailed as a brave and smart move for the sake of peace.

 

[SekrutYakhni]

Talking strictly about Pakistani members in this forum..we still have many opposite views of American policies in the region. Cant' we agree on one point? I have seen think tank members having different versions of American Policy. I think we should all agree on one point and from there a "meaningful" discussion will start.

 

[Myth_buster_1]

To cut the long story short!
Pakistan should demand better technology and at the same time something that is realistic.
Ah-1Z

With Hellfire

UH-1Y to supplement AH-1Z

MQ-1 Predator

Or
MQ-1C Warrior (very unlikely)

 

[TaimiKhan]

Growler, if in 8 years they have not given, why do you expect or demand it now.

Leave it, we should concentrate for making our own and get the missiles from the Chinese, or any other good missile from the market.

The Chinese HJ-10 is in service and is said to be in the same league of Hellfire.

I hope and believe AWC would already be considering this option.

 

[illuminatus]

To cut the long story short!
Pakistan should demand better technology and at the same time something that is realistic.
Ah-1Z

With Hellfire

UH-1Y to supplement AH-1Z

MQ-1 Predator

Or
MQ-1C Warrior (very unlikely)

Now we talking brother! Exactly what we require at this moment!