Two Opposing Terms: Islamic and Republic

[freelancer93]

Jinnah kept the Islamism 1000 feet away from him

This is why

most of the big name Ullu-Ma like madar pidar Azad mullah Azad, or murdoodi Mullah modoodi all were against Pakistan and called Jinnah names,

not only that

these Ullu-Mas were Congreshite leaders and supporters.

Nehru writes in his biography

how madar pidar Azad mullah Azad would go to him to get bags of money.


Please read history and you will see how Islamist almost murdered Jinnah

And

how Islamism is murdering Jinnah's country aka Pakistan.


Thank you.



Please read the history and definition of Republic starting from Plato.

Then come back and post your views.

Right now your post shows you have no idea what you are talking about.


Thank you.

Sure, maybe it does not make any sense in ur mind ...which Im not sure how it really works but for ur satisfaction..

Republic:

"a state in which supreme power is held by the people and their elected representatives, and which has an elected or nominated president rather than a monarch."

want a link ? republic: definition of republic in Oxford dictionary (British & World English)

We do have supreme power of Allah and yes our people do elect representatives, maybe u don't see it but we do.

 

[Bilal.]

What's in a name? that which we call a rose
By any other name would smell as sweet.”

Stop focusing on the semantics and times gone by, clear your heads and focus on the future of your motherland, for your children and their children -children.

-----
His name was Nanji Jafar. He came in, sat in the rocking-chair and said that, as far as he knew, he was in his eighties. Though he had been at school with Jinnah, all he could recall was, “I played marbles with him in the street…” When I asked, “Can you remember anything he said to you?” he looked from beneath his thick brows and repeated, “I played marbles in the street with him.”



I asked him to close his eyes and to see, once more, the coloured glass marbles in the dust. Nanji Jafar closed his eyes and deeper into his memory: then he told his only anecdote of Jinnah’s boyhood. One morning, when Nanji Jafar was playing in the street, Jinnah, then aged about fourteen, came up to him and said, “Don’t play marbles in the dust; it spoils your clothes and dirties your hands. We must stand up and play cricket.”



The boys in Newnham Road were obedient: they gave up playing marbles and allowed Jinnah to lead them from the dusty street to a bright field where he brought his bat and stumps for them to use. When he sailed for England at the age of sixteen, he gave Nanji Jafar his bat and said, “You will go on teaching the boys to play cricket while I am away.”



All Jinnah’s story is in the boyhood dictum – “Stand up from the dust so that your clothes are unspoiled and your hands clean for the tasks that fall to them….

All that is fine BUT BUT BUT... First let us safely conclude ke kawa haram hai ya halal and how many angles can dance on a pins head

 

[FaujHistorian]

We do have supreme power of Allah .

Who are WE

and

how do "We do have supreme power of Allah"?

Why such a standard mutalae Pakistan statement?

Why?

Do you ever stop to thing, that you really do not POSSESS supreme power of Allah?

but in reality that so called supreme political power is usurped by Ayatullahs Roohullahs and other blind Mullahs?


Do you even for one second stop and think?

or it will continue to be the case of Summun Bookmun?

 

[qamar1990]

So many Pakistanis use and abuse history and continue to be ignorant.

One such case is the use of two terms associated by Pakistan.

Islamic and Republic.

Even though the two are exact opposite of each other.

The concept of "Republic" in general means that no power for anyone claiming to have divine guidance.


Funny and sad at the same times, that such terms are combined by so-called highly educated elite in Pakistan.

A villager in Sindh, punjab, balochistan, KP will never try to use such mumbo jumbo

For him It is just Pakistan.

That's it.

But our professors, our degree holders, our big name politicians who go attend prestigious Western schools like Oxbridge and Harvard continue spreading this ignorance nay arrogance in Pakistan.

how do these terms go against each other? lol
islamic republic = republic of muslims.

 

[FaujHistorian]

how do these terms go against each other? lol
islamic republic = republic of muslims.

yet another intellectual qalabazi to fit a non-religious concept of Republic with religious mumbo jumbo.

Shabash

Very shabaash.

 

[qamar1990]

@Bilal.
Real Islamic principles and teachings are incompatible with direct or indirect democracy ...
Either we can be "Islamic" , or we can be "Republic"

how do you figure? lol
please elaborate.
why can't we have an islamic country with laws inspired by the quran and also elect officials of our choice?

yet another intellectual qalabazi to fit a non-religious concept of Republic with religious mumbo jumbo.

Shabash

Very shabaash.

define republic bro and you will see where you are wrong.
please don't tell your void of common sense.

my dear islamic system of gov was failed from day one other wise 3 khalifa rashdeen was not murderes umer - usman - ali - was murdered by own people

and again hussain was murdered becasue of faild gov system and its seed a hate which is going on today

if it was so nice how wife of prophet PBUH and ali was faught safeen war ? killed thousands of sahaba those whom have direst teachings from PBUH ???????????

so presidents got assassinated in america so republic failed as well?
wak kiya logic hai humarey atheist **** ki.

 

[FaujHistorian]

why can't we have an islamic country with laws inspired by the quran and also elect officials of our choice?

inspiration, who cares. Jesus can inspire and so can Mohammad or Bhudda.

The issue with Islamists is that they

don't take just the inspiration, they assume direct control and tell the country, if you challenge us, you challenge Quran.

Just go challege Ayatullah Khabeesi for any of his laws and he will lock you up for good.

so presidents got assassinated in america so republic failed as well?
i.

Now you are showing utter ignorance about the system of government of your adopted country too.

What a pathetic scene of ignorance.


Comparing 250 years of constitutional government, Congress and Senate with what?

Bunch of tribal kings.

one must be out of his mind to come up with such comparisons. One must be.

 

[freelancer93]

Who are WE

and

how do "We do have supreme power of Allah"?

Why such a standard mutalae Pakistan statement?

Why?

Do you ever stop to thing, that you really do not POSSESS supreme power of Allah?

but in reality that so called supreme political power is usurped by Ayatullahs Roohullahs and other blind Mullahs?


Do you even for one second stop and think?

or it will continue to be the case of Summun Bookmun?

Do u think we all are same? It's an ideology remember? not a blind faith..even our faith asks us to not follow it blindly but to think and measure everything. When our founder(Jinnah) used to think and examine deeply about the verses of Quran, (and please u don't have to be a moulvi to do that, it's normal human nature to develop thinking and research onones believe) so how can u expect a Pakistani not to do that about their own ideology ?
We do not possess ? or we do not apply it on our lives like we should? They both are really different things.

Remember why Quaid said 'Unity, faith and discipline.' ?
He could have only said 'unity and discipline' but no he added 'faith' for a reason because he knew that without a strong faith we the nation of different people can't get united.

That was the reason of an Islamic state, Islamic system and Islamic economical system, and when u say Islamic state it means the superior power belongs to Allah only, u have laws apply it but no we tend to bring corrupt politicians who just used religion for voting but never once in their life they tried to bring any kind of change in Pakistan.


It's not the fault of ideology if we did not tried to follow it and blindly decided to follow our politicians who divided us into groups on the basis of language and caste.

 

[FaujHistorian]

....
Remember why Quaid said 'Unity, faith and discipline.' ?
He could have only said 'unity and discipline' but no he added 'faith' for a reason because he knew that without a strong faith we the nation of different people can't get united.
.

problem with your logic is this jadoo gari magician act where you pull kabooter from hat.

You quote Jinnah

But you bring in his mortal enemy aka mardoori Mullah mowdoodi.

Bait and switch bait and switch.

Please do not do this type of jadoo gari.


Jinnah would not touch with 100 foot pole the likes of Mullah mardoodi

But you keep on dragging Mardoodi philosophy in Jinnah's Pakistan


Do you even see the dichotomy in your argument

do you?

 

[KingMamba]

The problem is not that Pakistanis do not know the definition of republic, the problem is that it is not the definition that @FaujHistorian wants.

Honestly faujii all this time and you still come off as suicidal, calm your *** down. You ask people to give their definition of republic but do not agree with any definition offered because you have already concluded your definition is the only definition that is right. Irony is you are trying to force these dudes to follow your view while talking about a republic lol.

@qamar1990 @freelancer93 you guys should just agree with him and go along your merry way.

 

[qamar1990]

inspiration, who cares. Jesus can inspire and so can Mohammad or Bhudda.

The issue with Islamists is that they

don't take just the inspiration, they assume direct control and tell the country, if you challenge us, you challenge Quran.

Just go challege Ayatullah Khabeesi for any of his laws and he will lock you up for good.




Now you are showing utter ignorance about the system of government of your adopted country too.

What a pathetic scene of ignorance.


Comparing 250 years of constitutional government, Congress and Senate with what?

Bunch of tribal kings.

one must be out of his mind to come up with such comparisons. One must be.

the islamic republic of pakistan doesn't need no ayatollah nor does our religion require any such figure.

an ideal islamic republic of pakistan would be a republic that has laws inspired by the quran.
for example
- death penalty(murder or rape).
- surgically removing hand of a their who steals just for the sake of stealing( robbing houses, stealing jewelry, doing blockades on roads and robbing workers coming home)
-the government collect 2.5 percent from every muslim and then redistribute to all needy people for zaqat
- and from non muslims take jizya of the same amount 2.5 percent and redistribute it amongst the poor as well.

-all government officials must get elected by people.
-all wars, sanctions on other countries, severing of ties with other countries all should be voted on by the people.
-the government can't FORCE people to pray or fast.
-the government can't jail somebody for becoming a kafir because the quran clearly says there is no compulsion in religion, and since the quran is the highest authority then anything else we must reject that contradicts it( hadiths that say kill apostates).
-every citizen or minority should be allowed to hold any office but it will be very unlikely that they will ever become a president or prime minister because they will never get the votes.
-all females should have equal rights.
all students at schools should be thought about all religions and then make it optional for students if they want further education on islam ect.




now there is nothing that you can say about this. this is an ideal islamic republic i think. and it kinda proves that islamic and republic do go hand to hand. because all officials are elected to office, nobody has the right to be ayatollah or what ever.
we even change the title president to khalifa but even that khalifa will have to be ELECTED by the people every certain number of years.

 

[FaujHistorian]

the islamic republic of pakistan doesn't need no ayatollah nor does our religion require any such figure.

an ideal islamic republic of pakistan would be a republic that has laws inspired by the quran.
for example
- death penalty(murder or rape).
- surgically removing hand of a their who steals just for the sake of stealing( robbing houses, stealing jewelry, doing blockades on roads and robbing workers coming home)
-the government collect 2.5 percent from every muslim and then redistribute to all needy people for zaqat
- and from non muslims take jizya of the same amount 2.5 percent and redistribute it amongst the poor as well.

-all government officials must get elected by people.
-all wars, sanctions on other countries, severing of ties with other countries all should be voted on by the people.
-the government can't FORCE people to pray or fast.
-the government can't jail somebody for becoming a kafir because the quran clearly says there is no compulsion in religion, and since the quran is the highest authority then anything else we must reject that contradicts it( hadiths that say kill apostates).
-every citizen or minority should be allowed to hold any office but it will be very unlikely that they will ever become a president or prime minister because they will never get the votes.
-all females should have equal rights.
all students at schools should be thought about all religions and then make it optional for students if they want further education on islam ect.




now there is nothing that you can say about this. this is an ideal islamic republic i think. and it kinda proves that islamic and republic do go hand to hand. because all officials are elected to office, nobody has the right to be ayatollah or what ever.
we even change the title president to khalifa but even that khalifa will have to be ELECTED by the people every certain number of years.

Quran never said to hang/kill someone for "disrespecting" mohammad pubh or tearing a page of the book.

But no Islamist has a backbone to mention this. Not a single Islamist.


Again your effort to turn this thread about religion is pathetic.

Sorry to say.

 

[freelancer93]

"Mumbo Jumbo"

"Kabootar"

"Jadoo"

"Gari"

Is that language of Pakistan or ...? um I have no idea where people use it.

Peace on you.

Thanks @KingMamba for ur sincere suggestion, will try to use it in future.

 

[qamar1990]

inspiration, who cares. Jesus can inspire and so can Mohammad or Bhudda.

The issue with Islamists is that they

don't take just the inspiration, they assume direct control and tell the country, if you challenge us, you challenge Quran.

Just go challege Ayatullah Khabeesi for any of his laws and he will lock you up for good.




Now you are showing utter ignorance about the system of government of your adopted country too.

What a pathetic scene of ignorance.


Comparing 250 years of constitutional government, Congress and Senate with what?

Bunch of tribal kings.

one must be out of his mind to come up with such comparisons. One must be.

your making no sense what so ever, imran khan said that khalifa system was failed from the start because khalifas got killed by their own people supposedly. so i replied and said well using the imran khan logic our republic in america failed as well since some of our presidents got assassinated lol.

Quran never said to hang/kill someone for "disrespecting" mohammad pubh or tearing a page of the book.

But no Islamist has a backbone to mention this. Not a single Islamist.


Again your effort to turn this thread about religion is pathetic.

Sorry to say.

i don't want to kill anybody who insults the prophet, its not my job to do that nor any other muslim here because all we can do is try to show them the light, the rest is between person who insults the prophet and god.

 

[freelancer93]

your making no sense what so ever, imran khan said that khalifa system was failed from the start because khalifas got killed by their own people supposedly. so i replied and said well using the imran khan logic our republic in america failed as well since some of our presidents got assassinated lol.

Khilafat was not a failure, it's people who fail things, specially when they become lazy and corrupt.