Turkish Politics & Internal Affairs

[Hexciter]

I always criticize Turkish Aproach to Pakistan; because India is ignored a lot, but offers a lot for Turkish Industry. Some Turks confuse trade with friendship, unlike Pakistanis.

Here is an example:



http://www.sozcu.com.tr/2016/gundem/pakistan-icin-uretilen-bombatarlar-elde-kaldi-1315316/

That's why we continiously complain about MKEK. This is not the first case of them.

 

[Yellow-place]

it says after the defeat but it is the the first hours of the coup attempt, people are just leaving their houses.

 

[IblinI]

Kemalism is a made up word,there is no such thing.
We were a secular democracy,that has changed forever now.
They used democracy to fool the people and can do whatever they wish now,game over.

Even the outsider like me on the other side of the world can tell turkey is in alot of troubles,What can i say, good luck to both of our country.

 

[idune]

Untold stories.......

Boyz, good you are here, make sure no traitor gets through here. This is my territory.

https://www.rt.com/viral/351658-turkey-coup-cat-photo/

 

[IblinI]

I appreciate your sympathies (if they are genuine)
Points:
1. There is no one trying to make a theocracy in Turkey. I feel sorry for any fool that tries to bring religous rule (sharia) to Turkey...the army or police wont have to do anything, the people would put them down themselves
2.If you are talking about Zaman/ they are owned by people who are close to Fetullah Gülen, the asshole that orcehstrated all of this
3.Not all journalists are as innocent as they seem. Many of them overly make propoganda against the terror efforts, thus putting citizens lives at stake and eroding the rule of law
4. Those judges are all linked to Gülen, they were the ones that prepared the ''legal'' component of yesterdays coup attempt and would have managed the legal reprecussions had they succeeded. Ofcourse they would have been rewarded.
5.The Turkish people showed that this country will not be some banana republic. Anyone that tries will either face trial or face the people. goodluck
6.Cracking down on anti government cells (Gülen affiliates). As for the opposition, the reason they are becoming irrelevent is their own lack of political skill. Pure and simple

Hope that it brings a different perspective even if it doesnt change your opinion.

Turkey is here to stay

I dont know man,those 2700 judges whether they are linked to Gulen or not, but isnt it too fast to tell?or you got it all figured it before it happend?In china we have a slang "Even 1500 pigs,it still takes few days to catch".

 

[jhungary]

I was waiting for this false flag theory! Just like the Istanbul bombing, these Erdogan haters will now say that this also the case. If you take this crap out of the picture you get suckular thugs involved in this coup.

and you know more about Turkish Politics living in Bangladesh? Is that why you believe this coup to be engineered by the American??

If you understand the whole geopolitical situation at all, you will understand US need Erdogan to stay in NATO, and Erdogan need NATO to shield from getting frank by 3 sides (Greece, Israel and Russia), joining NATO effectively neutralized 2 of the 3 (Greece cannot attack bounded by NATO and Israeli is bounded by American) and deterring Russia.

If anything, this could only be an US Op if Erdogan is behind it. That is if NATO and the US wanted Erdogan to further tighten its grip within the Military.

Maybe if you don't understand the situation as a whole or uneducated in this sort of thing, the best option for you may be to bugger off?

 

[anon45]

I dont know man,those 2700 judges whether they are linked to Gulen or not, but isnt it too fast to tell?or you got it all figured it before it happend?In china we have a slang "Even 1500 pigs,it still takes few days to catch".

A good explanation i've heard is that Erdogan actually did have all his ducks in a row on this. There was apparently talk of a purge in the military and this is what led to a desperate ill planned coup. Because the government had already 'done the research' so to speak the government was able to move very quickly in arresting those with even the most tenuous of ties with gullen. That said arresting so many judicial figures seemingly unrelated to the coup is ringing alarm bells with me.

 

[jhungary]

Hey man.

There is a saying here. "At izi, it izine karıştı" which is; The horse sh.it is mixed with the ox shit. Thats the exact situation right now. Your friend must have solid reasons from the recent headlines to say this such as;

- Acceptance of 3 million Syrians for citizenship

- The long discussed Manbij Operation which is planned to involve Kurdish-led SDF and coalition aircraft with support from Turkey. I believe we shouldnt have allowed that. Now with the closure of Incirlik, this seems to be cleared off from problems list.

- A new constitution

- A new regime, presidency.


There are many other reasons to believe that Erdoğan himself and his assilants might be behind this plot. But also there are reasons for not to. Either way it is sure that he will pull himself from this with even stronger power. We can not be certain. I believe he was not behind it. Plotters may have faked the bombing of his otel. But I doubt it for the gunships and tanks firing to civilians mate.

We have told this to them a decade ago when they were pals they didnt believe. Now the nation is paying the price

Well, look at it this way, the only way to finish a coup is to attack the 3 pillars of any political system at once, Leadership, Movement and Communication, and Media.

You want to take out the leadership first, which mean no one will start barking out orders to try to control the situation. And then you want to take out the communication and limiting the movement, which seal off bridges in and out of the capital and also destroy or take over communication network such as Radar, Cable or Satellite so you basically keep the whole country in the dark. And finally you take out the media network so you can start your propaganda and start a civil uprising. Not to forget to achieve a coup, you will need majority of the civilian on your side to start an eventual uprising, and this support is obvious lacking in this coup.

As if this coup is to create the biggest bang, but simply fall short on everything.

That is why my friend said this may have been engineered by higher up in the Government, but of course, there are still chance that some extremely stupid army officer really think this is a good time and a good way to start a coup. But this would be extremely stupid as after this coup, you can expect Erdogan would have solidify his leadership within both government and military and whatever leeway the military have would basically gone after this. So for the military, a coup now with these type of action is extremely unfavourable to their position.

 

[xenon54 out]

Birde bu vatana hizmet etmesine ragmen hapse atilan eski Genelkurmay baskani Ilker Basbug bu darbe tesebbüsü hakkinda ne düsünüyormus onu okuyalim.

İlker Başbuğ: Onları aynı kaba koymayalım

Dün akşam darbe girişiminin önlenmesinin ardında bugün eski Genelkurmay Başkanı İlker Başbuğ açıklamalarda bulundu. Başbuğ, "Darbede yer alan erlerin kullanıldığını söyleyen Başbuğ, “Ben erlerin, bu darbenin içerisinde yer alan, planlayan rütbeli personelden ayrı tutulması düşüncesindeyim." diye konuştu.


Bodrum’daki evini basın mensuplarına açan Başbuğ, darbe girişiminde bulunanların Paralel Devlet Yapılanması olduğunu söyledi. Başbuğ açıklamasına şöyle devam etti: “Dün gece Türkiye tarihinde yaşanılan en korkunç gecelerinden birisi oldu. Bu darbe kalkışını, girişimini, bu hareketi ve bu harekete katılanları lanetliyorum. Onlar Türkiye’nin ve Türk Silahlı Kuvvetlerinin tarihine bir kara leke sürdüler” ifadelerini kullandı.


"EMİR ALAN TERÖRİSTLER"

Başbuğ, darbeyi yapanların terörist olduğunu da belirterek, “Bugün diyorum ki kendiMeclisini bombalayan, kendi halkına ateş açanlar Türk askeri olamaz. Bunlar birilerinden ve bir yerlerden emir alan teröristlerdir. Bu olayların sonucunda sevindiğimiz noktalardan bir tanesi Türk Silahlı Kuvvetlerinin büyük çoğunluğu 15 Temmuz 2016 günü yaşanılan olaylar karşısında gösterdiği davranış ile baştaGenelkurmay Başkanı Hulüsi Akar olmak üzere demokrasinin yanında yer aldılar. Bu nedenle gerçekten hepsini yürekten kutluyorum. Dün gece Türk Silahlı Kuvvetlerinin büyük çoğunluğu ile beraber omuz omuza örnek bir davranış gösteren polisimize teşekkürlerimi sunuyorum onları kutluyorum. Polislerimiz canları pahasına görevlerini yerlerine getirdiler” şeklinde konuştu.
Darbe girişiminde bulunanların cemaatten olduğunu sözlerine ekleyen Başbuğ, “Türk milleti darbenin karşısında olduğunu çok net olarak bütün dünyaya ilan etti. Bu da hepimiz için gurur vesilesi. Bugün, darbeciler ile cemaat arasından birçok insan ilişkisi olduğunu düşünmektedir. Ben de aynı düşünceyi taşıyorum. Bundan önce cemaat Türk silahlı kuvvetlerine bu girişimde bulunmuştu. Bugün ise Türk milletine karşı yapılan bir harekettir” dedi.


"TSK DAHA GÜÇLÜ OLARAK ÇIKACAKTIR"

Başbuğ, ordunun temizlediğinin de söyleyerek sözlerine şöyle devam etti: “Bizim ufacık bir pozitif bakacağımız bir nokta var Türk Silahlı Kuvvetlerinin içerisindeki zararlı odaklar bugün temizleniyor. Bu olaydan sonra Türk Silahlı kuvvetleri daha güçlü olarak çıkacaktır. Bu ordu bize lazım. Bu coğrafyada güçlü orduya ihtiyacımız var” söyledi.


"AYNI KABA KOYMAYALIM"

Darbede yer alan erlerin kullanıldığını söyleyen Başbuğ, “Ben erlerin, bu darbenin içerisinde yer alan, planlayan rütbeli personelden ayrı tutulması düşüncesindeyim. Bu askerlerimiz belki de kandırıldılar. Bunların tatbikat ve bunun gibi nedenlerle kışla dışarısına çıkarıldığı gözüküyor. bu olayda kullanıldı Mehmetçikler, bekli aldatıldılar, belki yanlış bilgiler verdiler. O gençlerin bunu anlaması ve algılaması kolay bir olaydeğil. Bu genç erlerimiz ile diğerlerini aynı teraziye koymayalım” dedi.

http://www.hurriyet.com.tr/ilker-basbug-onlari-ayni-kaba-koymayalim-40150023
____________________________________________________________________________

Bundan önce cemaat Türk silahlı kuvvetlerine bu girişimde bulunmuştu. Bugün ise Türk milletine karşı yapılan bir harekettir” dedi.

Bu sözlere dikkat, ne yazikki zamaninda bütün bunlara göz yumuldu.

 

[Indika]

The middle east situation is turning out to be a thriller. who is fighting whom, who is allied with whom..etc
Reminds me of movie "body of lies".

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/07/17/world/europe/turkey-us-incirlik-isis.html

By ERIC SCHMITT and DAN BILEFSKYJULY 16, 2016

Incirlik Air Base in Adana, Turkey, last year. CreditIbrahim Erikan/Anadolu Agency, via Getty Images
WASHINGTON — The Turkish authorities on Saturday halted, at least temporarily, all American-led strike missions against the Islamic State that had been flying from the Incirlik air base — the first major impact of the attempted coup on the broader allied campaign against the terrorist group, United States officials said.

“The Turkish government has closed its airspace to military aircraft, and as a result air operations at Incirlik Air Base have been halted at this time,” Peter Cook, the Pentagon press secretary, said in a statement. Mr. Cook said United States officials were “working with the Turks to resume air operations there as soon as possible.”

In the meantime, he said, the American military’s Central Command will alter flight operations in an effort “to minimize any effects on the campaign” against the Islamic State.

Pentagon officials had said late Friday that the unfolding coup had not affected the bombing and surveillance missions from Incirlik. The opening of that base to the allies has enabled commanders to accelerate and intensify airstrikes against Islamic State targets in Iraq and Syria.

The potential loss of Incirlik as a staging area and major base, even if temporary, comes at a challenging time for the American-led coalition fighting the Islamic State, also known as ISIS or ISIL. Local security forces in Iraq and militias in Syria, both supported by the United States, have finally started to gain significant momentum in their air and ground fights against the militants, aided largely by the access to Incirlik.

Defense Secretary Ashton B. Carter, in particular, had criticized Turkey over the past year for not taking aggressive enough action to tighten its borders and combat the Islamic State. But many of those criticisms from Mr. Carter and other American officials had begun to fade as the campaign against the militants in Iraq and Syria picked up momentum.

On Saturday, President Obama received a briefing on the situation in Turkey from senior aides. A White House statement said Mr. Obama “underscored the shared challenges that will require continued Turkish cooperation, including our joint efforts against terrorism.”

Continue reading the main story
At Incirlik, the United States has based A-10 attack planes, KC-135 refueling tankers and surveillance aircraft, including armed drones. The Air Force has said American refueling aircraft at Incirlik handle roughly one-third of refueling operations for the air war over Iraq and Syria.

Use of the base increased the length of time that American and other allied warplanes could remain over Iraq and Syria. The manned and unmanned strike missions, as well as surveillance missions, from Incirlik — all hours closer to the fight than aircraft in the Persian Gulf — have made a big difference. Losing that advantage would significantly hamper operations, American commanders say.

At Diyarbakir, another Turkish base, the Air Force began staging small numbers of American troops last fall to recover any downed pilots or flight crews. The Pentagon’s plans to place a mobile rocket system known as Himars, short for High Mobility Artillery Rocket System, somewhere in Turkey to support United States operations in Syria could also be in jeopardy.

The Turkish military, which sees itself as the guardian of the secular state, has overthrown or forced out four elected governments since 1960. Turks have long been fascinated by what they call “the deep state”: a murky group of operatives, linked to the military, thought to have battled perceived enemies of the state since the Cold War.

But in a striving Turkey of thriving capitalism and a still boisterous news media, memories of the damage to democracy fomented by past coupsremains strong. In the first coup of 1960, the military tried the prime minister and president for treason. The 1980 “September 12 Coup” helped end a period of anarchy and terror, but not before thousands of people were arrested and dozens were executed and tortured.

Analysts said the latest coup attempt underlined the extent to which elements within the military had become frustrated by Turkey’s direction under President Recep Tayyip Erdogan, a religious and conservative Muslim. Mr. Erdogan came to power in 2002, pledging to declaw the once powerful military. He proceeded to impose civilian rule over the state by putting dozens of prominent generals and officers in prison after dramatic show trials for treason, often on tenuous and even fabricated evidence.

Moreover, Mr. Erdogan, whose government once promised a foreign policy of “zero problems with neighbors” has seen conflicts multiply, including 14 attacks on Turkey in the past year by Kurdish and Islamic State militants. He has presided over an increasingly shaky economy, and alienated allies from the United States to Russia. His government has been mired byaccusations of corruption.

American and NATO officials have been pressing to insulate the mission against the Islamic State at Incirlik and other Turkish bases from the internal upheaval. But even if they succeed, Turkish politicians and security forces are likely to be, at the very least, distracted from their counterterrorism focus despite recent vows to redouble efforts after last month’s Istanbul airport bombing.

“They’re going to be focused on rooting out coup plotters, and that’s going to preoccupy all the national security services; and everything else, including going after ISIL, will be secondary,” said Eric S. Edelman, a former United States ambassador to Turkey and top Pentagon official under President George W. Bush. “It may affect their ability to protect themselves from ISIL blowback in Turkey.”

One big concern expressed by officials and analysts is that Mr. Erdogan will freeze the cooperation against the Islamic State while he sorts out who in the military supported and carried out the coup attempt. If the Turkish military fractures further — whether through arrests, forced retirements or other actions — it could become a weakened partner in the fight against the Islamic State.

 

[HAIDER]

I have seen some pictures of dead Turkish soldiers, can't post here. But , something is wrong and very wrong. Can see extremist elements are hijacking Turkish society.

 

[Hellfire]

@jhungary We have more keyboard warriors here than you can handle. At times, the logic really infuriates you. Military and Political logic stands no chance then! Your post #4066 is the result of trying to apply that logic, won't work!

Anyways, I do agree with your assessment at #4068. The most striking example of the likelihood of this being a false flag is the fact that there are no high profile arrests, and majority of the officer lot which has been arrested is of rank of Major and below.

There was a clear ambiguity in the action of the troops supporting a coup who did not engage the mass of people moving on roads as if they were waiting for orders that never came. It may have been that orders to move were issued and then withheld and few thousand people were sacrificed in a larger game.

The ultimate price will be paid by people who may be opposed to the present regime, an obscure person who was not in loop but is a political opponent/liability will be made the scapegoat, the mass of soldiers will be 'forgiven' citing larger interest of the state to enable 're-approachment' and 'foster national unity', and further tightening of grip will take place. So, a small price for significant tightening of grip.

What the gentleman you have quoted earlier does not realise is, had US wanted a regime change, it would have happened. As was seen in Egypt.

 

[HAIDER]

Even the outsider like me on the other side of the world can tell turkey is in alot of troubles,What can i say, good luck to both of our country.

We Pakistani wish Turkish in every forum , stop Syrian adventure . This adventure will have adverse effects on Turkish society...............but...Learn from Pakistan Afghan war experience.

 

[Hellfire]

I have seen some pictures of dead Turkish soldiers, can't post here. But , something is wrong and very wrong. Can see extremist elements are hijacking Turkish society.

Who, as per you?

We were expecting an increasingly unstable Turkey earlier, as Turkey was then preparing for a possible intervention in Northern Syria and had shot down the Russian Aircraft. But our Turkish friends had laughed at the time.

Now am sure, it is not funny for them anymore.

There is an increasing perception of Erdogan heading towards a more Islamist approach as opposed to the fundamentally secular Turkish society. In addition, his policies in Syria and his actions to infuriate Russia, were unwise. He is likely to face greater challenges, and likelihood of a destabilised Turkey are seemingly more greater than perhaps six months back.

 

[HAIDER]

Who, as per you?

As per friends of Turkish people ...