Turkish Politics & Internal Affairs

[anatolia]

Yep thats right.


Thats right and majority of Kurds didnt chosen pkk...

i believe in east majority of kurds voted for pkk.. who did not voted for pkk in east? zaza turkmen arabics and some islamist.as well some alevis does not support pkk or bdp.

 

[Bismarck]

Kanka, with all due to respect, you do not have the right to tell Kurds who should represent them and who should not. I am not telling you to not let AKP/CHP/MHP represent you either. It is a personal choice. Majority of Kurds decide to let BDP ( PKK) represent them. That is their choice and if the consequence is to live a poor life then so be it. Kurds must take the consequence of their own choices.

Turkey can only do two things. Either accept PKK ( which they are partially doing now) as a negotiation partner, or they can ignore PKK and the war will begin again. There is no third way. There is no Barzani way. If AKP can not win majority of Kurdish votes, do you really think Barzani is able to?

There is one thing that you dont should to forget. Kurds in Turkey are although turkish citizen. You say I have not the right to tell who represent the Kurds and who not. This is the reson why there are elections. I never heard that PKK party or Öcalan participated in this election.

Are you sure that majority of Kurds voted for BDP and ones are the same like PKK?

 

[Bahoz]

i believe in east majority of kurds voted for pkk.. who did not voted for pkk in east? zaza turkmen arabics and some islamist.as well some alevis does not support pkk or bdp.

Dont forget that the mayor of Dersim is still a BDP politician. Edibe Sahin. So I would say that most Zaza Kurds still vote for BDP. However BDP had a bad election in 2011 in Dersim.

There is one thing that you dont should to forget. Kurds in Turkey are although turkish citizen. You say I have not the right to tell who represent the Kurds and who not. This is the reson why there are elections. I never heard that PKK party or Öcalan participated in this election.

Are you sure that majority of Kurds voted for BDP and ones are the same like PKK?

They are not the same thing as such. There is no organic link between them. But they share the same ideology and they both regard Öcalan as the leader of Kurds. It is a little like the situation with IRA and Sinn Fein in Ireland back in the days. It is a middle solution since PKK can not be in parliament so they have to have a middle way that represents them in Turkey parliament.

 

[anatolia]

Dont forget that the mayor of Dersim is still a BDP politician. Edibe Sahin. So I would say that most Zaza Kurds still vote for BDP. However BDP had a bad election in 2011 in Dersim.



They are not the same thing as such. There is no organic link between them. But they share the same ideology and they both regard Öcalan as the leader of Kurds. It is a little like the situation with IRA and Sinn Fein in Ireland back in the days. It is a middle solution since PKK can not be in parliament so they have to have a middle way that represents them in Turkey parliament.

even in diyarbakir all zaza votes goes to akp. siirt bitlis bingol elazgi zaza does not like bdp or kurdish parties..very little alevi zaza vote for bdp.. mostl of sunni zaza never vote bdp.
one thing i never understand in turkey is alevi voters. they is very complicated.

 

[Bahoz]

even in diyarbakir all zaza votes goes to akp. siirt bitlis bingol elazgi zaza does not like bdp or kurdish parties..very little alevi zaza vote for bdp.. mostl of sunni zaza never vote bdp.
one thing i never understand in turkey is alevi voters. they is very complicated.

Majority of Zazas live in Dersim where BDP holds the provincial council. But true, a lot of Zazas vote for what they believe are Leftist parties. For instance, some of them believe CHP will do something good for them. I think many of them are more afraid of Sunni extremism than of nationalism. But yes, they are very complex.

But if you look at the composition of BDP, they have many Zaza and Alevi politicians.

 

[Bismarck]

@Bahoz

How many Kurds live in Turkey?

 

[Bahoz]

@Bahoz

How many Kurds live in Turkey?

Very difficult to say. I actually have no clear idea. The numbers range from 15-23 million. It is difficult to say because a lot of Kurds have been assimilated and some are afraid when asked. If you ask them if they are Kurdish or Turkish, they will answer Turkish even though their parents speak Kurdish at home. And there are millions of Kurds living in the western cities such as Istanbul, Izmir, Mersin, Konya, Ankara, Adana, Antalya etc.

 

[Bismarck]

Between 15-23 mio. So, let us take the average 19 mio. How can a org like PKK or a "leader" like Öcalan, call they- or himself a leader, if nobody votes for him? How can he say, he is the leader or a leader party, if no one has vote for them. This is what I cant understand. To control a area (with arm force or terror), does not mean any legitimation or a leadership.

 

[Bahoz]

Between 15-23 mio. So, let us take the average 19 mio. How can a org like PKK or a "leader" like Öcalan, call they- or himself a leader, if nobody votes for him? How can he say, he is the leader or a leader party, if no one has vote for them. This is what I cant understand. To control a area (with arm force or terror), does not mean any legitimation or a leadership.

When I talk about control I meant representation. Not actual military control. But control by masses and votes and representation. As you can see on the election map, they control the traditional Kurdish cities in the east.

The problem, again, is the demographics. We do not actually have a concrete number. All we know about Kurds is that they do not generally vote as much as Turks and that there are much more younger Kurds than elderly Kurds. In other words, there are much more Kurds under the age of 18 than there are Kurds over the age of 18. Which again hinders their voting percentage. I think there was a research by KONDA some years ago where it stated that out of 14 million Kurds, only some 7 million voted.

Here I am talking about BDP/DTP/DEHAP/HADEP etc. Not PKK or Ocalan since you can not vote for them. But their political ''wing''.

 

[anatolia]

Very difficult to say. I actually have no clear idea. The numbers range from 15-23 million. It is difficult to say because a lot of Kurds have been assimilated and some are afraid when asked. If you ask them if they are Kurdish or Turkish, they will answer Turkish even though their parents speak Kurdish at home. And there are millions of Kurds living in the western cities such as Istanbul, Izmir, Mersin, Konya, Ankara, Adana, Antalya etc.

total eastern turkey population is around 12-13 million including turkmens zaza arabic.
so exchange kurdish in west with turkish arabic sunni zaza from east.. so top number of kurdish population 12-13 million,.....

 

[Saithan]

Sorry but I haven't bothered to read all your comments. I could see it's a spat that won't give positive results. PKK/BDP is a combination that is undesirable.

Any positive political move will be Hijacked by BDP as their effort, and failing that the PKK will make our people suffer. I say our PEOPLE, and VATAN because it doesn't matter if you're kurd or turk when greedy people fight for power. Insallah the railroad and everything good it brings will develope eastern turkey so people will work instead of sitting in "kahve" the worst culture we have.

 

[xenon54 out]

Between 15-23 mio. So, let us take the average 19 mio. How can a org like PKK or a "leader" like Öcalan, call they- or himself a leader, if nobody votes for him? How can he say, he is the leader or a leader party, if no one has vote for them. This is what I cant understand. To control a area (with arm force or terror), does not mean any legitimation or a leadership.

The funny thing is they even dont controll anything in Turkey, thats why they are hiding in Mountains.

 

[Bahoz]

total eastern turkey population is around 12-13 million including turkmens zaza arabic.
so exchange kurdish in west with turkish arabic sunni zaza from east.. so top number of kurdish population 12-13 million,.....

But you forget that there are probably more Kurdish people in West than in East. Try to look up BDP's votes in Istanbul, Mersin, Adana, Izmir.

 

[xenon54 out]

But you forget that there are probably more Kurdish people in West than in East. Try to look up BDP's votes in Istanbul, Mersin, Adana, Izmir.

And you forgot that you count 50-50 also as Kurds, millions of marriages between Turks and Kurds happened.

 

[anatolia]

But you forget that there are probably more Kurdish people in West than in East. Try to look up BDP's votes in Istanbul, Mersin, Adana, Izmir.

how would you prove it ? with bdp votes in west? i said 13 milion total east population and 40 percents easy turkish arap zaza which is easy 5 million..