Traditional chinese costume . We eliminate your misunderstanding of Chinese costume and hairstyle.

[Snomannen]

As I said before,those things happened in anciet,we can't use modern values to blame them

Then why should "皇漢" blame Manchurian for their "crime" during the past. They always mention those incidents happened during the war between Ming and Qing such as 揚州十日 and 嘉定三屠 and trying to tell every single one in the world how bad Manchurian was/is, yet they never know (or accept) the fact that people of 揚州 also massacred by Ming army, TWICE, before Qing army was even there. Moreover, although 嘉定三屠 was committed by a Qing general named 李成棟, this murderer himself was a Han. Not to mention he was even a former general of 大順.

And do you know how Southern Ming （永歷）treated this murderer's dead body?

［永歷朝廷追贈李成棟為寧夏王，謚忠武，賜祭九壇，葬禮極為隆重，“甲馬數十隊以彩繒為之，一時灰燼”；“愛妾數人皆令盛服赴火死，盡用夷禮”］
-- 《南明史》 第十六章 第三節

 

[Grand Historian]

Ethnic chauvinism is a plague.

 

[Andrei]

［凡新拘留被擄民婦，各蒙親屬認領還家。至於降蠻老幼婦女數千餘人，各變姓名，易冠服，配去遠方衛所安置。於是九絲一空，都蠻盡平。］

－《兩朝平攘錄·都掌》

大藤峽瑤民起義：［為反抗封建壓迫，明洪武四年（1371年）廣西大藤峽（包括今金秀、象州、蒙山、荔浦等地）的瑤族群眾，以侯大苟為首揭竿起義。起義持續100多年，鬥爭烽火燃遍各地。明王朝為了挽救其在嶺南搖搖欲墜的封建統治，糾集了數十萬官兵，先後三次血洗大藤峽，對瑤族人民進行血腥鎮壓。大藤峽瑤民起義在我國歷史上是罕見的，也是瑤族古代史上最為著名的一次起義。］



Where is 僰人?

历朝历代对待民众叛乱，任何政府都是如此对待的，别说少数民族的叛乱了，即使是汉族平民自己的叛乱，政府都是血腥镇压的，为什么要归结到汉族普通人的身上？

 

[Snomannen]

历朝历代对待民众叛乱，任何政府都是如此对待的，别说少数民族的叛乱了，即使是汉族平民自己的叛乱，政府都是血腥镇压的，为什么要归结到汉族普通人的身上？

I'm glad you know that, then why do you people always blame Manchurian rulers (not to mention that wasn't even their idea, but a Han officer's suggestion) for changing Han people's hairstyle. Han people also did the same thing to minorities. Besides, Zhou Dynasty also changed Shang people's hairstyle even clothing by force, does that mean China (中國) was actually no longer exist after 牧野.

 

[jkroo]

Dear @Andrei,

You are trying to eliminate misunderstandings, but apparently some people are not willing to see it and creating more misunderstandings.

Try to focus on your topic and learn to create your own ignore list, please.

Good post and go ahead.

 

[Snomannen]

The Qing government indeed was cruel and unreasonable because of the 剃髮易服 policy, but that doesn't give some people right to fabricate the truth, such as calming that "Hanfu" has been disappearing for 400 years:

［金珠衣飾，書籍器皿，遍列通衢，其價甚賤。有錢買歸者，後獲大利。新太守張（按：張銚，偃 師人）住進士陳子龍宅。華亭縣陳鑑、海防楊之易，即忠臣楊漣長子，時雖剃髮，猶漢人衣冠，烏紗大帶，不改舊服也。餘以丁艱，不與科試，兼欲告閒，而同袍之 告退者不一人。學師欲索重價，餘以力綿中止。九月十三日，督鎮李成棟點驗各兵，餘與曹馳尹儒冠往觀之。李尚烏紗玉帶，用八座大轎，抬於門首，馬步卒皆疾趨 而過，軍威嚴肅，莫可名狀。］

－－《乙酉筆記》

^Some drawings in Qing dynasty.

Dear @Andrei,

You are trying to eliminate misunderstandings, but apparently some people are not willing to see it and creating more misunderstandings.

Try to focus on your topic and learn to create your own ignore list, please.

Good post and go ahead.

See, this is how people live in their own dream, by ignoring facts. Typical extremist believer.

 

[Andrei]

I'm glad you know that, then why do you people always blame Manchurian rulers (not to mention that wasn't even their idea, but a Han officer's suggestion) for changing Han people's hairstyle. Han people also did the same thing to minorities. Besides, Zhou Dynasty also changed Shang people's hairstyle even clothing by force, does that mean China (中國) was actually no longer exist after 牧野.

xia dynasty and zhou dynasty are all chinese. we had same culture , but manchu forced chinese abandon advanced culture and killed lots chinese, in ming dynasty , chinese invented Rockets, artillery, mines, torpedoes, matchlock, flares, smoke bombs, flamethrowers. . . . Chinese science and technology was No1 in the world. But what did Manchu bring to us? Only
Massacre and the destruction of culture, science and technology.

The Qing government indeed was cruel and unreasonable because of the 剃髮易服 policy, but that doesn't give some people right to fabricate the truth, such as calming that "Hanfu" has been disappearing for 400 years:

［金珠衣飾，書籍器皿，遍列通衢，其價甚賤。有錢買歸者，後獲大利。新太守張（按：張銚，偃 師人）住進士陳子龍宅。華亭縣陳鑑、海防楊之易，即忠臣楊漣長子，時雖剃髮，猶漢人衣冠，烏紗大帶，不改舊服也。餘以丁艱，不與科試，兼欲告閒，而同袍之 告退者不一人。學師欲索重價，餘以力綿中止。九月十三日，督鎮李成棟點驗各兵，餘與曹馳尹儒冠往觀之。李尚烏紗玉帶，用八座大轎，抬於門首，馬步卒皆疾趨 而過，軍威嚴肅，莫可名狀。］

－－《乙酉筆記》

^Some drawings in Qing dynasty.



See, this is how people live in their own dream, by ignoring facts. Typical extremist believer.

Drawings in Qing Dynasty, doesn't mean, Han chinese can wear in Qing Dynasty, what they draw is in their mind, and in memory of Han culture.

 

[jkroo]

The Qing government indeed was cruel and unreasonable because of the 剃髮易服 policy, but that doesn't give some people right to fabricate the truth, such as calming that "Hanfu" has been disappearing for 400 years:

［金珠衣飾，書籍器皿，遍列通衢，其價甚賤。有錢買歸者，後獲大利。新太守張（按：張銚，偃 師人）住進士陳子龍宅。華亭縣陳鑑、海防楊之易，即忠臣楊漣長子，時雖剃髮，猶漢人衣冠，烏紗大帶，不改舊服也。餘以丁艱，不與科試，兼欲告閒，而同袍之 告退者不一人。學師欲索重價，餘以力綿中止。九月十三日，督鎮李成棟點驗各兵，餘與曹馳尹儒冠往觀之。李尚烏紗玉帶，用八座大轎，抬於門首，馬步卒皆疾趨 而過，軍威嚴肅，莫可名狀。］

－－《乙酉筆記》

^Some drawings in Qing dynasty.



See, this is how people live in their own dream, by ignoring facts.

What? What dream? What facts?

I am reminding Andrei and I have nothing to do with you.

And I know much more of our own ethnic history and culture than other people.

Please act as specialist and smart guy as you wish. That's your business.

 

[Andrei]

I'm glad you know that, then why do you people always blame Manchurian rulers (not to mention that wasn't even their idea, but a Han officer's suggestion) for changing Han people's hairstyle. Han people also did the same thing to minorities. Besides, Zhou Dynasty also changed Shang people's hairstyle even clothing by force, does that mean China (中國) was actually no longer exist after 牧野.

xia dynasty and shang dynasty were all chinese, we had same culture, but manchu had different culture, and forced chinese abandon han culture, In ming dynasty , chinese invented Rockets, artillery, mines, torpedoes, matchlock, flares, smoke bombs, flamethrowers. . . . Chinese science and technology were No1 in the world. but what did manchu bring to china? Only the destruction of culture, science and technology and lots death

 

[Grand Historian]

xia dynasty and zhou dynasty are all chinese. we had same culture , but manchu forced chinese abandon advanced culture and killed lots chinese, in ming dynasty , chinese invented Rockets, artillery, mines, torpedoes, matchlock, flares, smoke bombs, flamethrowers. . . . Chinese science and technology was No1 in the world. But what did Manchu bring to us? Only
Massacre and the destruction of culture, science and technology.

Go read some books,Shang and Zhou are culturally distinct,though the Zhou adopted plenty from the Shang.

Zhou Wuwang,Qin Shihuang,Han Gaozu,Tang Taizong,Song Taizu and the Hongwu emperor all won Tianxia through the shedding of blood the Qing are no different.

Blame the Confucian tradition instead of whining about the Manchus,many who supported Empress Dowager Cixi were Han.

Drawings in Qing Dynasty, doesn't mean, Han chinese can wear in Qing Dynasty, what they draw is in their mind, and in memory of Han culture.

There's also portraits of Qianlong wearing Hanfu is this all in his mind?

Give me quotes that the Qing banned Hanfu for the average man and women.

 

[Snomannen]

xia dynasty and zhou dynasty are all chinese. we had same culture , but manchu forced chinese abandon advanced culture and killed lots chinese, in ming dynasty , chinese invented Rockets, artillery, mines, torpedoes, matchlock, flares, smoke bombs, flamethrowers. . . . Chinese science and technology was No1 in the world. But what did Manchu bring to us? Only
Massacre and the destruction of culture, science and technology.


Drawings in Qing Dynasty, doesn't mean, Han chinese can wear in Qing Dynasty, what they draw is in their mind, and in memory of Han culture.

The existence of Xia Dynasty was not even 100% conformed, also if Zhou and Shang really did share the completely same culture, then why did Zhou people has to "變其俗革其禮". Besides Manchurian is/ was Chinese, Qing dynasty is even the first dynasty in Chinese history which firstly use the world "中國" as an official name of the whole country.

Any example of "abandoning advanced culture"? I can give you an example of how the advanced astronomy of Yuan was abandoned by its successor:

[中國曆法，本不及外國之精密，以故前元欽天監外，又有回回欽天監，本朝亦設回回司天監，有正儀大夫、司朔大夫、司元大夫等官。至洪武三十一年而廢之，以其 教歸並之，欽天但用彼國土板曆同算，久之則法亦不驗，與中士無異矣。國初，學天文有厲禁，習曆者遣戍，造曆者殊死。至孝宗弛其禁，且命徵山林隱逸能通曆學 者以備其選，而卒無應者。近年因日食分數不相符，督責欽天，但唯唯謝罪，以世學歲久無他術為解。而士大夫中，如參政刑雲鷺輩，俱精於天文，刻有成書，皆雲 勝僧一行及郭守敬諸人矣。然未曾用之推測也。禁中大榼輩，又自有內靈台，專司星象，其職任，其學業，大抵與外庭仿佛，皆土圭中糟粕耳。自利瑪竇入都，號精 象數，而士人李之藻等皆授其業，似當令兼領天文，如先朝儒臣童軒華湘等可也。]

Since when did Chinese science and technology was No1 in the world.
Guess who said this:

[中國人把所有的外國人都看作沒有知識的野蠻人，並且就用這樣的詞句來稱呼他們。他們甚至不屑 從外國人的書裡學習任何東西，因為他們相信只有他們自己才有真正的科學和知識。如果他們偶爾在他們的著述中有提到外國人的地方，他們也會把他們當作好像不 容置疑地和森林與原野裡的野獸差不多。甚至他們表示外國人這個詞的書面詞彙業和用於野獸的一樣，他們難得給外國人一個比他們加之於野獸的更尊貴的名稱。]


Can you even read 古文.

［金珠衣飾，書籍器皿，遍列通衢，其價甚賤。有錢買歸者，後獲大利。新太守張（按：張銚，偃 師人）住進士陳子龍宅。華亭縣陳鑑、海防楊之易，即忠臣楊漣長子，時雖剃髮，猶漢人衣冠，烏紗大帶，不改舊服也。餘以丁艱，不與科試，兼欲告閒，而同袍之 告退者不一人。學師欲索重價，餘以力綿中止。九月十三日，督鎮李成棟點驗各兵，餘與曹馳尹儒冠往觀之。李尚烏紗玉帶，用八座大轎，抬於門首，馬步卒皆疾趨 而過，軍威嚴肅，莫可名狀。］

 

[William Hung]

Ngo seek gowng siu siu aah...

Nay hae bak qwai laaahh

Let's get back on topic. Post more pics of girls in hanfu pls.

personally I find some western clothes to be more superior, like bikini and mini skirt.

China should have a mix approach rather than just going back fully traditional. Girls from 1-17 should walk around in hanfu. Women from 18-35 should just walk around in bikini, or at least mini-skirts. Women over 35 should just wear Arab Burqa.

Pls write this request to your local cultural ministry.

 

[Andrei]

The existence of Xia Dynasty was not even 100% conformed, also if Zhou and Shang really did share the completely same culture, then why did Zhou people has to "變其俗革其禮". Besides Manchurian is/ was Chinese, Qing dynasty is even the first dynasty in Chinese history which firstly use the world "中國" as an official name of the whole country.

Any example of "abandoning advanced culture"?

Since when did Chinese science and technology was No1 in the world.
Guess who said this:

[中國人把所有的外國人都看作沒有知識的野蠻人，並且就用這樣的詞句來稱呼他們。他們甚至不屑 從外國人的書裡學習任何東西，因為他們相信只有他們自己才有真正的科學和知識。如果他們偶爾在他們的著述中有提到外國人的地方，他們也會把他們當作好像不 容置疑地和森林與原野裡的野獸差不多。甚至他們表示外國人這個詞的書面詞彙業和用於野獸的一樣，他們難得給外國人一個比他們加之於野獸的更尊貴的名稱。]


Can you even read 古文.

［金珠衣飾，書籍器皿，遍列通衢，其價甚賤。有錢買歸者，後獲大利。新太守張（按：張銚，偃 師人）住進士陳子龍宅。華亭縣陳鑑、海防楊之易，即忠臣楊漣長子，時雖剃髮，猶漢人衣冠，烏紗大帶，不改舊服也。餘以丁艱，不與科試，兼欲告閒，而同袍之 告退者不一人。學師欲索重價，餘以力綿中止。九月十三日，督鎮李成棟點驗各兵，餘與曹馳尹儒冠往觀之。李尚烏紗玉帶，用八座大轎，抬於門首，馬步卒皆疾趨 而過，軍威嚴肅，莫可名狀。］

it seems you are against chinese. and we just tell the history, and do revival chinese own traditional costume, it is none business of you, if you don´t like it, then just keep silence. no one will say you are a dumb. And we talk about modern china, and culture revival, why you mislead others into history ?

 

[sahaliyan]

The existence of Xia Dynasty was not even 100% conformed, also if Zhou and Shang really did share the completely same culture, then why did Zhou people has to "變其俗革其禮". Besides Manchurian is/ was Chinese, Qing dynasty is even the first dynasty in Chinese history which firstly use the world "中國" as an official name of the whole country.

Any example of "abandoning advanced culture"?

Since when did Chinese science and technology was No1 in the world.
Guess who said this:

[中國人把所有的外國人都看作沒有知識的野蠻人，並且就用這樣的詞句來稱呼他們。他們甚至不屑 從外國人的書裡學習任何東西，因為他們相信只有他們自己才有真正的科學和知識。如果他們偶爾在他們的著述中有提到外國人的地方，他們也會把他們當作好像不 容置疑地和森林與原野裡的野獸差不多。甚至他們表示外國人這個詞的書面詞彙業和用於野獸的一樣，他們難得給外國人一個比他們加之於野獸的更尊貴的名稱。]


Can you even read 古文.

［金珠衣飾，書籍器皿，遍列通衢，其價甚賤。有錢買歸者，後獲大利。新太守張（按：張銚，偃 師人）住進士陳子龍宅。華亭縣陳鑑、海防楊之易，即忠臣楊漣長子，時雖剃髮，猶漢人衣冠，烏紗大帶，不改舊服也。餘以丁艱，不與科試，兼欲告閒，而同袍之 告退者不一人。學師欲索重價，餘以力綿中止。九月十三日，督鎮李成棟點驗各兵，餘與曹馳尹儒冠往觀之。李尚烏紗玉帶，用八座大轎，抬於門首，馬步卒皆疾趨 而過，軍威嚴肅，莫可名狀。］

Manchus were not Chinese before 1644 AD,but after 1644,Emperor Shunzhi became Chinese emperor,then Manchus became Chinese.
In Manchu language,in Qing dynasty records,they called their country as Dulimbai gurun simply meas China,in ROC era,the Xibes of Xinjiang call ROC as Dulimbai irgen gurun,irgen means people.

 

[Andrei]

Go read some books,Shang and Zhou are culturally distinct,though the Zhou adopted plenty from the Shang.

Zhou Wuwang,Qin Shihuang,Han Gaozu,Tang Taizong,Song Taizu and the Hongwu emperor all won Tianxia through the shedding of blood the Qing are no different.

Blame the Confucian tradition instead of whining about the Manchus,many who supported Empress Dowager Cixi were Han.


There's also portraits of Qianlong wearing Hanfu is this all in his mind?

Give me quotes that the Qing banned Hanfu for the average man and women.

so you want to try deny "剃发易服"? you want quotes? ok, i will show you lots

The existence of Xia Dynasty was not even 100% conformed, also if Zhou and Shang really did share the completely same culture, then why did Zhou people has to "變其俗革其禮". Besides Manchurian is/ was Chinese, Qing dynasty is even the first dynasty in Chinese history which firstly use the world "中國" as an official name of the whole country.

Any example of "abandoning advanced culture"? I can give you an example of how the advanced astronomy of Yuan was abandoned by its successor:

[中國曆法，本不及外國之精密，以故前元欽天監外，又有回回欽天監，本朝亦設回回司天監，有正儀大夫、司朔大夫、司元大夫等官。至洪武三十一年而廢之，以其 教歸並之，欽天但用彼國土板曆同算，久之則法亦不驗，與中士無異矣。國初，學天文有厲禁，習曆者遣戍，造曆者殊死。至孝宗弛其禁，且命徵山林隱逸能通曆學 者以備其選，而卒無應者。近年因日食分數不相符，督責欽天，但唯唯謝罪，以世學歲久無他術為解。而士大夫中，如參政刑雲鷺輩，俱精於天文，刻有成書，皆雲 勝僧一行及郭守敬諸人矣。然未曾用之推測也。禁中大榼輩，又自有內靈台，專司星象，其職任，其學業，大抵與外庭仿佛，皆土圭中糟粕耳。自利瑪竇入都，號精 象數，而士人李之藻等皆授其業，似當令兼領天文，如先朝儒臣童軒華湘等可也。]

Since when did Chinese science and technology was No1 in the world.
Guess who said this:

[中國人把所有的外國人都看作沒有知識的野蠻人，並且就用這樣的詞句來稱呼他們。他們甚至不屑 從外國人的書裡學習任何東西，因為他們相信只有他們自己才有真正的科學和知識。如果他們偶爾在他們的著述中有提到外國人的地方，他們也會把他們當作好像不 容置疑地和森林與原野裡的野獸差不多。甚至他們表示外國人這個詞的書面詞彙業和用於野獸的一樣，他們難得給外國人一個比他們加之於野獸的更尊貴的名稱。]


Can you even read 古文.

［金珠衣飾，書籍器皿，遍列通衢，其價甚賤。有錢買歸者，後獲大利。新太守張（按：張銚，偃 師人）住進士陳子龍宅。華亭縣陳鑑、海防楊之易，即忠臣楊漣長子，時雖剃髮，猶漢人衣冠，烏紗大帶，不改舊服也。餘以丁艱，不與科試，兼欲告閒，而同袍之 告退者不一人。學師欲索重價，餘以力綿中止。九月十三日，督鎮李成棟點驗各兵，餘與曹馳尹儒冠往觀之。李尚烏紗玉帶，用八座大轎，抬於門首，馬步卒皆疾趨 而過，軍威嚴肅，莫可名狀。］

so just check how westerns documentry said, bbc and american discovery said.
Chinese invented gun, canon, rocket, missile, crossbow #1