The Thorn in the Garden | Terrorism in Indo-Pak relations.

[noname1]

I don't see any real hope of progress or change, lets be realistic, on the average you have a population of low average intelligence indoctrinated by a fanatical religion, taught from birth the idea of jihad against non muslims and other muslims with whom they disagree is normal. Then you add to that 1500 years of inbreeding that has caused a tremendous number of physical and psychological disorders.

The only solution is going to be long term and very unlikely.
1. Stop inbreeding which will still take hundreds of years to undo the negative effects of last 1500 years.
2. Proper nutrition, health care and education of children until they become adults to allow proper physical and mental growth.
3. Religious re-education
4. A completely secular government.

 

[Fireurimagination]

The problem is some people in Pakistan think that India is weak and some hit and run acts here will weaken India's resolve, what these people require is a good spanking. Pakistani should make up their mind what they want peace or war and India should go ahead and give it to them. But alias when it come to war their leaders run to US/Saudi to save themselves.

 

[Spring Onion]

@jaibi

In my personal opinion the issues between India-Pakistan are NOT related to terrorism.

terrorism is lose phrase used by everyone for own interests. The issue between the two is fight for survival for Pakistan while hegemony dreams by India, mainly culminating into the word strategic interests.

Now the issue of rivalry can be solved in my opinion between the two ONLY if both realize the rights of others to have strategic interests and specially India must accept that Pakistan is an important passage for forwarding Indian strategic interests too along with big players.

Now what are these areas of interests' conflict:

1. Kashmir: This has to be solved one or the other BUT use of force by both is just a big leniency both are giving to outsiders (big powers), and I personally believe one day both India and Pakistan will be loser over Kashmir and Indian economic power as well any regional hegemonic dream will go 100 or years back if these outsiders decided to use Kashmir as suitable point to launch own interests. [For the time being they are busy at other fronts and engaging both India-Pakistan).

2. Reach-out to CARs: Now this is where Pakistan is a gateway to Afghanistan and the later is to CARs. In such scenario both try to use their influence through proxies though Pakistan has an edge due to immediate border with Afghanistan.

India must realize that it can not eat the cake by kicking Pakistan out of the way neither India kick Pakistan. Pakistan should realize that India needs him to reach CARs hence we do reserve the right to apply some conditions for protecting our interests.

3. NOW since both these cases concern each other hence we need to check the hurdles and roles.

A. over Kashmir: Both countries despite losses cant let Kashmir go hence both need to sit down and find a mutual solution. Now the solution can be find and almost was agreed upon BUT then there are some hurdles.

1. Opposition from Indian Hindu extremist groups: These groups know the fact that Kashmir is NOT their neither can be solved unless there is some neutral unbiased and realistic mutual agreement BUT These groups as well as their sympathisers are against any positive step also against any kind of peace talks.


2. Opposition from Pakistani army: Pakistan army and public are against one-sided solution though it can be agreed upon a mutual solution which is in benefit of all three that is India-Pakistan and Kashmiris.

3. opposition from Kashmiri groups: Now interestingly these the same native Kashmiri groups some of them who do NOT want a solution since selective siding with India as well as Pakistan in other words occasional siding with both are serving their vested interests. hence they don't want any permanent solution whereas common kashmiris are suffering.


Now its up to India Pakistan to workout a solution simple as that.

Regional hegemony by India is NOT possible neither this concept of big brother has any reality in this case therefore India must engage other smaller countries on equal footing.

take and give that's the solution. You cant get a solution by harming Pakistan on one hand and beating war drums and yelling the phrase "terrorism" since you yourself had justified such strategic moves against Pakistan in 71 as freedom fight. Hyderabad massacre is also justified by Indian Army.

Now its time all sides should shut up

The problem is some people in Pakistan think that India is weak and some hit and run acts here will weaken India's resolve, what these people require is a good spanking. Pakistani should make up their mind what they want peace or war and India should go ahead and give it to them.

NOT even "SOME" people take India as weaker.

We all believe that any misadventure by India will cost you as much harm as it will cause us.

as far as war is concerned its always Indians who beat war drums

 

[Fireurimagination]

@jaibi

In my personal opinion the issues between India-Pakistan are NOT related to terrorism.

terrorism is lose phrase used by everyone for own interests. The issue between the two is fight for survival for Pakistan while hegemony dreams by India, mainly culminating into the word strategic interests.

Now the issue of rivalry can be solved in my opinion between the two ONLY if both realize the rights of others to have strategic interests and specially India must accept that Pakistan is an important passage for forwarding Indian strategic interests too along with big players.

Now what are these areas of interests' conflict:

1. Kashmir: This has to be solved one or the other BUT use of force by both is just a big leniency both are giving to outsiders (big powers), and I personally believe one day both India and Pakistan will be loser over Kashmir and Indian economic power as well any regional hegemonic dream will go 100 or years back if these outsiders decided to use Kashmir as suitable point to launch own interests. [For the time being they are busy at other fronts and engaging both India-Pakistan).

2. Reach-out to CARs: Now this is where Pakistan is a gateway to Afghanistan and the later is to CARs. In such scenario both try to use their influence through proxies though Pakistan has an edge due to immediate border with Afghanistan.

India must realize that it can not eat the cake by kicking Pakistan out of the way neither India kick Pakistan. Pakistan should realize that India needs him to reach CARs hence we do reserve the right to apply some conditions for protecting our interests.

3. NOW since both these cases concern each other hence we need to check the hurdles and roles.

A. over Kashmir: Both countries despite losses cant let Kashmir go hence both need to sit down and find a mutual solution. Now the solution can be find and almost was agreed upon BUT then there are some hurdles.

1. Opposition from Indian Hindu extremist groups: These groups know the fact that Kashmir is NOT their neither can be solved unless there is some neutral unbiased and realistic mutual agreement BUT These groups as well as their sympathisers are against any positive step also against any kind of peace talks.


2. Opposition from Pakistani army: Pakistan army and public are against one-sided solution though it can be agreed upon a mutual solution which is in benefit of all three that is India-Pakistan and Kashmiris.

3. opposition from Kashmiri groups: Now interestingly these the same native Kashmiri groups some of them who do NOT want a solution since selective siding with India as well as Pakistan in other words occasional siding with both are serving their vested interests. hence they don't want any permanent solution whereas common kashmiris are suffering.


Now its up to India Pakistan to workout a solution simple as that.

Regional hegemony by India is NOT possible neither this concept of big brother has any reality in this case therefore India must engage other smaller countries on equal footing.

take and give that's the solution. You cant get a solution by harming Pakistan on one hand and beating war drums and yelling the phrase "terrorism" since you yourself had justified such strategic moves against Pakistan in 71 as freedom fight. Hyderabad massacre is also justified by Indian Army.

Now its time all sides should shut up



NOT even "SOME" people take India as weaker.

We all believe that any misadventure by India will cost you as much harm as it will cause us.

as far as war is concerned its always Indians who beat war drums

Solution is simple Pakistan should stop dreaming about Indian side of Kashmir and India should about Pakistan's side. Other than that if anybody thinks borders can be altered without fighting an all out war they can very well live in their la la land.

 

[jetti]

@jaibi

In my personal opinion the issues between India-Pakistan are NOT related to terrorism.

terrorism is lose phrase used by everyone for own interests. The issue between the two is fight for survival for Pakistan while hegemony dreams by India, mainly culminating into the word strategic interests.

Now the issue of rivalry can be solved in my opinion between the two ONLY if both realize the rights of others to have strategic interests and specially India must accept that Pakistan is an important passage for forwarding Indian strategic interests too along with big players.

Now what are these areas of interests' conflict:

1. Kashmir: This has to be solved one or the other BUT use of force by both is just a big leniency both are giving to outsiders (big powers), and I personally believe one day both India and Pakistan will be loser over Kashmir and Indian economic power as well any regional hegemonic dream will go 100 or years back if these outsiders decided to use Kashmir as suitable point to launch own interests. [For the time being they are busy at other fronts and engaging both India-Pakistan).

2. Reach-out to CARs: Now this is where Pakistan is a gateway to Afghanistan and the later is to CARs. In such scenario both try to use their influence through proxies though Pakistan has an edge due to immediate border with Afghanistan.

India must realize that it can not eat the cake by kicking Pakistan out of the way neither India kick Pakistan. Pakistan should realize that India needs him to reach CARs hence we do reserve the right to apply some conditions for protecting our interests.

3. NOW since both these cases concern each other hence we need to check the hurdles and roles.

A. over Kashmir: Both countries despite losses cant let Kashmir go hence both need to sit down and find a mutual solution. Now the solution can be find and almost was agreed upon BUT then there are some hurdles.

1. Opposition from Indian Hindu extremist groups: These groups know the fact that Kashmir is NOT their neither can be solved unless there is some neutral unbiased and realistic mutual agreement BUT These groups as well as their sympathisers are against any positive step also against any kind of peace talks.


2. Opposition from Pakistani army: Pakistan army and public are against one-sided solution though it can be agreed upon a mutual solution which is in benefit of all three that is India-Pakistan and Kashmiris.

3. opposition from Kashmiri groups: Now interestingly these the same native Kashmiri groups some of them who do NOT want a solution since selective siding with India as well as Pakistan in other words occasional siding with both are serving their vested interests. hence they don't want any permanent solution whereas common kashmiris are suffering.


Now its up to India Pakistan to workout a solution simple as that.

Regional hegemony by India is NOT possible neither this concept of big brother has any reality in this case therefore India must engage other smaller countries on equal footing.

take and give that's the solution. You cant get a solution by harming Pakistan on one hand and beating war drums and yelling the phrase "terrorism" since you yourself had justified such strategic moves against Pakistan in 71 as freedom fight. Hyderabad massacre is also justified by Indian Army.

Now its time all sides should shut up



NOT even "SOME" people take India as weaker.

We all believe that any misadventure by India will cost you as much harm as it will cause us.

as far as war is concerned its always Indians who beat war drums

Give BS thats all you do. first you guys have occupied 50% of JK and we have 50% . do you see india causing this kind of activities like you do in indian cities agains indian civilians?

 

[onionkiller]

NOT even "SOME" people take India as weaker.

We all believe that any misadventure by India will cost you as much harm as it will cause us.

as far as war is concerned its always Indians who beat war drums[/QUOTE]



India beats war drums ? are you ok ? who start Kargil ? India never start a war, it was Pakistan who always start war. even today Indian army fighting with pakistan sponser terrorist. and be realstic. without end of support to terrorists, peace cant be achieved.

 

[Fireurimagination]

NOT even "SOME" people take India as weaker.

We all believe that any misadventure by India will cost you as much harm as it will cause us.

as far as war is concerned its always Indians who beat war drums

We don't harbor and use terrorism as state weapon, we don't resort to ceasefire violation to push terrorist, we don't carry out misadventures like kargil and more. IA is probably 5x time more powerful than PA but stills behaves responsibly. (which I believe is a mistake, IA should be more aggressive)

 

[Spring Onion]

Solution is simple Pakistan should stop dreaming about Indian side of Kashmir and India should about Pakistan's side. Other than that if anybody thinks borders can be altered without fighting an all out war they can very well live in their la la land.

The main issue is that there is NO indian side of Kashmir.

We don't harbor and use terrorism as state weapon, we don't resort to ceasefire violation to push terrorist, we don't carry out misadventures like kargil and more. IA is probably 5x time more powerful than PA but stills behaves responsibly. (which I believe is a mistake, IA should be more aggressive)

nice fiction.

LTTE

Mukti bahini / BLA etc etc all points to Indian State terrorism

 

[hindutva_in_motion]

pakistan can never have kashmir. If there is going to be no peace, or another 10 wars because of kashmir, I am ok with this. as long as india does not compromise over kashmir, it will be okay.

 

[Fireurimagination]

The main issue is that there is NO indian side of Kashmir.

Actually there is NO pakistani side of Kashmir. See, so keep on dreaming and burn your house down to the ground while trying to set fire to your neighbor's house.

nice fiction.

LTTE

Mukti bahini / BLA etc etc all points to Indian State terrorism

So you can use terrorism we can't? And the way things are going I guess repeat of 71' is not too far away. I would love to see a 26/11 type attack on some 5 star hotel in karachi, suicide bombers are available a dime a dozen in pakistan anyday.

We can either continue with the cr@p or think rationally and give peace a chance

 

[onionkiller]

for all sweet pakistani friends who dream about kashmir =

Year 102013: One among the four
parts of erstwhile Pakistan is still
demanding Kashmir from India, at
least right to control the erstwhile
Azad Kashmir region

 

[Fireurimagination]

They way India's military strength is growing in 5-10 years time I guess India won't have second thoughts about going ahead and snatching p0k.

 

[noname1]

I don't think any sane country would want Pakistan, its not worth the trouble, as far as Kashmir is concerned I can see many muslims and all non muslims not wanting to live under a religious Islamic government like Pakistan, at least not any sane person.

 

[sovcomflot]

They way India's military strength is growing in 5-10 years time I guess India won't have second thoughts about going ahead and snatching p0k.

The problem this time is not pakistan ,its how PLA will react. If PLA opens a front to support pakistan ,then India's really done for.

 

[AHAM BRIHMASMI]

Well, writer has invested pretty good efforts, in researching and putting together facts. But alas ! he has seen everything through pakistani lenses.
The root of all problem is, Pakistan think everything according to religion. Its claim over Kashmir is solely on one thing, religion. They should get it clearly that even if Pakistan was created for muslims, India was not created for Hindus only, so they can not take every muslim majority state, only because they were created for muslims, India is a secular country, so It has every reason to merge/accede any religious majority state (including muslim because it is also for muslims) but pakistan can not merge other states which are not muslims. The peace in south asia depends only and only upon Pakistan. It has nothing to do for that purpose, only has to forget about its false claims based on religion.(take it for sure, religion, specially islam, can never be a logic for creation of a state, no matter what has been written in your books). India has never interfered into internal matters of Pakistan except a tit for tat reply. and giving kashmir on the base of its religion is not a solution. Because many parts of india are muslim majority and christian majority, the logic of giving them out only arise when india will say that it is not a country for their religion.
YE AESA HI HAI KI JAIBI BHAI AAKAR MERE DARWaJE KE SAMNE SHOR MACHANE LAG JAYE KI JAB TAK MAI UNKO APNE GHAR ME SE KUCHH HISSA NAHI DE DUNGA TAB TAK JHAGRA JARI RAHEGA. AB MAI KYA KAR SAKTA HU ? YA TO HISSA DE DU, ( FIR TO DHEERE DHEERE WO EK AADH MAHINE ME AAKAR SHOR MACHANE LAGENGE AUR EK DIN WO PURA GHAR UNKA HO JAYEGA, YA KI MAI UNKO PAHLI BAAR HI SAKHTI KE SATH MANAA KAR DU.
India has taken the second option, denying it first time.