Thar Block II Unearths Coal.

[The Accountant]

Well, coal is no doubt a precious resource if used properly. We are living in 21st century and coal can be used for a lot of value added products. Coal can be used to for making carbon fibre and many chemicals... that are high in demand and sold at a much higher price than burning it for power production. BTW today wind energy is cheaper per unit than coal produced power and this technology is widely available in the world. Coal based power production is not only expensive but it is highly polluting and especially in Pakistan where the total forest cover is smaller than 2% of its land and suffering from lack of water and clean air, it will be devastating. Furthermore, we have alternate resources with are more abundant, cheap and very clean. We need to build dams and generate power from it and similarly we have ample wind and solar resource. I'm afraid that some bastard politicians will use this coal discovery an excuse to obstruct the construction of the dams.

From where did you get that wind energy is cheaper ... WInd energy is one of the most expensive, ,, even expensive than oil ...

 

[war&peace]

From where did you get that wind energy is cheaper ... WInd energy is one of the most expensive, ,, even expensive than oil ...

No..

 

[The Accountant]

Not Electricity Bro But Fuels Diesel Gasoline Jet Fuel Etc.

Imagine Diesel And Petrol At Under $30 Per Barrel When The International Price Is Above $70 Per Barrel.Massive Savings Plus Our Exports All Off A Sudden Become Cost Competitive

These things might be tried in future as these technologies are still at infancy stage ,,, right now immediate issue is electricity ...

No..

Your source ?

Furthermore, there is nothing cheaper than using internal source as all the cost being incurred is circulated within the economy and is generating jobs opposed to other porjects like solar and wind where the cost is mainly transferred oustide for procurement of plants and hence eventually it has a negative impact on economy in comparision to locally fueled power generation ...

 

[war&peace]

These things might be tried in future as these technologies are still at infancy stage ,,, right now immediate issue is electricity ...



Your source ?

Furthermore, there is nothing cheaper than using internal source as all the cost being incurred is circulated within the economy and is generating jobs opposed to other porjects like solar and wind where the cost is mainly transferred oustide for procurement of plants and hence eventually it has a negative impact on economy in comparision to locally fueled power generation ...

Air is free and Pakistan does not need to import air at all.

 

[The Accountant]

Air is free and Pakistan does not need to import air at all.

yes but the plants that convert air energy into electricity are imported and conversion efficiency is very low ... so actual cost per unit is higher .,.. Its not an analysis that I am sharing but based on some actual numbers bro ...

 

[ghazi52]

GASIFICATION OF COAL

Gasification processes can be divided into three major classes: entrained-flow, fluidized-bed, and moving fixed-bed. All involve operating pressures up to several hundred psi. For entrained-flow systems, powdered coal is generally first gasified with a mixture of steam and oxygen (or air) in a zone where the main part of the molten slag is collected. The high-temperature products require quenching or cooling prior to cleanup, with resulting loss of thermal efficiency. Entrained-flow gasification systems produce little methane, are relatively compact, and, in-bed limestone for sulfur capture is proposed, but hot gas desulfurization is also being considered. Because of the relatively long residence times and limitation on reactor diameter, moving fixed-bed units have lower coal throughput than is achieved with fluidized-bed units. Commercial moving bed gasifiers have capacities in the 800 to 1,000 tons/day range.

The Shell, Destec, and Texaco high-temperature entrained-flow gasifiers have a single-train capacity, resulting from the small coal particle size and high operating temperature, of up to 2,000 tons of coal/day, corresponding to about 265 MW of electricity. The high-temperature Winkler circulating fluidized-bed system planned for the European KoBra demonstration after the year 2000 has a planned capacity of about 300 MW using brown coal. To date, Lurgi fixed-bed units have a lower capacity than do entrained-flow units. This difference in capacity is subject to change with further development.

 

[ziaulislam]

Fantastic news. Please no "coal is bad" posts. It is but almost every developed country on earth has used coal to stand up and then when fully developed to begin diversifing about alternatives. The single biggest reason Pakistan has lagged behind India in heavy industry is the crippling lack of natural resources, in prticular iron and coal. I think only Japan has managed to stand up without having vast reserves of both.

Everywhere else where coal/iron was found adjacent to each other, South Yorkshire, UK. Ruhr, Germany, Saar, France. Pittsburg, USA. Donbas, Russia heavy industry took root. Even in India the Jamshedpur works are sited in the Indian coal/iron belt where the Tata family began their operations and now has become a giant.

every DEVELOPED COUNTRY STILL uses coal
i think untill you hit 50% of coal usage you are doing justice, as it should be the developed country who shoud say no to caol but they are still using at full capacity

Well, coal is no doubt a precious resource if used properly. We are living in 21st century and coal can be used for a lot of value added products. Coal can be used to for making carbon fibre and many chemicals... that are high in demand and sold at a much higher price than burning it for power production. BTW today wind energy is cheaper per unit than coal produced power and this technology is widely available in the world. Coal based power production is not only expensive but it is highly polluting and especially in Pakistan where the total forest cover is smaller than 2% of its land and suffering from lack of water and clean air, it will be devastating. Furthermore, we have alternate resources with are more abundant, cheap and very clean. We need to build dams and generate power from it and similarly we have ample wind and solar resource. I'm afraid that some bastard politicians will use this coal discovery an excuse to obstruct the construction of the dams.

really depends upon labour cost and location, in pakistan wind and solar are still more expensive not despite full incentives given to both

earlier upfront tarrif of coal is around 6 cents vs 10 cents for wind, solar is even more expensive

than there will be an issue of baseload

From where did you get that wind energy is cheaper ... WInd energy is one of the most expensive, ,, even expensive than oil ...

some european countries its cheaper due to high taxation of fossil fuel, high cost of labour versus zero taxes on renewable sources

the only thing that can compete coal in cost (long term cost) is newer nuclear plants that have very high upfront cost but 50 years cost is similar
everything else is expenisve, solar is also reaching there especially if thye are build in house but is still expenisve

 

[The Accountant]

every DEVELOPED COUNTRY STILL uses coal
i think untill you hit 50% of coal usage you are doing justice, as it should be the developed country who shoud say no to caol but they are still using at full capacity


really depends upon labour cost and location, in pakistan wind and solar are still more expensive not despite full incentives given to both

earlier upfront tarrif of coal is around 6 cents vs 10 cents for wind, solar is even more expensive

than there will be an issue of baseload


some european countries its cheaper due to high taxation of fossil fuel, high cost of labour versus zero taxes on renewable sources

the only thing that can compete coal in cost (long term cost) is newer nuclear plants that have very high upfront cost but 50 years cost is similar
everything else is expenisve, solar is also reaching there especially if thye are build in house but is still expenisve

Agreed, except that teriff for wind was 13 cents fews year back ,,, Are you sure its 10 cents ? Solar used to be 23 cents 8 years back but now reduced substantially due to reduced cost of solar cells but still very expensive ...

Furthermore , 6 cent cost of coal is based on imported coal, on local coal it will not only be cheaper but will generate jobs as well

 

[ziaulislam]

Agreed, except that teriff for wind was 13 cents fews year back ,,, Are you sure its 10 cents ? Solar used to be 23 cents 8 years back but now reduced substantially due to reduced cost of solar cells but still very expensive ...

Furthermore , 6 cent cost of coal is based on imported coal, on local coal it will not only cheaper but will generate jobs as well

13 cents for first 5 years i think than drops to 10 cents
with competitive bidding it can brought down to 8ish i think
coal is 5-6 cents, imported is around 7 cents
LNG is around 7-8cents
local gas is 3cents, govt hydros are around 2 cents
hydro is around 8-10rs(private investment)
furnace oil around 13
diesel is around 20
solar was very expensive due to corruption involved in quaid-i-azam park it think it was around 18cents

 

[The Accountant]

13 cents for first 5 years i think than drops to 10 cents
with competitive bidding it can brought down to 8ish i think
coal is 5-6 cents, imported is around 7 cents
LNG is around 7-8cents
local gas is 3cents, govt hydros are around 2 cents
hydro is around 8-10rs(private investment)
furnace oil around 13
diesel is around 20
solar was very expensive due to corruption involved in quaid-i-azam park it think it was around 18cents

My figures are almost same ... by the way from where did you get this accurate info ? are you related to energy sector ?

 

[Indus Pakistan]

every DEVELOPED COUNTRY STILL uses coal

Agreed. Historically Pakistan has lagged in use of coal. Over 40% of Indian energy comes from coal.

Compare to Pakistan which only used 6% from coal.

If Pakistan adopted coal like India it would free up 26% of the gas reserves which could supply homes, industry and even CNG vehicles thus reducing the expensive oil imports by a significant margin.

 

[Samlee]

These things might be tried in future as these technologies are still at infancy stage ,,, right now immediate issue is electricity ...

Beg To Differ B'Coz Coal To Chemical Technologies Go All The Way Back To Nazi Germany Infact Before The Rise Of Oil It Was Coal That Powered The Industrial Revolution

13 cents for first 5 years i think than drops to 10 cents
with competitive bidding it can brought down to 8ish i think
coal is 5-6 cents, imported is around 7 cents
LNG is around 7-8cents
local gas is 3cents, govt hydros are around 2 cents
hydro is around 8-10rs(private investment)
furnace oil around 13
diesel is around 20
solar was very expensive due to corruption involved in quaid-i-azam park it think it was around 18cents

Quaid E Azam Solar Was Rs 22 Per Unit Corruption???? It Was Daylight Robbery Man

 

[Clutch]

No..

References??

 

[The Accountant]

Beg To Differ B'Coz Coal To Chemical Technologies Go All The Way Back To Nazi Germany Infact Before The Rise Of Oil It Was Coal That Powered The Industrial Revolution




Quaid E Azam Solar Was Rs 22 Per Unit Corruption???? It Was Daylight Robbery Man

Yes but every mine has diferent requirement due to different conditions different chemical composition ... We have to work on it and design machines as per our specific requirements which is a time taking exercise ...

For your understanding few of the variabkes to be considered ..

Specific heat value
Sulfur content
Depth
Water availablity
Environmental matters such as temperature

 

[war&peace]

really depends upon labour cost and location, in pakistan wind and solar are still more expensive not despite full incentives given to both

earlier upfront tarrif of coal is around 6 cents vs 10 cents for wind, solar is even more expensive

than there will be an issue of baseload

@The Accountant @Clutch

The calculated costs per kWh of wind-generated power, as a function of the wind regime at the chosen sites, are shown in Figure 1.8. As illustrated, the costs range from approximately 7-10 c€/kWh at sites with low average wind speeds, to approximately 5-6.5 c€/kWh at windy coastal sites, with an average of approximately 7c€/kWh at a wind site with average wind speeds.