Taliban Bhutto: Unsanction Taliban & Help Them Build a Professional Military

BilaLOL says we need to help them build a military capable of taking on terrorist threats. He also said to unsanction them.

Yet more proof, that contrary to the faujeets, nakami league cultists & other general morons here who blamed Pak's pro-IEA policy on iMrAn nIAzI, it's actually state policy. So no, your wet dreams of your army going in & teaching them a lesson will remain wet dreams.

Best you delusional twats realize that not even your establishment thinks it's worth stirring a hornet's nest. Only way forward is through continuous engagement.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1627244032815517697

https://twitter.com/x/status/1627244057821958144

 

[Olympus81]

Anjuman ki shakal dekh le koi.

 

[S.Y.A]

Taliban Bhutto, good name keep spreading it.

he is not a bhutto. taliban zardari is better.

 

[nahtanbob]

I will say this in a blunt way but if you want to occupy any area you'd have to kill any locals lmao otherwise you will simply deal with an ongoing insurgency. Let me remind you America just left from there after facing 20 years of insurgency.

forceful occupation should only be spoken about if you are willing to commit acts of genocide...

on the top of annexation... wakhan corridor would work better, but it's actually logically easier if tajikistan annexes it which automatically connects us with them

what makes you think China is going to allow it ?

 

[TNT]

All the games of this evil establishment. And the most funny and astonishing part is that this evil establishment is actually mullah and supports mullah . Mullah have destroyed both Pakistan and Afghanistan society.
A very close military guy once said to me. Raat ko whisky pee kay, subha jihaad ka lecture dete hein ye log.

 

[FuturePAF]

As I have said in other threads, Pak has to play the long game. My rant was mainly to make it clear that this nonsense of blaming PTI for “pro”-IEA policies of 2021 muddles the fact that the estb ALSO was & is in agreement with them. So stop playing politics.

The reality is that an Afg gov that is demonstrably pro-Pak is almost completely impossible for now. However, the reality is that state believes IEA ruled Afg is a much better prospect for the following reasons:

1) TTP insurgency was supported by the ethnonats as well. Nothing has changed in this regard.

2) We have more leverage on IEA than the republic. IEA depends on us at the end of the day. The republic didn’t. For better or worse, no one other than us will present their case.

3) ”Islamic” Taliban is better than republic b/c they can’t use ethnic narrative to separate KPK from Pak. Even TTP is, on the surface at least, not a separatist org.

4) Eventually Afg will become more moderate. Might not be like Saudi but it’s almost certain they will. With that, support for a supposedly religious insurgency will also die out. All Pak has to do is contain it & let its flame burn out.

5) Vast majority of pro-IEA Pakistanis only supported them b/c of fight against US. They wont be so kind once the guns are turned on them. Pro-IEA zeal will also naturally decrease since there’s no demonstrable enemy like the US. also, they’ll observe IEA struggle in reconciling modern realities with their version of Sharia & just general governance.


Pakistan has the following goals for Afg:

1) Peace & Stability
2) Recognition of Border
3) Prevent Afg soil to be used against it & others

Pakistan has multiple ways to accomplish this

1) Economic
Make Afg economy depend on well being of ours. Allow them to export (low or no tariffs) to us even if it means competition for our rent seekers. For our part, sell them the industrial goods or raw materials they need Needless to say, sort out the border visa & clearance issues. Bad behaviour results in closing the border and/or temp increase in tariffs.
Build a rail line and/or pipeline from/to Central Asia & allow them to collect any transit fees.
Get the great powers to invest in Afg (mining seems the best bet for now)
Encourage tourism b/w the countries

Unfortunately, building economic ties may help keep them in check but it won’t reduce hostility.

2) Military
Train their officers. Obtain their loyalty to us if possible. Same way Americans do it.
Give their soldiers CT training.
Sell CT equipment. Have monitoring teams to ensure TTP doesn’t obtain them.
Offer joint mil & intel Ops against ISKP in return for help against TTP. Get them to target pro-ISKP factions of TTP to create mistrust b/w the 2.

3) Media
In reality, THIS should have been Pakistan’s main focus. Fund pro-Pak journalists & org. Create documentaries, books, etc which include Pak version of events & promote them in Afg.

4) Form something similar to EU or SCO with Afg plus other Muslim countries.
This way they will be forced by treaties to help fight TTP. Furthermore, the presence of non-Afghans will suppress Afghan ethnonats & generally reduce Afghan influence since Pak is almost certainly going to be the core of the alliance.

I agree, Economic (transit trade and mining) is indeed the best way forward to stabilizing our relationship, and the way to carve out our niche in the global order

 

[Indos]

Never interfere in other nation domestic politics. Lesson for Pakistan.

 

[Menace2Society]

I agree, Economic (transit trade and mining) is indeed the best way forward to stabilizing our relationship, and the way to carve out our niche in the global order

No if TTP don't disband and durrand line is not declared as a hard border.

How can you conduct business with a country that doesn't even recognize your borders. Have some self respect.

 

[FuturePAF]

No if TTP don't disband and durrand line is not declared as a hard border.

How can you conduct business with a country that doesn't even recognize your borders. Have some self respect.

You’re right, this is the best time as any to lay down the right terms for the relationship. Afghanistan hasn’t been so unified since the days of the king, and the Afghans have no other international recognition.

We aren’t going to get much out of delaying the core issue between the two countries, and I’m sure the afghans don’t want us social engineering their society or work with their other elements to de facto enforce the issue.

So, I agree, we have to make a core demand for good relations that they must recognize the Durand line as the border. They need us more than we need them. We also need to fortify the western border and fund our FC and police to level to destroy the TTP once and for all, as well as prevent smuggling, which the afghans depend upon.

It’s a good thing no country recognized them in haste, you’re right, we can’t give up our leverage cheaply. We must extract a hard bargain for our recognition, for which we will pay a price internationally, and for them will be the first step toward global recognition.

On my earlier post, once we have this understanding, mining and transit trade can be the economic foundations to sustain the relationship, and make it in both countries interests to maintain stability and prevent spoilers.

 

[Meengla]

Durand Line is not an issue! Afghans simply cannot accept the DL but they know the reality that it is impractical to claim parts of Pakistan; on the contrary, given a choice, the DL would move westward. Which insane Afghan, given a choice, would decide to live in Afghanistan vs Pakistan?? Pakistan had almost total peace with Afghanistan until the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan and Pakistan's involvement in that American proxy war; all the years, from 1947 till into 1980s, except for some frictions/diplomatic spats, the DL was not an issue.
What needs to happen is that there is education, peace and economic gains in Afghanistan even if under the Taliban rule. That's the 'long game' for Pakistan. Time will sort it out!!!

 

[SoulSpokesman]

@Meengla @Menace2Society

How about an out of the box solution to the Durand Line issue- seek a confederation of Pak and Afghanisatn? That was Ch Rahmat Ali's original vision, no?

Makes AFG viable, provides PAK strategic depth.

Regards

 

[Menace2Society]

@Meengla @Menace2Society

How about an out of the box solution to the Durand Line issue- seek a confederation of Pak and Afghanisatn? That was Ch Rahmat Ali's original vision, no?

Makes AFG viable, provides PAK strategic depth.

Regards

I will tell you what will happen if this goes ahead.

Aggressive Afghan pashtuns will dominate the softer Pakistani pashtuns and will go straight for Baluchistan and trigger a civil war, even though its Afghans who are fighting but the world will see it as a civil war. The only way this would work is if Pakistan ethnically cleanses the Afghan pashtuns and absorbs Afghanistan and mines whatever it is in those mountains.

 

[EternalMortal]

No if TTP don't disband and durrand line is not declared as a hard border.

How can you conduct business with a country that doesn't even recognize your borders. Have some self respect.

DL is a non-issue. Even if they don’t officially recognize it, it doesn’t matter. The reality is that afghans cannot change the border. We practically have de facto recognition of it. Consider the fact that with the issue of fencing, the Taliban aren’t claiming it should not be there but they take issue with the precise location of some parts of the border. They also attempt to get visas to enter Pakistan. That right there implies that Afghans have an understanding that there is a border.
If you’re still not convinced, then see my previous post on how to deal with them. Like it or not, you can’t just build a fence & then try to ignore their existence. Afghans are an issue that must be solved otherwise it’ll keep coming back to bite us. In which case, best to take a pragmatic & long term approach.

I will tell you what will happen if this goes ahead.

Aggressive Afghan pashtuns will dominate the softer Pakistani pashtuns and will go straight for Baluchistan and trigger a civil war, even though its Afghans who are fighting but the world will see it as a civil war. The only way this would work is if Pakistan ethnically cleanses the Afghan pashtuns and absorbs Afghanistan and mines whatever it is in those mountains.

Afghans Pashtuns can’t dominate Pakistani ones. Their aggressiveness mainly consists of them running their mouths to hide their inferiority complex. When it comes to an actual fight they always lose.

Also see this:

4) Form something similar to EU or SCO with Afg plus other Muslim countries.
This way they will be forced by treaties to help fight TTP. Furthermore, the presence of non-Afghans will suppress Afghan ethnonats & generally reduce Afghan influence since Pak is almost certainly going to be the core of the alliance.