Taimur SLV - Pakistan

[kurup]

Just as your brahmos is 100% Russian, the only thing indian about brahmos is it's name, not even the paint is indian.

Just because your missile are made , painted and transported to you as aid by China that doesnot mean everybody is following your path..

why indian always starts showing their GHATIA PAN in every thread related to Pakistan' achievments.

Make some achievment first , then we can talk about ghatia pain

 

[MadDog]

@ Punit .... the answer to your question is in my previous comment...Ghauri, Ghaznavi and Abdali were Pushtuns..since Pakistan has 28-30 million Pushtuns (second biggest ethnic group in Pak) ...thats why Pakistan uses their names for missles....anything else.

@ octupus...

Dude look at Ra'ad..how the hell that missile is related to china...its an air launched crusie missile .... you guys don't have it thats why start to BS about Pak missiles....

The tech know how for early ballistic missiles was obtained from North Korea for Ghauri..even Iran got it for Shahab series of missiles..not the missiles themselves...and then Pakistani scientists made their own series of Shaheen missiles too.

 

[PakShaheen79]

Just because your missile are made , painted and transported to you as aid by China that doesnot mean everybody is following your path..

If you cannot live with the reality that Pakistan has a very successful and comprehensive missile program that does not mean everybody is following your path.

Make some achievment first , then we can talk about ghatia pain

That is the problem ... achievement doesn't matter for you guys but trolling starts in every Pakistan related threats. Else we all knnow about super duper Indian achievements in defense sectors.

 

[The Deterrent]

The Shaheen-1 (Hatf-4) is probably a copy of China's M-9 missile. The Shaheen-2 (Haft-6) is probably a copy of China's two-stage missile M-18.
The Shaheen-2 uses like the M-18, two aerospace solid rocket motors developed by China Hexi Chemical & Mechanical Company. A relevant motor for the first stage is the L-SpaB-140B with diameter of 1.40 m.

FACTS (according to GlobalSecurity and Missilethreat):

Shaheen-1 is 2.9 m longer and carries 200 kg heavier payload to 150 km more distance than the M-9 (DF-15). Furthermore,Shaheen-I has a launch weight of 9500 kg as compared to 6200 kg of M-9 (DF-15).

The M-18 is a two stage missile and has a range of 1000 km with a max payload of 500 kg.
So strictly speaking,Shaheen-2 carries twice the payload to 2.5 times longer range.


@ All Indians, with due respect, get your facts right. Please consult other sources too other than the usual BS fed by the so-called "authentic" sources before alleging Pakistan of importing and painting.

Source: http://www.defence.pk/forums/pakist...-missiles-indigenous-content-development.html

@ Topic

The Pakistani SLV is in early stages of development. Since NDC has the expertise of designing the launch motors of missiles like Shaheen-II and Shaheen-III, most probably the whole SLV project will be undertaken by NDC. SUPARCO will work on the satellite/payload.

However, we might see a massive upgrade to Shaheen-II and/or the new Shaheen-III this year.

 

[The Deterrent]

Because they have exhausted the list. Have they used Abdali already?

Yes, Abdali has been used

 

[SOHEIL]

FACTS (according to GlobalSecurity and Missilethreat):

Shaheen-1 is 2.9 m longer and carries 200 kg heavier payload to 150 km more distance than the M-9 (DF-15). Furthermore,Shaheen-I has a launch weight of 9500 kg as compared to 6200 kg of M-9 (DF-15).

The M-18 is a two stage missile and has a range of 1000 km with a max payload of 500 kg.
So strictly speaking,Shaheen-2 carries twice the payload to 2.5 times longer range.


@ All Indians, with due respect, get your facts right. Please consult other sources too other than the usual BS fed by the so-called "authentic" sources before alleging Pakistan of importing and painting.

Source: http://www.defence.pk/forums/pakist...-missiles-indigenous-content-development.html

@ Topic

The Pakistani SLV is in early stages of development. Since NDC has the expertise of designing the launch motors of missiles like Shaheen-II and Shaheen-III, most probably the whole SLV project will be undertaken by NDC. SUPARCO will work on the satellite/payload.

However, we might see a massive upgrade to Shaheen-II and/or the new Shaheen-III this year.

PIC ???

 

[The Deterrent]

PIC ???

It is under-development, and the project exists for sure.

No picture available for now, so since no proof is there to verify that Shaheen-III is even there, you are free to dispose off the information.

 

[Desert Fox]

To the funny bharati trolls claiming Pakistan only paints its "imported" missiles, FYI Pakistan produces them inhouse through its own indigenous manufacturing as well as research and development capabilities, how else would we be able to make so many upgrades and improved Missiles, some of which have never been seen before in any country. The recent Shaheen-1A did include MIRV technology, along with other ABM countermeasures, otherwise what's the point in testing the old Shaheen-1 variant in response to a indian ICBM launch?


Pakistan Seeks To Counter Indian ABM Defenses

ISLAMABAD - In response to India's pursuit of missile defenses, Pakistan has expanded its countermeasure efforts, primarily through development of maneuvering re-entry vehicles. The Army Strategic Forces Command, which controls Pakistan's ballistic missiles, has since at least 2004 said it wanted to develop such warheads; analysts now believe these are in service.

Mansoor Ahmed, lecturer at the Department of Defence and Strategic Studies at Islamabad's Quaid-e-Azam University, said that in addition to maneuverable warheads, multiple independently targetable re-entry vehicles (MIRVs) may be developed to stay ahead of India's "multilayered ballistic-missile defense system" and potential future countermeasures.

"This, coupled with submarine-launched, nuclear-tipped cruise missiles, would ensure the survivability of its nuclear deterrent and enhance the effectiveness of its missile force that can beat any Indian defenses," he said.

When asked about the threat posed by India's anti-ballistic missile (ABM) program, Harsh Pant, reader of international relations at the Defence Studies Department, King's College London, said it depended on the capability India eventually acquired.

"Many in India see an Indian missile defense capability as the only effective way to counter what they consider as Pakistan's 'nuclear blackmail,'" he said.

He cited the ongoing conflict in Kashmir, the 1999 Kargil conflict and the November 2008 Mumbai terror attacks as examples.Strategic Disadvantage These incidents "demonstrated for many the inability of India to come up with an appropriate response to the stability-instability paradox operating on the subcontinent that has put India at a strategic disadvantage vis-à-vis Pakistan."

He further explained, "A missile defense system would help India blunt Pakistan's 'first use' nuclear force posture that had led Pakistan to believe that it had inhibited India from launching a conventional attack against it for fear of its escalation to the nuclear level. With a missile defense system in place, India would be able to restore the status quo ante, thereby making a conventional military option against Pakistan potent again."Such a missile defense system and a second-strike capability "would enhance the uncertainties of India's potential adversaries, regardless of the degree of effectiveness of missile interception, and would act as a disincentive to their resort to nuclear weapons," he said.

Asked whether Pakistan's countermeasures would be effective against such ABM systems, Pant replied, "most definitely."

He said, "According to various reports, Pakistan has been developing MIRV capability for the Shaheen-II ballistic missiles and [the] Shaheen-III missile is under development."

He also explained there was a further danger for India in Pakistan's countermeasure efforts.

"Although the current capability of Pakistani missiles is built around radar seekers, the integration of re-entry vehicles would make these extremely potent and defeat the anti-ballistic missile defense systems. This would be especially true of Indian aircraft carriers that would become extremely vulnerable," he said.

While measures to maintain the credibility of the land-based arm of the deterrent may prove to be adequate, the security of the future sea-based arm of the nuclear triad is not as clear-cut.

Analysts have for years speculated that the Navy will equip its submarines with a variant of the Babur cruise missile armed with a nuclear warhead. However, whether a cruise-missile-based arm of the nuclear triad at sea would be effective and survivable in the face of Indian air defenses is uncertain.

The Soviet Union developed a counter to the BGM-109 Tomahawk nearly 30 years ago in the form of the MiG-31 Foxhound, which had a powerful look down/shoot down radar and a potent missile system. The Indian Air Force claims its Su-30MKI Flanker has similar capabilities.

When this was put to analyst Usman Shabbir of the Pakistan Military Consortium think tank, he said the interception of cruise missiles is not so simple."I think Babur will form the sea-based arm of the Pakistani nuclear deterrent" he said, "but the problem in targeting subsonic cruise missiles is that they are harder to detect due to their lower radar cross-signature, low-level navigation, and use of waypoints to circumvent more secure and heavily defended areas."

"By the time you detect them, there is not much time left to vector aircraft for interception."

However, Shabbir conceded it would be possible for an airborne interceptor to shoot down a missile like Babur. "An aircraft already on [patrol] might be lucky to pick it up on its own radar well in advance [if looking in the correct direction], or vectored to it by ground-based radar."




Pakistan's growing nuclear programme

By Syed Shoaib Hasan BBC News, Karachi


Pakistan's first nuclear reactor was established with help from the United States in 1965 during the regime of military dictator Gen Ayub Khan.

Gen Khan's protege and then foreign minister, Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto, was the driving force behind the programme, which was based at Nilore near Islamabad.

It was set up under the Atoms for Peace programme initiated by President Dwight D Eisenhower.

At the time it was strictly peaceful and intended to help meet Pakistan's civilian energy needs under the supervision of the International Atomic Energy Agency.

A few years later Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto became prime minister. He launched a nuclear weapons programme in 1974 as India and Pakistan competed in a new South Asian arms race.

Codenamed Project 706, Pakistan's plan to enrich its own uranium was conceived and led by Munir Ahmed Khan, a brilliant US-trained nuclear and electronics engineer.

He was joined a year later by a name that is now synonymous with Pakistan's nuclear programme - Dr Abdul Qadeer Khan.

It was Dr Khan - later disgraced for transferring technology to Iran and Libya - who was instrumental in setting up Pakistan's first nuclear enrichment plant at Kahuta near Islamabad.

Project 706 thus became Kahuta Research Laboratories, where enriched uranium for Pakistan's first nuclear weapon was produced.

Pakistan is believed to have developed a nuclear device by 1984, when Dr Khan alluded to it in an interview with a Western journalist.

Since then Pakistan's nuclear power complex has undergone a rapid expansion.
Dr Abdul Qadeer Khan, the founder of Pakistan's nuclear program is shown in this March 19, 1998 file photo. Dr Abdul Qadeer Khan developed Pakistan's nuclear bomb

The organisation in charge is the Pakistan Atomic Energy Commission (PAEC), which is headed by a civilian nuclear physicist or engineer.

It operates eight fuel production and enrichment facilities, three mining concerns and one heavy water production facility.

The original bomb was a small uranium device with about the power of those the US dropped on the Japanese cities of Hiroshima or Nagasaki.

It was unwieldy and could only be launched from a bomber specially fitted for the purpose.

But Pakistan has made rapid advances since then - it is now said to have 70-90 weapons in its stockpile.

Many of these have been miniaturised to be mounted on ballistic missiles with ranges of more than 2,000km (1,245 miles), bringing many Indian cities within reach.

China is believed to have played a critical role in Pakistan's nuclear programme, and is said to have helped it manufacture many of its weapons.

Nuclear weapons development and advancement in Pakistan is primarily done by PAEC with Chinese collaboration, reports say.

Western officials believe that long-range missile technology was also acquired from North Korea in the 1990s - in exchange for Pakistani help with its nuclear programme.

Meanwhile, proliferation experts believe Pakistan continues to make rapid strides in the development of uranium enrichment facilities and its weapons development complex.

Work has been proceeding rapidly on the construction and expansion of plants in Chasma and Sihala.

Pakistani engineers, with help from the Chinese, are also said to be in the advance stages of developing MIRV technology for its missiles. This would allow the military to fit several warheads on the same ballistic missile and then launch them at separate targets.

Security

PAEC has hundreds - perhaps a few thousand at most - civilian employees working directly for it. An exact figure is not available. They include scientists and engineers, as well as technicians and other support staff.
Pakistani ballistic missile Babur or Hatf VII being test fired at an undisclosed location in Pakistan on Thursday, March 22, 2007. Pakistan is thought to have acquired missile technology from North Korea

In all, tens of thousands of security and other personnel are thought to work in Pakistan's nuclear complex.

Because of security concerns all PAEC staff are said to be thoroughly screened by Pakistan's intelligence services.

These have been expanded to include checks on any sort of connection to extremist religious organisations.

Post-9/11, several Pakistanis scientists were arrested for alleged links to al-Qaeda.

While most of them were released after several months of interrogations, additional scrutiny is now given to all serving and prospective employees, intelligence officials say.

Pakistan denies this is under pressure from the US, but concerns from the country's largest investor carry a lot of weight here.

The weapons themselves are then transported and stored by the Strategic Plans division of the army.

In recent times, they have been kept at depots all over the country. Some are said to be near the main air bases, while others are outside the purview of any sort of inquiry.

Pakistan's army remains secretive about the locations of its weapons - although US officials have openly said they believe they are in safe hands.

In the last few years US technical experts are said to have provided training for the Pakistanis on safe nuclear storage procedures and facilities.

The Americans are also believed to have provided $100m (£64m) to be used to enhance the security of Pakistan's nuclear stockpile.



Pakistan Pushes To Improve Missile Strike Capability

ISLAMABAD - Pakistan is continuing efforts to increase the range, accuracy and lethality of its ballistic missiles while gradually switching from liquid- to solid-fueled propellants.

According to P.I. Cheema, head of the Islamabad Policy Research Institute think tank, who last year co-edited "Ballistic Missiles and South Asian Security," these efforts are sparked by the Indian threat.

"The driving force behind the program is basically India," he said. "Basically, throughout the Indo-Pak standoff, Pakistan has always been striving for parity or a qualitative edge, given the disparity we have in terms of numbers. Continuous improvisation is required to ensure the system works and remains valid, so you have to continuously update your systems."

A ballistic missile arsenal is necessary to maintain a national deterrent. The close geographical proximity of India and Pakistan would also make surprise attacks with conventionally armed missiles highly effective.

It is widely believed Pakistan obtained at least some missile-related know-how from abroad to initiate its efforts. The solid-fueled Chinese M-11 and liquid-fueled North Korean No Dong, plus associated technologies, are widely regarded to have formed the building blocks of the Pakistan program.

This has resulted in the Ghauri and Shaheen series of medium- to intermediate-range ballistic missiles. The established development/deployment pattern has seen the simpler liquid-fueled Ghauri series initially fielded, followed by the more advanced, solid-fueled Shaheen.

Liquid-fueled missiles require a longer logistics train (due to having to separately transport the fuel) and take hours to fuel, but they have performed a vital stopgap function. In this way, the 1,500-kilometer range Ghauri-I formed a stopgap until supplemented by the 750-kilometer range Shaheen-I, and then replaced by the 2,300 kilometer Ghauri-II.

With the deployment of the 2,500-kilometer Shaheen-II, development has shifted to the proposed 3,500- to 4,000-kilometer range Ghauri-III, which will be eventually replaced by the envisioned 4,000- to 4,500-kilometer Shaheen-III.

Strike at a Safe Distance

Pakistan needs such ranges so it can strike any targets within arch-rival India at a safe enough distance from the Indo-Pak border.

These increases in range have been achieved by using more efficient fuel or rocket motors, reducing the weight of the payload and simply incorporating additional stages. More ambitious advances involve the quest to increase accuracy by moving away from inertial navigation guidance systems to ones like GPS, and possibly developing multiple warhead technology.

According to defense analyst Usman Shabbir, the main force behind advances in the missile program is the National Engineering and Scientific Commission (NESCOM) defense conglomerate and its subsidiary, the National Defence Complex (NDC).

"NESCOM has been quietly and steadily refining its missile designs with special emphasis on more precision and greater range and warhead capacity," he said. "Work on MIRV [multiple independently targeted re-entry vehicle] warheads is ongoing and might be fielded in the near future on the Shaheen-II ballistic missile system.

"NESCOM is also working on new guided missile projects and in some cases helping other Pakistani research facilities with theirs. One such example was the recently tested air-launched cruise missile RAAD, developed by AWC [Air Weapons Complex] in collaboration with NESCOM," Shabbir said.

Pakistan has also developed a range of solid-fueled battlefield and short-range ballistic missiles to target high-value targets such as airfields, headquarters, troop concentrations, and ammunition and supply depots. The 290-kilometer-range Ghaznavi closely resembles the Chinese M-11 (of which Pakistan is said to have received a number in the early 1990s), and there is a possibility it is a variant of the same missile.

The 180-kilometer-range Abdali, however, is a development of Pakistan's initial indigenous efforts to develop a missile capability, the Hatf-1/1A, dating from the 1980s. These missiles can be armed with a range of conventional or nonconventional warheads.

Though the liquid-fueled missiles will eventually be retired, they may yet form the basis of a satellite-launch capability. They are ideal for such purposes because of the comparatively higher thrust they deliver.

However, Arshad Siraj, the secretary of Pakistan's national space agency, the Space and Upper Atmosphere Research Commission, said, "At this point in time, there is no such program, though it of course would be in the long-term planning of any space agency to have this capability. Perhaps this will happen, but definitely not within the next 10 years."

This is within the timeframe of retiring the Ghauri system and developing it to launch satellites.


Pakistan Reportedly Develops Capability for Multi-Warhead Missiles

"25 May 2002
Pakistan announces that it will test a new series of short- and intermediate-range ballistic missiles at the Tilla Range; the missiles that will be tested are nuclear capable. During the test, each missile will carry a payload equivalent to the weight of a nuclear warhead. The missiles will be fired toward sea-based targets, and space-based satellites will be used to compile the results of the data generated during the tests. According to Pakistani sources, Pakistan has acquired the capability to produce "multi-independent re-entry vehicles (MIRV) that can deliver three to seven bombs over an area of 80,000 square kilometers. A Pakistani government spokesperson announces that several countries including India, Iran, and the United States have been given prior notification of the tests. [Note: The claim about MIRVs cannot be verified independently.]
&#8212;"Pakistan Reportedly Develops Capability for Multi-Warhead Missiles," BBC Monitoring International Reports, 25 May 2002; in Lexis-Nexis Academic Universe, 25 May 2002, <http://web.lexis-nexis.com>; Rahul Bedi, "Pakistan Tells India It Will Test Its Missiles Today," Irish Times (Dublin), 25 May 2002, City Edition, World News, p. 13; in Lexis-Nexis Academic Universe, 25 May 2002, <http://web.lexis-nexis.com>."



Shaheen-1A upgrades

Shaheen 1A

On 25 April 2012, Pakistan successfully test-launched an upgraded Shaheen I called Shaheen 1A. Like the US naming of the Pershing 1 and 1A, Pakistan has named both missiles as Shaheen 1 and 1A respectively. The features of the Shaheen 1A are similar to the United States MGM-31 Pershing 1A. The military said in a statement that the Shaheen 1A is a medium-range ballistic missile.[5] It is an improved version of the Shaheen 1 with better accuracy and double the range of its predecessor.[6]

The Pakistani military initially did not publicly reveal the range of the missile which lead to media speculation of the true range of the missile. The missile is also equipped with maneuverable reentry vehicle warheads designed to evade missile defense systems.[7] The speed of the Shaheen 1A also provides an extremely high impact speed for nearby targets, enabling it to avoid any anti-ballistic missile defenses that may develop in the immediate region. A western official in Islamabad mentioned that the Shaheen 1A missile seems to have an improved ability to strike at its targets. It also has a more powerful engine, which means that it travels at scramjet speeds and can strike at longer distances than Shaheen-1.[8]

On 25th April 2012, the ISPR revealed more information about the missile. The missile weight is approximately 10,000 kg, slightly heavier than its predecessor and can carry either a single 1000kg warhead or be MIRVed with between 3 to 5 nuclear warheads weighing between 200-300 kg each.[9] In addition, the Shaheen IA primarily contains sophisticated automated refueling and advanced stealth technology features that were not present in its previous version to avoid detections from radars. Even Pakistani radars could not track the missile after it was launched. All three Shaheen missiles, Shaheen I, Shaheen 1A and Shaheen II are reportedly equipped with the latest PSAC (Post-Separation Attitude Correction) system. This is a unique feature which consists of small thrusters that can adjust the warhead trajectory for greater accuracy and evading anti-ballistic missile defence systems. The features of the missile could also serve as a testbed of features which could be implemented on the yet to be deployed Shaheen III which could potentially have a range of 4500km.[10][11]

Shaheen-I - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


NASR Battlefield Range BM (BRBM):


A few details of Nasr, gleaned from overt sources; it is akin to a guided artillery shell in the form of Surface to Surface Missile (SSM). The Soviets had developed and used various types of such missiles as a propellant and heavily fortified fixed installation target clearance weapon system in the battlefield. Nasr however can successfully target armoured and mechanized columns on the move with nearly pinpoint accuracy. Judging from the test flight video released, Nasr appears to follow a depressed trajectory rather than typical ballistic trajectory which makes a lethal combination, when married to the high maneuverability, high speed and short range; which will cause nightmares and throw a challenge to any Anti Ballistic Missile system.

Pakistan: Plugging the Cold Start gap | Opinion Maker
Important facts to note:

Pakistan has been able to miniaturize n-u--cce warheads (proof for this is the NASR battlefield BM).

Pakistan tested re-entry vehicle on Shaheen-1A.

Pakistan incorporated evasive counter measures as well as maneuverable re-entry vehicle into its latest Missiles.


This is the NASR battlefield range BM, it also has evasive maneuvering and can be seen changing course in this video:

Pakistan's Nasr Battlefield Range Ballistic Missile - YouTube

Here is the latest Variant of the NASR BRBM with multi-tube TeL:

Pakistan tests new short-range nuclear missile - YouTube

This is the launch of the latest Shaheen-1A intermediate range BM, notice its speed has been improved over the previous variant as well as a few physical changes:

Video: Pakistan test fires nuke-capable ballistic missile Shaheen-1A - YouTube

 

[IND151]

taimur a mangol warrior do pakistan has any hero from its own land or just use imported name for imported missles

kindly avoid words like in bolded part

 

[The Deterrent]

To the funny bharati trolls claiming Pakistan only paints its "imported" missiles, FYI Pakistan produces them inhouse through its own indigenous manufacturing as well as research and development capabilities, how else would we be able to make so many upgrades and improved Missiles, some of which have never been seen before in any country. The recent Shaheen-1A did include MIRV technology, along with other ABM countermeasures, otherwise what's the point in testing the old Shaheen-1 variant in response to a indian ICBM launch?

No, Shaheen-IA is a single stage SRBM of range no more than 1000 km. It cannot carry MIRVs, since the weight of the ReV is just 700kg. Even the present Shaheen-II cannot deliver MIRVs, because its payload capacity is 1050kg.
Pakistan is developing MIRVs, but for the longer range missile, such as the proposed Shaheen-III. IMO, the missile should be able to deliver a payload of 1500 kg (for 3 reasonably effective MIRVs), along with counter-measures.

 

[Desert Fox]

No, Shaheen-IA is a single stage SRBM of range no more than 1000 km. It cannot carry MIRVs, since the weight of the ReV is just 700kg. Even the present Shaheen-II cannot deliver MIRVs, because its payload capacity is 1050kg.
Pakistan is developing MIRVs, but for the longer range missile, such as the proposed Shaheen-III. IMO, the missile should be able to deliver a payload of 1500 kg (for 3 reasonably effective MIRVs), along with counter-measures.

But aren't we were able to produce small enough payloads like for example the NASR, can't we fit 3-4 of those in a single Shaheen II?

I'm no missile expert, I'm only basing my info off of the sources i quoted, which IMO, seem pretty reliable.

BTW, MIRV's only for a much longer range variant? Doesn't make sense since our current missiles can hit any target within india so wouldn't it make sense to MIRV those?

 

[Pakistanisage]

taimur a mangol warrior do pakistan has any hero from its own land or just use imported name for imported missles

The first Mughal King Zaheeruddin Babar was a descendent of Taimoor ( Timor ). So in a way Taimoor is not foreign to us.

 

[acetophenol]

there is no info sir because we get it on rent from India and can,t figure out how to test it so when we found the start button we will surely give official statement as far as now plzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz spare us plzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

Ok. I'll wait.

Does Suparco has any links with the development of missiles or are they separate institutions?

 

[Juice]

Help me out here, how do you Iranians and pakistanis test for range? Do you have ranges at near max range, or do short-fires and extrapolate, or just fire into international waters with ships near the predicted impact?

 

[acetophenol]

If we have TRUE leadership , Pakistan even in this situation is a country which is able to pull a finger right in the face of anyone upon any action let alone an SLV.

True. The problems that India and pakistan is facing now isn't really a problem if we consider our potentials. All these can be wiped away in one go if we have a able govt. As long as we have nutcase govt. and leaders,along with citizens who choose to do nothing,we'll continue this way.
Btw,i can't agree with your opinion about western world.